Social Security running out of money and time

[Uncle Joe]

14 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Of course you are. Everyone is from time to time. I was just curious, and looking for an honest debate. While we’re on the subject of social security, I’d actually be in favor of lifting the cap so that high wage earners pay into it for even their highest earnings. I’ve been told that one change would make the system substantially more solvent. I’d also like to see them raise the retirement age by one month every year for the next twelve years. That too would ease or eliminate the shortfall. 

Interesting article from The Motley Fool (not to be confused with.some other fools here )
https://www.fool.com/retirement/2017/01/28/81-years-of-social-securitys-maximum-taxable-earni.aspx

 

[Q-baby!]

4 minutes ago, Keukasmallies said:

 

Aha, so abortion has killed [pun intended] social security's raw material.  If only we'd tumbled to this "fact" sooner we could have resolved the whole social security kerfuffle.  Possibly Planned Parenthood will be the Democrats next investigation target, eh?

Probably why the Bills and Sabres have not won championships as well. 

[B-Man]

It is easy to glean from the posts above, the main reason why we have not addressed the impending Social Security bankruptcy.

 

Anyone who puts forth any plan to address the problem will be viciously attacked as someone who wants to "kill SS" ,  who "hates grandma", and mostly, someone who only "favors the rich".

 

The Left and the media (but I repeat myself) have made their bed, the new rules are in place, and we have an impotent legislative process here in the U.S. as a result.

 

 

 

 

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Edited May 3, 2019 by B-Man

[Tommy Callahan]

1 hour ago, Tiberius said:

Yes. And I also realize that the tax cuts don't pay for themselves

how is the federal revenue?  dropping?

 

 

[Tiberius]

2 minutes ago, Chris farley said:

how is the federal revenue?  dropping?

 

 

It's rising, why? 

 

Hows the deficit? Rising? 

[3rdnlng]

28 minutes ago, Chris farley said:

how is the federal revenue?  dropping?

 

 

Well, if revenue were to increase I guess that would mean that the deficit would go down, unless spending increased more than revenue increased.

[\GoBillsInDallas/]

Our government needs to deal with things that are FAR more important than social security:

 

https://nypost.com/2019/05/02/new-york-bill-would-allow-kids-to-run-lemonade-stands-without-a-permit/

 

 

[DC Tom]

15 minutes ago, \GoBillsInDallas/ said:

Our government needs to deal with things that are FAR more important than social security:

 

https://nypost.com/2019/05/02/new-york-bill-would-allow-kids-to-run-lemonade-stands-without-a-permit/

 

 

 

That's good, because that's probably how I'm going to be spending my Social Security years.  

[Uncle Joe]

25 minutes ago, DC Tom said:

 

That's good, because that's probably how I'm going to be spending my Social Security years.  

Now that Walmart has canned their greeters what else is there? ?

[snafu]

58 minutes ago, DC Tom said:

 

That's good, because that's probably how I'm going to be spending my Social Security years.  

 

Sour and extra sour?

 

 

[Koko78]

11 minutes ago, snafu said:

 

Sour and extra sour?

 

 

 

I would suspect he will have 'sour', 'extra sour', and 'you're a ***** idiot' flavors.

 

The latter, of course, will be his best seller.

[snafu]

1 minute ago, Koko78 said:

 

I would suspect he will have 'sour', 'extra sour', and 'you're a ***** idiot' flavors.

 

The latter, of course, will be his best seller.

 

I think he gives out the idiot flavor for free.

 

 

 

 

[Chef Jim]

 There are several ways to help.  I originally said fix but not sure about fixing it. 

 

1.  Education, education, education.  If kids knew  about saving, budgeting, investing, planning and what just a few hundred dollars a month investing could do we'd not have so many people relying on SS as their main source of retirement income.  Then we could reduce the payout and eventually the taxation.  Less reliance on others is always good for the whole.  

2.  Increase the age at which Social Security could be taken.  Get rid of accessing SS at 62.  So many people take it early and with life expectancy rising at 62 the taxpayers can be on the hook for 40 years!

3.  Raise the full retirement age.  The full retirement age for born after 1960 which is most of us here is 67.  They need to look at increasing FRA for those born after a certain year.  Maybe 70?   

4.  Potentially raising or eliminating the income cap on contributing to SS.  My issue with that is why should there not be a cap on contributions if there is a cap on payout at the other end.  So I'm not certain about this one.

5.  Increase the contribution limits for IRA.  Most have access to 401k's but those that don't can only contribute $6k/$7k. That's peanuts for many.

6.  Increase the contribution limits for Roth IRA's. For those maxing out 401k's and want more tax efficient ways of saving for retirement why not?

7.  Euthanize dumb people.  This one actually would solve the problem in a few short years.  ?

8.  And lastly educate educate educate.

 

 

Edited May 4, 2019 by Chef Jim

[3rdnlng]

22 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

There are several ways help.  I originally said fix but not sure about fixing it. 

 

1.  Education, education, education.  If kids knew  about saving, budgeting, investing, planning and what just a few hundred dollars a month investing could do we'd not have so many people relying on SS as their main source of retirement income.  Then we could reduce the payout and eventually the taxation.  Less reliance on others is always good for the whole.  

2.  Increase the age at which Social Security could be taken.  Get rid of accessing SS at 62.  So many people take it early and with life expectancy rising at 62 the taxpayers can be on the hook for 40 years!

3.  Raise the full retirement age.  The full retirement age for born after 1960 which is most of us here is 67.  They need to look at increasing FRA for those born after a certain year.  Maybe 70?   

4.  Potentially raising or eliminating the income cap on contributing to SS.  My issue with that is why should there not be a cap on contributions if there is a cap on payout at the other end.  So I'm not certain about this one.

5.  Increase the contribution limits for IRA.  Most have access to 401k's but those that don't can only contribute $6k/$7k. That's peanuts for many.

6.  Increase the contribution limits for Roth IRA's. For those maxing out 401k's and want more tax efficient ways of saving for retirement why not?

7.  Euthanize dumb people.  This one actually would solve the problem in a few short years.  ?

8.  And lastly educate educate educate.

 

 

Include mandatory Life Insurance classes in High School.

[Chef Jim]

Just now, 3rdnlng said:

Include mandatory Life Insurance classes in High School.

 

Covered under planning in my first bullet point.  

[RochesterRob]

20 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

There are several ways help.  I originally said fix but not sure about fixing it. 

 

1.  Education, education, education.  If kids knew  about saving, budgeting, investing, planning and what just a few hundred dollars a month investing could do we'd not have so many people relying on SS as their main source of retirement income.  Then we could reduce the payout and eventually the taxation.  Less reliance on others is always good for the whole.  

2.  Increase the age at which Social Security could be taken.  Get rid of accessing SS at 62.  So many people take it early and with life expectancy rising at 62 the taxpayers can be on the hook for 40 years!

3.  Raise the full retirement age.  The full retirement age for born after 1960 which is most of us here is 67.  They need to look at increasing FRA for those born after a certain year.  Maybe 70?   

4.  Potentially raising or eliminating the income cap on contributing to SS.  My issue with that is why should there not be a cap on contributions if there is a cap on payout at the other end.  So I'm not certain about this one.

5.  Increase the contribution limits for IRA.  Most have access to 401k's but those that don't can only contribute $6k/$7k. That's peanuts for many.

6.  Increase the contribution limits for Roth IRA's. For those maxing out 401k's and want more tax efficient ways of saving for retirement why not?

7.  Euthanize dumb people.  This one actually would solve the problem in a few short years.  ?

8.  And lastly educate educate educate.

 

 

  Good points but I will say the following.  Put off instant gratification.  I see too many people driving around in 50,000 plus dollar vehicles where the average pay is minimum wage in many places in WNY.  I don't care if it is leased.  They are still most likely paying 500 bucks per month once the money down and the monthly installment are figured in.  The flip side is many get a rough start to life.  Pretty hard to put money aside if all your income goes into the basics.  Also, I will always encourage people to push towards a goal but will realize the area hospital can only absorb so many recent grads of nursing, lab, etc..  Education needs to be in the classroom but I never hear a niece or nephew talk about how they learned to put together a monthly budget or balance a checkbook.

[Chef Jim]

5 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  Good points but I will say the following.  Put off instant gratification.  I see too many people driving around in 50,000 plus dollar vehicles where the average pay is minimum wage in many places in WNY.  I don't care if it is leased.  They are still most likely paying 500 bucks per month once the money down and the monthly installment are figured in.  The flip side is many get a rough start to life.  Pretty hard to put money aside if all your income goes into the basics.  Also, I will always encourage people to push towards a goal but will realize the area hospital can only absorb so many recent grads of nursing, lab, etc..  Education needs to be in the classroom but I never hear a niece or nephew talk about how they learned to put together a monthly budget or balance a checkbook.

 

Again that all falls under the heading of Education.  Teaching budgeting and the challenges of credit will help with this. 

 

We can add to the list of doing something about the cost of college.  And no I don't mean have me (Jim Taxpayer) fund your little Johnny's college.  You had him YOU pay for it.  I'm looking at more of the slow demise of the brick and mortar school and go towards more online classes.  The ability to scale up with that approach would make a college education extremely affordable.  This will have kids starting their first job without the burdensome debt they have now and give them the ability to save.  

[Bob in Mich]

 

I would recommend getting disability insurance too.  My recollection was that it was a pretty tiny cost and one just never knows when an accident or debilitating health problem could strike.  We all take on debt - college, cars, homes, etc - with the idea that we have the earning power to easily repay but one day, that earning power could unexpectedly disappear.

 

Regarding Social Security, the often forgotten point is that SS is essentially a safety net program.  I understand the fairness argument regarding the income cap but that sort of ignores the safety net aspect of SS.  The very wealthy really don't need the SS net.  I think the cap should be lifted.  Is that fair?  No.

 

To keep SS afloat, I always thought that payouts of SS monies could be withheld from the very wealthy.  I think these dollars should be tracked and held but only available to the individual if their 'net worth' falls below some level.  Say, pulling this number out of the air, that if you are worth over $20million, your SS monies are held for you in some SS account.  If your net worth falls below that amount, you start receiving monthly SS payments.  Perhaps a catastrophic loss entitles you to all of your prior SS 'earnings'. 

 

When you die in this scenario, any unused SS money goes back into the system and not to heirs.  Lots of details there to be worked out for sure but could save some money.  Is that fair?  No but the idea is maintaining the net for those that really need the net.

Edited May 3, 2019 by Bob in Mich

[Kevbeau]

4 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said:

 

I would recommend getting disability insurance too.  My recollection was that is was a pretty tiny cost and one just never knows when an accident or debilitating health problem could strike.  We all take on debt - college, cars, homes, etc - with the idea that we have the earning power to easily repay but one day, that earning power could unexpectedly disappear.

 

Regarding Social Security, the often forgotten point is that SS is essentially a safety net program.  I understand the fairness argument regarding the income cap but that sort of ignores the safety net aspect of SS.  The very wealthy really don't need the SS net.  I think the cap should be lifted.  Is that fair?  No.

 

To keep SS afloat, I always thought that payouts of SS monies could be withheld from the very wealthy.  I think these dollars should be tracked and held but only available to the individual if their 'net worth' falls below some level.  Say, pulling this number out of the air, that if you are worth over $20million, your SS monies are held for you in some SS account.  If your net worth falls below that amount, you start receiving monthly SS payments.  Perhaps a catastrophic loss entitles you to all of your prior SS 'earnings'. 

 

When you die in this scenario, any unused SS money goes back into the system and not to heirs.  Lots of details there to be worked out for sure but could save some money.  Is that fair?  No but the idea is maintaining the net for those that really need the net.

I agree in theory that may work, but if you up the stakes or withhold payout to a certain segment you are punishing a certain segment of the population that did “educate” themselves (to borrow from Chef Jim.) I agree on the need for a safety net, but by far the vast majority of people that depend on SS as their sole source of income could have taken steps to mitigate that. That IMO is not a safety net but a buyout to people who couldn’t act like adults.

Edited May 3, 2019 by Kevbeau

[Cinga]

1 hour ago, Chef Jim said:

There are several ways help.  I originally said fix but not sure about fixing it. 

 

1.  Education, education, education.  If kids knew  about saving, budgeting, investing, planning and what just a few hundred dollars a month investing could do we'd not have so many people relying on SS as their main source of retirement income.  Then we could reduce the payout and eventually the taxation.  Less reliance on others is always good for the whole.  

2.  Increase the age at which Social Security could be taken.  Get rid of accessing SS at 62.  So many people take it early and with life expectancy rising at 62 the taxpayers can be on the hook for 40 years!

3.  Raise the full retirement age.  The full retirement age for born after 1960 which is most of us here is 67.  They need to look at increasing FRA for those born after a certain year.  Maybe 70?   

4.  Potentially raising or eliminating the income cap on contributing to SS.  My issue with that is why should there not be a cap on contributions if there is a cap on payout at the other end.  So I'm not certain about this one.

5.  Increase the contribution limits for IRA.  Most have access to 401k's but those that don't can only contribute $6k/$7k. That's peanuts for many.

6.  Increase the contribution limits for Roth IRA's. For those maxing out 401k's and want more tax efficient ways of saving for retirement why not?

7.  Euthanize dumb people.  This one actually would solve the problem in a few short years.  ?

8.  And lastly educate educate educate.

 

 

or bring in a bunch of illegal aliens and put them to work so they can pay into SS... This would let us kick the can further down the road...

 

However, I do like and endorse #7 as long as we start in Washington DC