John Warrow’s High Praise For Beane & McDermott Regime

[BADOLBILZ]

57 minutes ago, 2018 Our Year For Sure said:

I dont think there's much question Patricia did a nice job of keeping Allen in the pocket, the best he'd seen to that point since he'd raised his game midseason, and it did hurt our offensive output.

 

Howevet I re-watched that game a couple months ago and I was actually shocked to see how well Allen played in a game in which we only scored 14. I'm pretty sure that's the game where he converted a 3rd & 10-ish, had a penalty, re-converted again on 3rd & 20-ish, suffered another penalty and we had to punt. There were a number of examples in that game of poor execution by the offense as a whole-- penalties, drops, poor protection and a wanting running game.

 

However if you think Allen himself was stifled being forced to work from the pocket that day, I implore to watch that game back play-by-play because I don't see it that way at all. I actually think, despite numbers, it was low-key one of his very best days so far. He was accurate and decisive and did not make many, if ANY mistakes. The numbers are what they are but even so, in my opinion 17 balled out.

 

 

 

 

Oy vey.

 

It's NOT ABOUT ALLEN.

 

I'm a huge supporter of Allen and have had nothing but praise for the kid and the pick since he was drafted. 

 

What we are talking about here is the fact that the Bills struggled offensively against Patricia and his mentor relative to how they played in the the other portion of Allen's return.

 

 

[Shaw66]

53 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

What I am saying is that they struggled against the Lions defensive tactics............which the Patriots,  not surprisingly, copied the next week with even more success.

 

The Bills were riding a wave of offensive momentum coming into that game but were certainly lucky to squeeze past the Lions.........which you'd agree with if Gunner or Bandit was saying it.

 

What you guys need to let go of is this idea that your constant arguing with well supported points is going to hurt my feelings.............it's not.........it just makes you look kinda' dumb.........others are just too nice to tell you so.

 

 

Got it.  I don't recall the season in perspective well enough to argue with this, but what you say sounds correct in terms of being an accurate description of the events.  What those events mean is a different thing.

 

This was a team with a makeshift offensive line, weak receivers and a rookie qb. It would have been miraculous for that team to have had consistently good weekly performance. 

 

I believe them when they say they are building for long-term sustained excellence.   What that means is that there isn't going to be excellence in the short term, just building toward excellence. What that means is sometimes players will look good, sometimes bad.  Sometimes coaches will look good, sometimes not.  Sometimes GMS too.  

 

It doesn't matter what anyone else has done. It matters what these people do, and they are building in accordance with their plan.  So long as the plan seems to be headed in the right direction,  I'm okay.  Moreover, so long as it seems to the Pegulas to be headed in the right direction, the coach and GM will be employed. 

 

Having said that, it will be a serious  disappointment if the Bills aren't a seriously competitive team in 2020.  In 2019, they have to be competitive with all but the very best.  Anything short of that means what they're doing needs to reviewed and perhaps acted on.  

[K-9]

1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

LOL the Lions brought it.  We were 2.5 favorites at HOME and we both finished 6-10....he's talking like it was an almost major upset.  It was two poor teams with bad offenses playing each other...that's it.

And seeing as how the home team automatically gets a 3 point advantage, the Bills were actually a 1.5 point underdog! Understandable, considering they were going up against Matt Patricia’s otherworldly brand of football genius! 

 

Seriously though, you’re right; just a couple of poor teams squaring off. Not an upset by either team winning that game. 

 

But when you’re trying to make a futile point, you have to grasp at whatever straws you can find. 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, K-9 said:

And seeing as how the home team automatically gets a 3 point advantage, the Bills were actually a 1.5 point underdog! Understandable, considering they were going up against Matt Patricia’s otherworldly brand of football genius! 

 

Seriously though, you’re right; just a couple of poor teams squaring off. Not an upset by either team winning that game. 

 

But when you’re trying to make a futile point, you have to grasp at whatever straws you can find. 

 

Hey...winning arguments on the internet is important.  

[K-9]

2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Hey...winning arguments on the internet is important.  

Well, when arguments are poorly conceived, poorly presented, and poorly supported, it can be a daunting task. 

[BADOLBILZ]

13 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

LOL the Lions brought it.  We were 2.5 favorites at HOME and we both finished 6-10....he's talking like it was an almost major upset.  It was two poor teams with bad offenses playing each other...that's it.

 

 

 

I don't think most Bills fans would agree with that assessment of the Bills after Allen's return........they had averaged nearly 400 yards of offense in the prior two games........they were on a roll and there was a good deal of excitement about the offense at that point.   

 

 

 

 

5 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Well, when arguments are poorly conceived, poorly presented, and poorly supported, it can be a daunting task. 

 

 

Hey!.........it's MY job to trash Royale's takes!

[Royale with Cheese]

12 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

I don't think most Bills fans would agree with that assessment of the Bills after Allen's return........they had averaged nearly 400 yards of offense in the prior two games........they were on a roll and there was a good deal of excitement about the offense at that point.   

 

 

 

 

 

Here's you saying a few pages earlier, that "scores are what it's all about".  Now you're using yardage as the indicator our offense was on a roll.

In those two games prior, we scored 17 and 23 points.  That's not an offense that's rolling if "scores are what it's all about".  

[Patrick Duffy]

32 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

I don't think most Bills fans would agree with that assessment of the Bills after Allen's return........they had averaged nearly 400 yards of offense in the prior two games........they were on a roll and there was a good deal of excitement about the offense at that point.   

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hey!.........it's MY job to trash Royale's takes!

 

[BADOLBILZ]

31 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Here's you saying a few pages earlier, that "scores are what it's all about".  Now you're using yardage as the indicator our offense was on a roll.

In those two games prior, we scored 17 and 23 points.  That's not an offense that's rolling if "scores are what it's all about".  

 

 

Right and we already covered that.......it's about the scoring..........the Lions and Pats limited the Bills to 14 and 12...........so a TD less per game.

 

YOU were going on about some other stats..............which I addressed.

 

It was a dumb tact for you to take considering you were using the Bills OVERALL stats for the year as a basis and those were ridiculously poor because of the unbelievably bad offense for most of the first two months.

 

But blame Allen all you want I still say they played A LOT better offensively after his return from injury.    

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 8, 2019 by BADOLBILZ

[SoTier]

22 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

You are not seeing the big picture at all.  Comments about being worse last year is a fail than 2017 indicates that.

 

I don’t see a resemblance at all with this regime with previous ones.  I think you want to see the resemblance so you can have another gripe.

 

Really????

 

A summary of the Bills record since 2000 shows this record ...

• In 2000 the Bills won 8 games but went 3-13 in 2001.  
• In 2002 the Bills won 8 games but went 6-10 in 2003. 
• In 2004 the Bills won 9 games but went 5-11 in 2005.  
• Between 2006 and 2013, the Bills failed to win more than 7 games in a season.
• In 2014 the Bills won 9 games and then 8-8 in 2015 but then 7-9 in 2016.
• In 2017 the Bills won 9 games but they went 6-10 in 2018.

The "big picture" of the Bills organization over the past two decades has been one of losing seasons infrequently interrupted by a handful of non-losing ones.  The Bills only managed to put together back-to-back non-losing seasons in 2014 and 2015 when Marrone coached the team to 9-7 and Ryan coached the team to 8-8.    Their only playoff appearance occurred in 2017.

 

Bills HCs since 2000 ...

• 2000 Wade Phillips, 8-8
• 2001-2003 Gregg Williams, 17-21
• 2004-2005 Mike Mularkey, 14-18
• 2006-2009 Dick Jauron,  24-33
• 2009 Perry Fewell, 3-4
• 2010-2012 Chan Gailey, 16-32
• 2013-2014 Doug Marrone, 15-17
• 2015-2016 Rex Ryan, 15-16
• 2016 Anthonly Lynn, 0-1
• 2017-2018 Sean McDermott, 15-17

 

Dick Jauron also had a plan, significant control of the roster, and tried to create a team which fit his plan.  Unfortunately, his plan was seriously flawed.  In some ways, McDermott's insistence of building a team that fits his plan -- specifically preferring attitude and effort over talent -- echoes Jauron's plan.  McDermott's issues with his offensive assistants, including his OCs, echo Jauron's  poor choices for offensive coaches.

 

The 2017 Bills that made the playoffs was not a team that fit Sean McDermott's plan; it had been built by Doug Whaley to fit the "plans" of Doug Marrone and Rex Ryan with McDermott's "plan" tacked on to it.   McDermott owns the 6-10 2018 and he'll own the 2019 team because the rosters were/are filled with players he picked to fit his plan.  So,  if his plan is worth continuing on with, it has to show results this season.  Beane went out and got him more talent on the offense as well as adding some nice youngsters for the defense.  I don't think that's enough for the team to challenge NE or SD or KC but they should be good enough to win at least as many games as they lose (8-8).  The offensive assistants, including OC Brian Daboll, need to do better. The defense also needs to step up, especially against the run, and especially late in games.  McDermott needs to do better.  He needs to produce wins not losses masked as "moral victories", ie not getting blown out by NE or losing a close game in the closing seconds because the defense can't make a clutch play when it needs it.   It's put up or shut up time.

 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 hour ago, SoTier said:

 

Really????

 

A summary of the Bills record since 2000 shows this record ...

• In 2000 the Bills won 8 games but went 3-13 in 2001.  
• In 2002 the Bills won 8 games but went 6-10 in 2003. 
• In 2004 the Bills won 9 games but went 5-11 in 2005.  
• Between 2006 and 2013, the Bills failed to win more than 7 games in a season.
• In 2014 the Bills won 9 games and then 8-8 in 2015 but then 7-9 in 2016.
• In 2017 the Bills won 9 games but they went 6-10 in 2018.

The "big picture" of the Bills organization over the past two decades has been one of losing seasons infrequently interrupted by a handful of non-losing ones.  The Bills only managed to put together back-to-back non-losing seasons in 2014 and 2015 when Marrone coached the team to 9-7 and Ryan coached the team to 8-8.    Their only playoff appearance occurred in 2017.

 

Bills HCs since 2000 ...

• 2000 Wade Phillips, 8-8
• 2001-2003 Gregg Williams, 17-21
• 2004-2005 Mike Mularkey, 14-18
• 2006-2009 Dick Jauron,  24-33
• 2009 Perry Fewell, 3-4
• 2010-2012 Chan Gailey, 16-32
• 2013-2014 Doug Marrone, 15-17
• 2015-2016 Rex Ryan, 15-16
• 2016 Anthonly Lynn, 0-1
• 2017-2018 Sean McDermott, 15-17

 

Dick Jauron also had a plan, significant control of the roster, and tried to create a team which fit his plan.  Unfortunately, his plan was seriously flawed.  In some ways, McDermott's insistence of building a team that fits his plan -- specifically preferring attitude and effort over talent -- echoes Jauron's plan.  McDermott's issues with his offensive assistants, including his OCs, echo Jauron's  poor choices for offensive coaches.

 

The 2017 Bills that made the playoffs was not a team that fit Sean McDermott's plan; it had been built by Doug Whaley to fit the "plans" of Doug Marrone and Rex Ryan with McDermott's "plan" tacked on to it.   McDermott owns the 6-10 2018 and he'll own the 2019 team because the rosters were/are filled with players he picked to fit his plan.  So,  if his plan is worth continuing on with, it has to show results this season.  Beane went out and got him more talent on the offense as well as adding some nice youngsters for the defense.  I don't think that's enough for the team to challenge NE or SD or KC but they should be good enough to win at least as many games as they lose (8-8).  The offensive assistants, including OC Brian Daboll, need to do better. The defense also needs to step up, especially against the run, and especially late in games.  McDermott needs to do better.  He needs to produce wins not losses masked as "moral victories", ie not getting blown out by NE or losing a close game in the closing seconds because the defense can't make a clutch play when it needs it.   It's put up or shut up time.

 

 

 

Thats great work putting up stuff from 2000 that has nothing to do with this current team.

 

 

[oldmanfan]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Thats great work putting up stuff from 2000 that has nothing to do with this current team.

 

 

Anything to be negative.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Thats great work putting up stuff from 2000 that has nothing to do with this current team.

 

 

 

....certainly has some pretty nasty callouses from 24/7...........

 

 

[Cripple Creek]

On 6/7/2019 at 8:01 AM, SoTier said:

 

I'm not sure what you consider a failure.  Obviously, you have much more tolerance for poor performance than I do, because  going 6-10 the season after a playoff appearance screams "FAIL!" to me.   IMO, McDermott has completely used up any and all of his free passes.  Because of league parity imposed by the salary cap, good coaching is essential.  Part of being a good NFL HC is hiring good assistants.  That's why certain HCs produce winners anywhere and everywhere they go and create "coaching trees" of former assistants who go on to become good HCs on their own.  McDermott's assistants on offense and special teams have been disasters.  That's what happens in almost any endeavor when you rely on nepotism to fill key positions.  Many of his  personnel decisions have been questionable at best ... Peterman and Jones from the 2017 draft are most notable.   McDermott puts a better product on the field -- ie, minimum 8 wins -- or he deserves to be unemployed for 2020.

 

As for Beane, at least he's not saddled with the 2017 draft but the only thing that he's done positive is go "all in" on a QB.  His fate will be determined by Josh Allen's success or failure, and at least he has tried to improve Allen's supporting cast this season which gives the kid at least a chance to succeed. 

Just curious. Since last year screamed failure to you what did the prior season w Tyrod Taylor as the starting QB scream to you?

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, Cripple Creek said:

Just curious. Since last year screamed failure to you what did the prior season w Tyrod Taylor as the starting QB scream to you?

 

 

...this should be GOOD.......

 

[Cripple Creek]

On 6/7/2019 at 12:49 PM, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Hopefully it works better than Jauron's culture based re-build but that probably comes down ENTIRELY to Josh Allen.

It always comes down to the QB.

 

On 6/7/2019 at 12:57 PM, ScottLaw said:

Which is why I'm confused he used them as examples.

I’m sure that this has been answered, but I imagine that they were mentioned because they were fired and sent to the scrap heap before resurrecting their careers.

[HappyDays]

3 hours ago, SoTier said:

The "big picture" of the Bills organization over the past two decades has been one of losing seasons infrequently interrupted by a handful of non-losing ones. 

 

Are you aware that every member of the Bills organization from just 5 years ago has been replaced? Literally to a man it is an entirely different organization. The only commonality is the name of the team. This is just lazy analysis. Next time throw in a reference to Russ Brandon for the cherry on top.

Edited June 9, 2019 by HappyDays

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

Are you aware that every member of the Bills organization from just 5 years ago has been replaced? Literally to a man it is an entirely different organization. The only commonality is the name of the team. This is just lazy analysis. Next time throw in a reference to Russ Brandon for the cherry on top.

He doesn't care.  Go look back at some posts from him.  He thinks Pegula doesn't care about winning and only cares about $$, thinks he's the same as Ralph.  

 

Granted we all have have different opinions but opinions should be based in some modicum of fact and logic.  He has neither.

[GunnerBill]

48 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Are you aware that every member of the Bills organization from just 5 years ago has been replaced? Literally to a man it is an entirely different organization. The only commonality is the name of the team. This is just lazy analysis. Next time throw in a reference to Russ Brandon for the cherry on top.

 

Overdorff remains. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Overdorff remains. 

 

 

...and it's hard to tell exactly what his role is today....wonder if this is still accurate.....

 

Bills promote Overdorf to senior VP in minor restructuring

• Associated Press
• Published: Jan. 31, 2008 at 11:34 a.m.
• Updated: July 26, 2012 at 08:17 p.m.
•  

ORCHARD PARK, N.Y. -- Jim Overdorf was promoted to Buffalo Bills senior vice president of football administration, giving him control over contract negotiations and salary cap decisions.

 

The move announced Thursday was part of a minor front office restructuring that follows Russ Brandon's promotion to chief operating officer. Brandon's promotion came after the Bills elected not to fill the general manager's role after Marv Levy stepped down at the end of the season.

 

For Overdorf, the promotion means he formally becomes the team's top executive in day-to-day football matters, answering to Brandon and Bills owner Ralph Wilson. Overdorf is entering his 23rd season with the team and has handled contract talks for most of this decade.