Alphadawg7 Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I think the offensive weapons in Miami are probably less good. The line is a little better - Tunsil is a good player I think the kid they drafted in the 3rd out of Wisconsin will start too. But you are right he isn't walking into a great situation. I think it is probably less of a basket case around him than Arizona but I still don't expect Miami to be a good team. Agreed on all accounts there. First question will be if they let Rosen start week 1 or start off with Fitz. My guess is Fitz at first, but I’m sure Miami is going to want to see as much of Rosen as they can knowing they will have shots at top QBs next draft most likely and have to decide if Rosen is their guy to build around or add another prospect a trade top of draft.
GunnerBill Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 Should just say though don't be so sure that if Josh Rosen goes say 6-10 in Miami this year and they end up with the 8th or 9th pick that it would mean Quarterback. At the moment everyone is talking Herbert and Tua but by January everyone will be thinking "man if we wait one more year and suck that year we could get Trevor Lawrence." I am personally not totally sold on Herbert and even less so on Tua at this stage but Trevor Lawrence? I'd draft the kid now if I could. He is a slam dunk.
HappyDays Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said: But I disagree greatly that AZ would have done the same thing to Allen. Their stat totals ended similar, but it was Allen that really showed significant improvements and it was Allen who the Cardinals coveted last year and were devastated reportedly when we took him. There's an interesting question about what Allen would fetch in a trade right now. Cardinals barely found one team to give them a 2nd for Rosen. I'm pretty sure that right now Allen would go for a 1st if he was up for trade. The difference is Allen showed the ability to elevate his offense. 1
LabattBlue Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 Does Rosen have even a slim chance of succeeding in Miami this season? Shape of OL? Offensive skill players?
GunnerBill Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 5 minutes ago, HappyDays said: There's an interesting question about what Allen would fetch in a trade right now. Cardinals barely found one team to give them a 2nd for Rosen. I'm pretty sure that right now Allen would go for a 1st if he was up for trade. The difference is Allen showed the ability to elevate his offense. Would he? I am not certain. I think the perception out there on him is still pretty low. Witness the reactions on the faces of the other NFLN guys when Peter Schraeger said "People in Western New York love #17 they think they have their Quarterback." Because we are in and we poured over every throw he made last year we see progression even within last season we see reasons to really buy in. I think people outside who have no special attachment to the Bills around the league are still unconvinced. In any event it is a total hypothetical because he is going nowhere. The job Josh has is make everyone around the league believers in 2019. 1
Boca BIlls Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 1 minute ago, LabattBlue said: Does Rosen have even a slim chance of succeeding in Miami this season? Shape of OL? Offensive skill players? Nope but he wasn't going to succeed in the NFL anyway.
Teddy KGB Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 What does @WRONG JOSH and @26CornerBlitz think about the other Josh getting so close ? 2
Ittakestime Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 2 hours ago, GunnerBill said: Should just say though don't be so sure that if Josh Rosen goes say 6-10 in Miami this year and they end up with the 8th or 9th pick that it would mean Quarterback. At the moment everyone is talking Herbert and Tua but by January everyone will be thinking "man if we wait one more year and suck that year we could get Trevor Lawrence." I am personally not totally sold on Herbert and even less so on Tua at this stage but Trevor Lawrence? I'd draft the kid now if I could. He is a slam dunk. I highly doubt Miami wins six games. Their talent level is on Arizona from last year
GunnerBill Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 1 minute ago, Ittakestime said: I highly doubt Miami wins six games. Their talent level is on Arizona from last year Yea they might not. If they get the 1st pick then I think they probably go QB. But my point was if they are just a bit further down the board the temptation to wait for Lawrence will be massive. And that isn't just the Dolphins but the Bengals, the Titans, the Buccs and anyone else who at the end of 2019 isn't sold on their QB. 1
HappyDays Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 16 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: 24 minutes ago, HappyDays said: There's an interesting question about what Allen would fetch in a trade right now. Cardinals barely found one team to give them a 2nd for Rosen. I'm pretty sure that right now Allen would go for a 1st if he was up for trade. The difference is Allen showed the ability to elevate his offense. Would he? I am not certain. I think the perception out there on him is still pretty low. Witness the reactions on the faces of the other NFLN guys when Peter Schraeger said "People in Western New York love #17 they think they have their Quarterback." Peter Schrager and the NFLN talking heads are not representative of the NFL. Many people in that sphere thought that Allen was distantly 4th in that year's QB class, and some even thought Lamar Jackson was a better prospect. The NFL obviously felt differently. Allen's physical talent and the improvement he showed would make him a clear 1st round pick right now IMO.
stuvian Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 5 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said: From the standpoint of a Marx Brothers movie, yes. I miss ‘Cornpone’. (But my aim is getting better...) I'm a Dreamer, Montreal?
GunnerBill Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 1 hour ago, HappyDays said: Peter Schrager and the NFLN talking heads are not representative of the NFL. Many people in that sphere thought that Allen was distantly 4th in that year's QB class, and some even thought Lamar Jackson was a better prospect. The NFL obviously felt differently. Allen's physical talent and the improvement he showed would make him a clear 1st round pick right now IMO. DJ and Charles Davis are very plugged in to NFL teams though. Like I say, it is supposition, but I think people in and arpund the Bills are higher on him at this point than the rest of the league.
K D Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 2 hours ago, Teddy KGB said: What does @WRONG JOSH and @26CornerBlitz think about the other Josh getting so close ? I think he's going from one messed up situation to another. Miami clearly rebuilding and gutting their roster so it will be a similar situation. Was hoping he would go to Giants or San Diego so he could get a fair shot. Did not want him on the Pats as I think he would have been highly successful there. Either way I think Josh Allen is still terrible and can't hit the broad side of a barn but hey at least he can run. What will the excuses be this year when he completes 50% of his passes again? They brought in every available free agent OL, WR, and RB on the planet plus addressed it in the draft. Can't keep using your legs unless you want to end up injured. Eventually he has to actually be a QB. 1
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 5 minutes ago, WRONG JOSH said: I think he's going from one messed up situation to another. Miami clearly rebuilding and gutting their roster so it will be a similar situation. Was hoping he would go to Giants or San Diego so he could get a fair shot. Did not want him on the Pats as I think he would have been highly successful there. Either way I think Josh Allen is still terrible and can't hit the broad side of a barn but hey at least he can run. What will the excuses be this year when he completes 50% of his passes again? They brought in every available free agent OL, WR, and RB on the planet plus addressed it in the draft. Can't keep using your legs unless you want to end up injured. Eventually he has to actually be a QB. Welcome back little buddy! 3 1
Boca BIlls Posted April 28, 2019 Posted April 28, 2019 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: DJ and Charles Davis are very plugged in to NFL teams though. Like I say, it is supposition, but I think people in and arpund the Bills are higher on him at this point than the rest of the league. No they really arent.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 29, 2019 Posted April 29, 2019 5 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said: I agree Miami is initially a great spot for him and Fitz could be a great mentor. However it also has risks and may be a losing battle. 1. How much playing time does he get over Fitz? I expect Fitz starts the year until they feel Rosen is ready to start sometime 4 to 8 games in. 2. Miami roster sucks, his situation is worse than the Cards last year in terms of roster talent. How well will he even play in that situation? So can he even do enough to keep Miami from taking a top QB prospect next year? They have very little invested in Rosen, so he’s going to have an uphill battle to keep Miami going QB early unless he can elevate a bad roster. If anyone can provide a QB mentoring in how to elevate a bad roster and do a lot with a little, that guy would be Fitz. 3 hours ago, GunnerBill said: Would he? I am not certain. I think the perception out there on him is still pretty low. Witness the reactions on the faces of the other NFLN guys when Peter Schraeger said "People in Western New York love #17 they think they have their Quarterback." Because we are in and we poured over every throw he made last year we see progression even within last season we see reasons to really buy in. I think people outside who have no special attachment to the Bills around the league are still unconvinced. In any event it is a total hypothetical because he is going nowhere. The job Josh has is make everyone around the league believers in 2019. Actually I think the job Josh #17 has is to do whatever to help the Bills win football games. Just Win Baby. If we win, I don't really GAF if that makes everyone Allen believers or if they all think it was done with smoke and mirrors and bailing wire and string. 1
GunnerBill Posted April 29, 2019 Posted April 29, 2019 16 minutes ago, Boca BIlls said: No they really arent. Well they are.
Rampage Posted April 29, 2019 Posted April 29, 2019 In what world is Lamar Jackson a better prospect than Allen? Baltimore pretty much ripped up their entire playbook from the last 10 years because the guy can't throw a football. 2
Alphadawg7 Posted April 29, 2019 Posted April 29, 2019 2 hours ago, WRONG JOSH said: I think he's going from one messed up situation to another. Miami clearly rebuilding and gutting their roster so it will be a similar situation. Was hoping he would go to Giants or San Diego so he could get a fair shot. Did not want him on the Pats as I think he would have been highly successful there. Either way I think Josh Allen is still terrible and can't hit the broad side of a barn but hey at least he can run. What will the excuses be this year when he completes 50% of his passes again? They brought in every available free agent OL, WR, and RB on the planet plus addressed it in the draft. Can't keep using your legs unless you want to end up injured. Eventually he has to actually be a QB. 1. Sounds like you are more of a Rosen fan than a Bills fan with the way you talk about him and slam our own. 2. You analysis of Allen is terrible. But hey, I don’t need to tell you that, 90% of this board already has. 3. Running QBs getting hurt more often is a fallacy. Has it happened, yes, but not at the rate people claim. Running QBs haven’t got hurt on the run at a higher rate than pocket QBs getting hurt in the pocket. In fact one study showed they get hurt a lot less outside the pocket with all the rules protecting them. They get hurt way more often in the pocket when a 320 pound man who runs a sub 4.6 40 smashes into them from behind or mammoth men roll their legs up. On the run they slide, get out of bounds, and take hits from MUCH smaller tacklers than what they see in the trenches. Not to mention they rarely take big blindside hits running down field and brace for impact.
Boca BIlls Posted April 29, 2019 Posted April 29, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, WRONG JOSH said: I think he's going from one messed up situation to another. Miami clearly rebuilding and gutting their roster so it will be a similar situation. Was hoping he would go to Giants or San Diego so he could get a fair shot. Did not want him on the Pats as I think he would have been highly successful there. Either way I think Josh Allen is still terrible and can't hit the broad side of a barn but hey at least he can run. What will the excuses be this year when he completes 50% of his passes again? They brought in every available free agent OL, WR, and RB on the planet plus addressed it in the draft. Can't keep using your legs unless you want to end up injured. Eventually he has to actually be a QB. So Rosen is allowed to have excuses.... Hahahahah Did you notice he used his legs when his O-Line broke down? Did you notice he got injured staying in the pocket to throw? Did you notice Rosen had a better surrounding cast and got worse as the season went on? Edited April 29, 2019 by Boca BIlls
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