John Warrow’s High Praise For Beane & McDermott Regime

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

3 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

If he is at fault then every other GM in the league is at fault for this at one point or another......simple as that

 

Um ok yes you are right about a completely different point. Never said anything about him compared to other gms , but go ahead and move the goal posts so you can feel better. 

[Phil The Thrill]

9 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

... and I give that Jeff Wright failure play. It was third and 3 to go, not 3rd and goal, but it should have been a two yard loss. If Ted Washington had been there, Smith would have been planted in the ground. Wright was such a weak NT. It's amazing the defense did as well as it did (not that it was great) given the relative void in the center of the d-line. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpC8Z-oGd4c

 

I have been pounding my fist on the table for years about Jeff Wright.  He was not very good and not the type of NT they needed.  I have said that Wright and whoever was playing CB2 (most JD Williams) were the weak links on the team.  

[John from Riverside]

21 minutes ago, Chemical said:

 

Um ok yes you are right about a completely different point. Never said anything about him compared to other gms , but go ahead and move the goal posts so you can feel better. 

I feel fine stating the obvious

[LSHMEAB]

10 hours ago, Bill from NYC said:

I have felt this way every season since the "glory years." This is the exact reason I am just so happy about Ford. If he is as good as I hope he is, he will make a HUGE impact, even (if not especially) at RG!

 

As you and all who attend the games know, weather can have a huge impact in Orchard park. I was at a game and saw Drew Bledsoe release a pass and the wind blew it backwards. I'm not talking about Trent Edwards now.  Running is a necessity and power running (because of the smaller defenses) is now VERY important imho.

 

Gore and Yeldon will gain considerable yards behind a powerful right side, especially with Allen being such a threat to go deep to Foster.

 

I still think there are a couple of missing pieces but this team might be good and exciting in 2019.

We're gonna find out quite a bit about Daboll's ability to scheme a run game in 2019. Last season was the most putrid display of ineptitude I've seen from a Bills team in terms of running the ball. OL personnel was awful. Scheme was awful. 

 

With Castillo gone and the OL improved, this is one area I expect to IMPROVE dramatically. Not the incremental stuff. This MUST change significantly or I will have serious questions about our OC.

[JohnC]

11 hours ago, thebandit27 said:

 

That's a fairly likely scenario.

 

I just don't see the logic in trading him away only to turn around and trade 2 picks for Benjamin.

 

If the idea was simply to accumulate picks for the pursuit of QB1, so be it. Trading for Benjamin flew in the face of that.

 

Oh well, what's done is done. Time to focus on the possibly-better-than-2014 class of WRs coming up next April.

The primary reason that this regime traded for Benjamin is that surprisingly this stripped down team was in the playoff hunt. That was an unexpected development. So McBeane tried to add a receiver to help bolster a barren unit and stay in the playoff contention. In the end although Benjamin wasn't a factor this team by fluke made the playoffs. 

 

Clearly, in hindsight it didn't work out. But to their credit they saw an opportunity and they went for it. While the Bills wasted a pick on the receiver we gained a third round pick in the Taylor trade. When the tabulation is made this regime accumulated some added picks and used them to draft our future qb. In my estimation the arithmetic of moves added up to the plus side. 

[SoTier]

10 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

Or not.  As I said I wish we would have kept him, and we'll see how he does this season.  However, your response pretty much summarizes some of the back and forth going on in this thread.  It seems you want Sammy to succeed this year because that will give you an opportunity to criticize the current regime.  Much like in many of your posts you blast the current ownership for sins committed under Ralph's ownership.

 

 

 

I never wish any player to fail, whether they once played for the Bills, currently play for the Bills or never played for the Bills.  Even as poor a player as Bennie Anderson or Nathan Peterman.  Even as hated a player as Tom Brady.  

 

Furthermore, don't even pretend that you know anything about me or my motivations. Contrary to your continual slander, I have never wished for the Bills to lose or do badly.  Unlike yourself,  however, I no longer blindly believe that the people who run the team --- from ownership down to assistant coaches -- know what they're doing -- and the team's record since John Butler left all the way to the present support my cynicism that the current regime is somehow different from the failed previous ones, including the 2018 offensive horror show. 

 

I don't need to hope that Watkins lights up the league just to find "ammunition" to criticize the McDermott/Beane regime's personnel moves.  All I have to do is point to Stephon Gilmore, Robert Woods, and Ronald Darby ...as well as Kelvin Benjamin, Jordan Matthews, and AJ McCarron plus the entire mismanagement of the QB situation in 2018 starting with determining that they were going to draft a first round QB but not bothering to hire a QB coach with any experience as a QB coach in the last 30 years.     

[K-9]

12 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The primary reason that this regime traded for Benjamin is that surprisingly this stripped down team was in the playoff hunt. That was an unexpected development. So McBeane tried to add a receiver to help bolster a barren unit and stay in the playoff contention. In the end although Benjamin wasn't a factor this team by fluke made the playoffs. 

 

Clearly, in hindsight it didn't work out. But to their credit they saw an opportunity and they went for it. While the Bills wasted a pick on the receiver we gained a third round pick in the Taylor trade. When the tabulation is made this regime accumulated some added picks and used them to draft our future qb. In my estimation the arithmetic of moves added up to the plus side. 

And that 3rd rounder acquired for TT was used to trade up with Baltimore to get Edmunds. The TT trade helped us enormously.

[JohnC]

10 minutes ago, K-9 said:

And that 3rd rounder acquired for TT was used to trade up with Baltimore to get Edmunds. The TT trade helped us enormously.

They procured the chips and then wisely used the chips. Those extra draft picks this regime maneuvered to get were used to acquire Josh and Edmunds, two pivotal players on each side of the ball. The arithmetic ended up on the plus side. 

Edited June 7, 2019 by JohnC

[oldmanfan]

41 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

I never wish any player to fail, whether they once played for the Bills, currently play for the Bills or never played for the Bills.  Even as poor a player as Bennie Anderson or Nathan Peterman.  Even as hated a player as Tom Brady.  

 

Furthermore, don't even pretend that you know anything about me or my motivations. Contrary to your continual slander, I have never wished for the Bills to lose or do badly.  Unlike yourself,  however, I no longer blindly believe that the people who run the team --- from ownership down to assistant coaches -- know what they're doing -- and the team's record since John Butler left all the way to the present support my cynicism that the current regime is somehow different from the failed previous ones, including the 2018 offensive horror show. 

 

I don't need to hope that Watkins lights up the league just to find "ammunition" to criticize the McDermott/Beane regime's personnel moves.  All I have to do is point to Stephon Gilmore, Robert Woods, and Ronald Darby ...as well as Kelvin Benjamin, Jordan Matthews, and AJ McCarron plus the entire mismanagement of the QB situation in 2018 starting with determining that they were going to draft a first round QB but not bothering to hire a QB coach with any experience as a QB coach in the last 30 years.     

Your feelings get bruised rather easily

[Nihilarian]

55 minutes ago, SoTier said:

I don't need to hope that Watkins lights up the league just to find "ammunition" to criticize the McDermott/Beane regime's personnel moves.  All I have to do is point to Stephon Gilmore, Robert Woods, and Ronald Darby ...as well as Kelvin Benjamin, Jordan Matthews, and AJ McCarron plus the entire mismanagement of the QB situation in 2018 starting with determining that they were going to draft a first round QB but not bothering to hire a QB coach with any experience as a QB coach in the last 30 years.     

All Watkins was in Buffalo was an expensive decoy and all that money for his potential... that the team that owns him might never see as the guy is always injured. I don't expect 2019 to any different. Sammy has been in the NFL for five seasons and he has only played in one full season and in that year he was constantly nursing one injury or another.

 

As for Gilmore and Darby, they didn't fit what the Bills wanted to do and if anything... this coaching staff knows their stuff when it comes to DBs as they had the #1 pass defense in the league last season. Robert Woods didn't want to stay in Buffalo and wanted back in LA. 

 

Yes, KB was a mistake as was waiting so long to sign a veteran QB in Anderson, as he wasn't sure if he was ever going to play again and was contemplating retirement. Beane admitted this was a mistake. Nathan Peterman was a mistake, a big mistake and the HC must have had input from the OCs on that mistake. AJ McCarron came to Buffalo and pulled a Flacco by saying he wasn't here to mentor anyone, good riddance! 

 

Yes, they almost got Josh Allen killed with a bad offensive line. Bad O line coach/run game coordinator, bad WR coach, bad QB coach, bad ST coach. Although, unlike all the past regimes since the Butler era all the issues have been addressed. Trust me when I say I used to be the pinnacle of complaining when things went wrong and although a lot went wrong last season. However, a lot went right this off season too.

 

Here is a concept, how about we wait until until the team actually falls on it's face before we bring out the torches and pitchforks. I can see this team winning 9 or 10 games or even more if the run defense is as good as the pass defense. 

[LSHMEAB]

2 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

 

Here is a concept, how about we wait until until the team actually falls on it's face before we bring out the torches and pitchforks. 

This I really don't understand. Same with the constant "fire everyone" jokes.

 

Critiquing some of the moves Beane and McDermott have made does not= torches and pitchforks. Additionally, I have not seen a SINGLE poster declare that Beane OR McDermott should be fired THIS offseason. Not a single one.

 

Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems that everyone agrees the regime deserves at least this season to see the plan come to fruition. The debates are exclusively hypothetical; "If they go 6-10, do they get the axe?"

[JohnC]

4 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

This I really don't understand. Same with the constant "fire everyone" jokes.

 

Critiquing some of the moves Beane and McDermott have made does not= torches and pitchforks. Additionally, I have not seen a SINGLE poster declare that Beane OR McDermott should be fired THIS offseason. Not a single one.

 

Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems that everyone agrees the regime deserves at least this season to see the plan come to fruition. The debates are exclusively hypothetical; "If they go 6-10, do they get the axe?"

No this regime will not get the axe if the team goes 6-10 this season. I'm confident of that. The owner is invested in McDermott and will ride that pony a lot longer. 

[Doc Brown]

2 hours ago, JohnC said:

The primary reason that this regime traded for Benjamin is that surprisingly this stripped down team was in the playoff hunt. That was an unexpected development. So McBeane tried to add a receiver to help bolster a barren unit and stay in the playoff contention. In the end although Benjamin wasn't a factor this team by fluke made the playoffs. 

 

Clearly, in hindsight it didn't work out. But to their credit they saw an opportunity and they went for it. While the Bills wasted a pick on the receiver we gained a third round pick in the Taylor trade. When the tabulation is made this regime accumulated some added picks and used them to draft our future qb. In my estimation the arithmetic of moves added up to the plus side. 

It wasn't just short term as they thought Benjamin could be our #1 WR for years.  It's still a black mark on his record but the reward was much higher than the risk.

[oldmanfan]

6 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

This I really don't understand. Same with the constant "fire everyone" jokes.

 

Critiquing some of the moves Beane and McDermott have made does not= torches and pitchforks. Additionally, I have not seen a SINGLE poster declare that Beane OR McDermott should be fired THIS offseason. Not a single one.

 

Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems that everyone agrees the regime deserves at least this season to see the plan come to fruition. The debates are exclusively hypothetical; "If they go 6-10, do they get the axe?"

I agree.  The problem around here are the extremists.  A poster above who consistently posts negative stuff accuses me of blindly supporting the front office when in the very same thread I pointed out they should not have traded Watkins.  That sort of negativity is a problem.  And the ones saying Allen will be MVP or try to justify, say, the Benjamin trade are equally problematic

 

What I like right now is that the HC and GM operate in synch and have both a philosophy of how to build a team plus a plan to do so that they stick to.  Does that mean every decision they make will be correct?  Of course not.  No one is judged a success or failure based on single decisions.  Hell, Bill Gates hasn't been perfect and he's done OK for himself.  Does it mean they're immune to criticism?  Of course not.  It just gets tiresome when some go out of their way to manufacture things to B word about.  Or celebrate things that haven't happened.

 

if their plan works we'll all celebrate.  If not they'll get fired.  Simple.

 

 

[Doc Brown]

16 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

This I really don't understand. Same with the constant "fire everyone" jokes.

 

Critiquing some of the moves Beane and McDermott have made does not= torches and pitchforks. Additionally, I have not seen a SINGLE poster declare that Beane OR McDermott should be fired THIS offseason. Not a single one.

 

Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems that everyone agrees the regime deserves at least this season to see the plan come to fruition. The debates are exclusively hypothetical; "If they go 6-10, do they get the axe?"

No.  They'll have one more year to prove themselves.  This is still a team in transition that needs one more good off-season.

[Augie]

1 minute ago, ScottLaw said:

How many transition offseasons does one get? 

 

I totally get that (I really do!), but I say one too many is better than one too few.  I hate churning the whole thing without giving it an adequate chance. Rex was an exception, what a mistake! 

 

Might Belichick have made it in Cleveland? 

[Doc Brown]

21 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

How many transition offseasons does one get? 

For a full rebuild.  Two after drafting your rookie  QB.

[Augie]

2 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Belichick is the exepction.

 

Dont think there's too many other HC/GM combos who've been mediocre to below average their first 3 years and gone on to win in their fourth or elsewhere.

 

I like the direction. We will all wait and see. I hope I’m right, but I won’t swear I’m right. 

 

It’s a game I enjoy and follow closely. It’s not my life. 

2 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

For a full rebuild.  Two after drafting your rookie  QB.

Or possibly three, depending upon what you see. That’s just me. The furious crowd can bring out the pitchforks any time they like. No skin off my nose. 

[Augie]

3 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

What is a "full" rebuild? 

 

It doesnt take 4 years to build a winner in the modern day NFL. If you aren't successful in 3 years you in all likelihood never will be. 

Yes same here.

 

 Im just suggesting if they have another lousy year chances are these guys will never be successful here.

 

I don’t think they’ve really had a “lousy” year yet. I suppose that depends upon you expectations. They broke the playoff drought, then took a step back year. Not shocking if you consider everything.

 

And I don’t think they should be tied too closely together. It seems like a tight package but no telling how it feels in the FO, especially if things trend downward. 

[LSHMEAB]

16 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

I don’t think they’ve really had a “lousy” year yet. I suppose that depends upon you expectations. They broke the playoff drought, then took a step back year. Not shocking if you consider everything.

 

And I don’t think they should be tied too closely together. It seems like a tight package but no telling how it feels in the FO, especially if things trend downward. 

I think they(well, McDermott) deserves a ton of credit for ending the drought.

 

Having said that, we're talking (hypothetically) about following that up with two straight seasons in which they win 6 games. I'm not quite sure how that could be viewed as progress. 

 

I'm not pessimistic per se. I like a lot of what they've done and believe they're ready to compete. What I'm not down with is the idea that mediocrity in 2019 is part of some grand design. I think this team is capable of winning 10 games, so my expectations are relatively high. Where you, DB, and virtually all of us agree is that there probably won't be regime chance barring a DISASTER. I will personally be VERY discouraged if this team isn't in the hunt for a playoff spot well into the season.