Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Formerly Allan in MD said: Yes, it's simple. With the caveat, I think last year should have been a red flag to McBeane that the guys who look best in preseason, may not be the guys who are best when it counts. 42 minutes ago, Tcali said: none 29 minutes ago, without a drought said: How much should it matter? The correct response is none. If you guys mean the correct response is keep NONE of the 5'8" WR, including Beasley, McKensie, and McCloud - wouldn't that mean Beane's player e v a l is horridly incorrect?
prissythecat Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 8 minutes ago, offyourocker said: Is 5’11” to 6’ really a range? Shhh, don’t tell the OP that the difference between those two heights one inch .
formerlyofCtown Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 3 hours ago, Tsaikotic said: From what I've read, Beane and McD originally were trying to go with big possession receivers like KB...they ended up changing the plan after watching how Allen plays, so now they want basically what Bangarang said "guys with speed that can get open and catch the ball"...I think they'll go with 1 or maybe 2 WR's in the KB style, like Duke on the roster right now...although I have never seen Duke play so I really have no idea if he can move and get open or not He is always open, even when covered.
without a drought Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 48 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: With the caveat, I think last year should have been a red flag to McBeane that the guys who look best in preseason, may not be the guys who are best when it counts. If you guys mean the correct response is keep NONE of the 5'8" WR, including Beasley, McKensie, and McCloud - wouldn't that mean Beane's player e v a l is horridly incorrect? No I actually mean, when you start chasing size in receivers versus talent, it gets you in trouble. 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 21 hours ago, Tsaikotic said: the way I usually look at it is this: Bills usually keep 1 or 2 players amongst 3 different positions that primarily play ST - DB, WR and RB...This year I don't think they use the RB spot which leaves WR and DB...I think they'll go with 6 or 7 WR with 1 of them being Roberts...this means they might not be able to keep the 6 or 7 DB's they sometimes do, they might have to settle with 5 or 6...Roberts can put the team in some great position next season with his return skills...plus he returns both punts and kickoffs which would save from having to put a starting player in those positions... Several times last season, we wound up playing a DB out of position because of not dressing enough McDermott is a ST [edit: I meant secondary] coach at heart. Unless the WR coach has been puckering up to the "Blarney Stone" and can make a persuasive case, I just can't see him shorting the DB spots on the roster in favor of WR. Roberts looks like a great add at a position of need. He's been durable - played 16 games last 3 seasons - but man, at 31? Can he keep it up?
White Linen Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 What I think would be interesting is to see what the trends are with the CB market. We all remember when tall receivers started becoming all the rage and that was because they were all such a mismatch for smaller corners. Then corners started getting taller and then the trend to smaller WR's became the successful ones. I'm not sure where we are at now with the numbers - but I think I'd try to stay in the opposite trend of CB's.
Phil The Thrill Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 4 hours ago, tomur67 said: Right now we have 4 wr's in the range of 5' 8-5'9". Beasley is 5'8", Bolden 5'8", McKenzie 5'8", McCloud 5'9". 5 wr's in the range of 5'11" - 6'0". Brown is 5'11", Roberts 5'11", Easley 5'11", Phillips 6;0", Scott 6'0" 4 wr's in the range of 6'2" -6'4". Foster is 6'2", Jones 6'2". Williams 6'3", Sills 6'4" Obviously, talent, motivation, etc. are the most important considerations , but can you keep 3 or 4 of the 5'8" on the roster? You make a very good point here. I remember Brandon Beane talking about how they look at WR in camp last year. He said the goal is to have a group that compliments themselves and that you don’t want to have the same types of WR on your roster. It really make you wonder if the bigger WR’s on the roster like Williams or Sills might have an advantage over a position group that already has a few smaller receivers 20 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Several times last season, we wound up playing a DB out of position because of not dressing enough McDermott is a ST coach at heart. Unless the WR coach has been puckering up to the "Blarney Stone" and can make a persuasive case, I just can't see him shorting the DB spots on the roster in favor of WR. Roberts looks like a great add at a position of need. He's been durable - played 16 games last 3 seasons - but man, at 31? Can he keep it up? I would agree. I remember last year everyone assumed that the Bills would keep 6, and sure enough they kept 5 on opening day. I can’t see them keeping 6 WR’s on the roster and some tough cuts will need to be made
Saxum Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 26 minutes ago, formerlyofCtown said: He is always open, even when covered. He is right in what film I have seen. Reminds me of what they said on Hogan - always open.
Simon Says Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 3 hours ago, JustWinPlease said: I'll always take the biggest and fastest guys. I'd rather have 5 Robert Fosters, than 5 Cole Beasleys. I think it comes down to Foster, Jones, Brown, Beasley, Williams, Sills and McKenzie. (The fact that Andre Roberts will probably take a WR spot and never play WR is really annoying...that takes a spot from someone more talented.) Roberts has like 250 catches in his career so he is a guy with receiving ability 3 hours ago, JustWinPlease said: I'll always take the biggest and fastest guys. I'd rather have 5 Robert Fosters, than 5 Cole Beasleys. I think it comes down to Foster, Jones, Brown, Beasley, Williams, Sills and McKenzie. (The fact that Andre Roberts will probably take a WR spot and never play WR is really annoying...that takes a spot from someone more talented.) I think it is too early to give Sills a roster spot
Florida Bills Fanatic Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 5 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: The game has changed IMO. The days of the big physical receivers are over. The rules have taken away the physicality of the DBs. The name of the game now is separation and speed. Antonio Brown and OBJ are the new prototypes. For the most part, I agree with you. The biggest exception is down close in the red zone. Space is restrictive and throws over the top or the corner fade are still major weapons in the end zone.
Toesy Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 Maybe somebody mentioned this but both Williams and Sills show that ability to climb up and catch the ball up high-so even though they are only listed 1-2 inches taller than Jones they play taller-this is a big deal because very few corners are tall.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 4, 2019 Posted May 4, 2019 5 hours ago, without a drought said: No I actually mean, when you start chasing size in receivers versus talent, it gets you in trouble. I agree with that!
Kirby Jackson Posted May 5, 2019 Posted May 5, 2019 50 minutes ago, Florida Bills Fanatic said: For the most part, I agree with you. The biggest exception is down close in the red zone. Space is restrictive and throws over the top or the corner fade are still major weapons in the end zone. I don’t know that’s a low percentage play. If you look at the TD totals last year Antonio Brown, Davante Adams and Tyreke Hill were the top 3 WRs. All of them are separation guys.
Augie Posted May 5, 2019 Posted May 5, 2019 Height is one of many factors. We need to build a WR corps that is a nice blend of all the critical qualities. I’m just glad that it has to be better than last year (TE’s included). The question is........who wins the competition? Draft is over (loved it!), can’t wait for the games to begin!
Thurman#1 Posted May 5, 2019 Posted May 5, 2019 12 hours ago, Bangarang said: You keep whoever gets open and catches the ball. This is pretty much it. It's nice if you have one guy who can jump and catch a fade, but some shorter guys do that well with body positioning and blocking out. You don't absolutely need even one tall guy, but it doesn't hurt to have guys with a variety of talents and abilities.
Buffalo Junction Posted May 5, 2019 Posted May 5, 2019 3 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: I don’t know that’s a low percentage play. If you look at the TD totals last year Antonio Brown, Davante Adams and Tyreke Hill were the top 3 WRs. All of them are separation guys. Adams is a freak at jump balls. The other factor to consider is how he and Brown manage to catch balls outside of the field of play while keeping their feet in bounds. They have elite concentration and body control.
Kirby Jackson Posted May 5, 2019 Posted May 5, 2019 2 hours ago, Buffalo Junction said: Adams is a freak at jump balls. The other factor to consider is how he and Brown manage to catch balls outside of the field of play while keeping their feet in bounds. They have elite concentration and body control. All of this sounds like a justification for why they need to be taller. Separation matters 2
Buffalo Junction Posted May 5, 2019 Posted May 5, 2019 38 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: All of this sounds like a justification for why they need to be taller. Separation matters Taller? How? AB is 5’10”. Davante Adams is 6’1”. OBJ (who I mentioned earlier) is 5’11”... All three reliably win contested catches. I agree that separation matters. I’m saying that body control coupled with attitude and vertical matter more than height. Literally, guys with average to short height can out perform a lot of the tall guys on contested catches if they possess other elite traits. Just for future reference... I’ll put out a prediction for future reference. Deebo Samuel and AJ Brown will be better than DK Metcalf and Hakeem Butler with contested catches and YAC. AJ and Deebo own the ball... Attitude and body control.
NoSaint Posted May 5, 2019 Posted May 5, 2019 16 hours ago, whatdrought said: Yes, this. But I think you do need to look at a diversity of skills. If there’s someone who can consistently win jump balls, you might value that over two smaller guys who have similar play styles Meh. It’s a matchup league and some games that may help, others it will hurt when the opponent has a corner that’s a bit slower but super physical and good at 50-50 balls but would’ve lost to a shiftier wr. Ultimately from what I’ve seen is that max talent put in good positions wins much more than forcing your GM to fill precise roles. you stack talent and slightly look towards matchups in the division for tie breaks like that.
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