Why I think T.J. Hockenson, TE Iowa, will be the #9 pick

[BillsfanAZ]

I would be surprised if the Bills go TE at #9. There are some good TE's coming out. I think Sternberger in the 3rd would be an awesome pick for the Bills if he is there. That being said Hockenson is a top ten talent so I wouldnt be heart broken if they picked him. 

[JaCrispy]

14 minutes ago, BillsfanAZ said:

I would be surprised if the Bills go TE at #9. There are some good TE's coming out. I think Sternberger in the 3rd would be an awesome pick for the Bills if he is there. That being said Hockenson is a top ten talent so I wouldnt be heart broken if they picked him. 

Same, not my first choice but I would be ok with it....he’s a process guy and solid player all around....

[Chicken Boo]

3 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

Panthers Greg Olsen, Still playing

SF Russ Francis,

*KC Tony Gonzalez, 14 pro bowls will be in the HoF  Holds NFL records for career receiving yards (15,127), receptions (1,325) and touchdowns (111) for tight end

Denver Shannon Sharpe HoF,

Cleveland Ozzie Newsome HoF,

SD Antonio Gates, still playing

Bears Mike Ditka HoF,

*Oakland Dave Casper HoF,

*Dallas Jason Witten, just retired, 10 pro bowls

*Colts John Mackey HoF,

*SD Kellen Winslow HoF,

Dallas Jackie Smith HoF,

Lions Charlie Sanders HoF. 

 

Gronk isn't even the best of the bunch IMO

 

Prime for Prime, I'll take Gronkowski over all of them.  His violent nature cut his career short, but I've never seen anything like him.

 

Kelce is just as lethal, but less physical, which will allow him to enjoy a longer career.

[njbuff]

3 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

Panthers Greg Olsen, Still playing

SF Russ Francis,

*KC Tony Gonzalez, 14 pro bowls will be in the HoF  Holds NFL records for career receiving yards (15,127), receptions (1,325) and touchdowns (111) for tight end

Denver Shannon Sharpe HoF,

Cleveland Ozzie Newsome HoF,

SD Antonio Gates, still playing

Bears Mike Ditka HoF,

*Oakland Dave Casper HoF,

*Dallas Jason Witten, just retired, 10 pro bowls

*Colts John Mackey HoF,

*SD Kellen Winslow HoF,

Dallas Jackie Smith HoF,

Lions Charlie Sanders HoF. 

 

Gronk isn't even the best of the bunch IMO

 

 

It's difficult to go against Gronk, but Kellen Winslow was my guy as he was a beast when healthy. He was very underrated for his blocking ability, but I think he is the greatest receiving TE who ever lived.

[Bring it]

On 4/6/2019 at 7:55 AM, Inigo Montoya said:

I wanted to put together all the reasons why I think McBeane will grab T.J. if he is there at #9 when the Bills are on the clock.

 

1.)  It has been stated many times on this board that the success or failure of the entire McBeane Era will come down to just one thing, does Josh Allen become a true franchise QB.  Helping Allen continue to develop is the single most important factor in this franchise turning the corner.  I think McBeane wants to give Josh Allen a go-to-guy that he can lean on and bail him out when needed.  They believe in that so much that they were willing to chase Antonio Brown in FA and bring him into this locker room, with all of Brown's attendant drama, and shell out some serous cash to get him into a Bill's uniform.  They understand it's critically important for Josh Allen to get some weapons on the offense.

 

2.) T.J. Hockenson is widely considered the best TE in the draft.  He won the John Mackey Award as the nations top collegiate TE.  He is the best blocking TE in the draft, has great route running skills, soft hands, and the size to go up and grab those 50/50 balls.  He is a complete TE, he can catch and block.  He is a three down TE.  He is a process guy. 

 

Combine:   "Hockenson is currently seen as the better overall prospect (over Fant), due to superior blocking abilities. Still, his athletic ability left nothing to be desired. At 6-foot-4  3/4 and 251 pounds, Hockenson’s 4.70-second time in the 40-yard dash is very good. The same goes for his 37.5-inch vertical and 10-foot-3 broad jump. However, his agility numbers are the equal of many of the better wide receivers in this year’s draft class, with a 7.02-second time in the 3-cone drill and a short shuttle time of 4.18."

 

3.)  Some say you should not select a TE at #9, it is not a premium position.  I disagree.  The NFL game is evolving on offense and many teams have built their offense around a great TE.  Gronk and the Pats for years, Ertz in Philly, Kelce in K.C., Olson in Carolina, and recently Kittle in San Fran.  They are offenses that scheme to create mismatches with their TE, too big for a corner to cover well, too fast for a LB to keep up with.  You don't need a true WR1 if you have a great TE.  We don't have a WR1 and we are not likely going to draft a WR who is going to be a WR1 this year.

 

4.)   The kid can block.  For years Shady feasted running behind the left side of our line, Glenn-Incognito-Woods.  Now imagine running behind the left side of the line with Hockenson-Nsekhe-Spain-Morse (I think Nsekhe beats out Dawkins). I think Shady will be back in business.  Better yet, the defense won't know if Hockenson is there to block on a running play, or going out into the flat or up the seam as a receiver.   In this alignment, which should be our base offensive set, it will be hard for a defense to guess run vs pass.  In Hockenson we are drafting a great TE and a solid O-lineman in one pick.  I think there is some extra value there. 

 

5.)   Of course, for this to work you need to have an offensive coordinator who understands how to utilize the TE creatively.  Enter Brian Daboll, formerly of the Rob Gronkowski Patriots.  Not only was he there to see it, he was actually the TE coach for the Pats from 2014-2016.  Gronk had 82 catches for 1,124 yards and 12 TDs in 15 games in 2014,  72 catches for 1,176 yards and 11 TDs in 15 games in 2015, and was injured in 2016 but still posted 25 catches for 540 yards and 3 TDs in only 8 games, two of which he was knocked out of early, and two others he was limited in.  I'd say Daboll understands both how to scheme for a TE, and understands the value of the TE position.

 

6.)  Daboll is not the only one who recognizes the value of a great TE.  These are quotes from Sean McDermott at the owners meeting two weeks ago about what Greg Olson meant to the development of Cam Newton and to the offense overall. "I liked it when we were on offense and it was third and about five because I knew we were going to get a 1st down because we had Greg Olson."   Talking about watching Olson in Carolina and Chad Lewis in Philly play, "I feel like I learned at an early age about how important that tight end position is to a quarterback, and particularly a young quarterback, it becomes a security blanket."  Who else watched the impact Olson had on Cam Newton as his security blanket in Carolina?  Some guy named Brandon Beane.

 

7.)   Signing Tyler Kroft does not preclude them drafting Hockenson at #9.  Once again at the owner's meeting McDermott stressed the importance of player leadership, of having a veteran leader in every position room who would hold the young guys accountable and show them the ropes.  I think McDermott learned this lesson the hard way seeing the impact a lack of veteran leadership in the QB room had on Allen's development.  I think this will be Kroft's main role, to mentor Hockenson, and hopefully Kroft will also bounce back to his 2017 form where he had 42 receptions and 7 TDs, but that would be icing on the cake.  McDermott said it plainly "Ideally, you have a leader in every room (position room), and a competition in every room because competition brings out the best in all of us."  

 

8.)   Right now we only have three TEs on the roster, Kroft, Croom, and Jake Fisher from Cincy who is a converted O-Lineman.  We rolled into the season last year with four, Clay, Croom, Logan Thomas, and Khari Lee on the roster opening day.  We definitely have space for another TE or two on the roster to take into camp.  We had six TEs in camp last year with O'Leary and Towbridge  there as well.  We will be drafting a TE in this draft. 

 

Do we go DT or EDGE in the draft at #9 and hope we can trade back up into the 1st round to grab Fant or Irv Smith?  We can try, but there is no guarantee we will be able to do that, and neither of those guys are getting out of the 1st round.  If we don't grab Hockenson at #9, we may not get an elite TE prospect in this draft at all.

 

9.)   And lastly, to circle back around to the first point, there will be some great defensive players available when we draft at #9 that would immediately upgrade the defense and address a need at DT or EDGE.  At the end of the day, the Bills will rise or fall as a franchise over the next three years based on what Josh Allen becomes.  If you have a weapon like T.J Hockenson sitting there who can be the go-to weapon that Allen needs, possibly the next Kelce, Ertz, Kittle, Olson, or even a Gronk, develop into Allen's "security blanket", be a beast in the run game, and a be high character Process kind of guy to boot, I don't know how you pass him up especially considering the lack of any WR1 on this team for Josh Allen. 

 

Will there be a learning curve for a rookie TE?   Of course, but I think McBeane sees the 2019 season as a stepping stone for 2020 (I still think we will be much improved and make the playoffs in 2019).   2019 will be the season that Hockenson learns the pro game, gels with the O-line, and develops a rapport with Allen.  I believe the plan is for this team to be good enough to contend for a Super Bowl in 2020 if Allen continues to develop.  I think Allen having a weapon like T.J. Hockenson around him is more impactful to this team taking that next step than adding another great defensive player this year.

 

 

 

Great reasons for  drafting Hock! I’m on board if it helps Josh and Shady be better!

[Nihilarian]

35 minutes ago, njbuff said:

 

 

It's difficult to go against Gronk, but Kellen Winslow was my guy as he was a beast when healthy. He was very underrated for his blocking ability, but I think he is the greatest receiving TE who ever lived.

While Gronk is up there in a top ten. I gotta wonder how he would do with another team with a not so dominate QB, HC, offense. After all, the guy was being thrown to by the GOAT! While being in the NFL for 9 years, Gronk has played less then 6 full seasons. 

 

Talk about tough? Guys like Ozzie Newsome never missed a game in 13 seasons and he helped redefine the position.

Oakland's Dave Casper was nicknamed "the Ghost" and it was the Ghost to the post while being one of the best Tight ends in the 70's-80's. 

Denver's Shannon Sharpe was on three super bowl winning teams and was the prototypical pass catching TE.

The Chargers Kellen Winslow was like an extra WR in "Air Coryell's " offense. 

Mike Ditka was the very first TE to transform a blocking role position into a pass catching position, the very first TE in the HoF. 

John Mackey. There is a reason as to why the award for the best tight end each year in college football is named after this man. 

 

Tony Gonzalez, played 17 seasons, 14 pro bowls, 6 times first team all pro. Played from 1997-2013. Had QBs like Elvis Grbac (3 years), Damon Huard (2 years), Yancy Thigpen (1 year), Matt Cassell (4 years) throwing to him  He also had Trent Green (5 years) Matt Ryan (5 years). The guy is second in the NFL for all time receptions, 6th in career receiving yards. 

 

Some of those players helped redefine the position in the game and if you are old enough to watch them you couldn't help but see them take over games. I'll never forget that 1981 38-41 OT playoff game in Miami with Kellen Winslow blocking a FG in the last seconds to send the game into overtime. 13 rec for 166 yards and a TD. His performance in the game had to be one of the single greatest efforts in NFL history as the guy would come off the field and fall down exhausted and then rise again to make a play. His yardage total in this game was an NFL record for over 30 years. 

What made Winslow's performance all the more memorable was that fact during the game he was treated for a pinched nerve in his shoulder, dehydration, severe cramps, and received three stitches in his lower lip. After the game, a picture of Winslow being helped off the field by his teammates.

 

[PIZ]

 

 

[Cornette's Commentary]

On 4/11/2019 at 8:50 PM, Bring it said:

Great reasons for  drafting Hock! I’m on board if it helps Josh and Shady be better!

Will Hockenson help the pass rush and run defense be better?

[whorlnut]

1 minute ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

Will Hockenson help the pass rush and run defense be better?

Will a pass rusher or interior lineman help our terrible TE Corp be better?

[Cornette's Commentary]

3 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

Will a pass rusher or interior lineman help our terrible TE Corp be better?

Because you can't get good, pass-catching TEs in rounds 2-4?  Good pass-catching TEs such as: Zach Ertz and Travis Kelce who went in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, respectively?

Edited April 19, 2019 by Cornette's Commentary

[NoSaint]

On 4/11/2019 at 7:28 AM, MrEpsYtown said:

I know most people don't like it, but Walterfootball just mocked Hockenson to the Bills. In his version, basically Oliver, Gary, Allen, Bosa, Williams, White are all gone along with Murray and Taylor. With Oliver gone with pretty much all of the blue chip defensive prospects, they have us taking Hockenson. I think it is possible if this happens, but you still have Burns, Wilkins, Sweat on the board. If anybody takes a quarterback or moves up for one, we are going to get a pretty good defensive prospect. With Oliver, a lot of people are starting to mock him to Tampa and I think that is kind of a weird fit in the Todd Bowles defense. 

 

 

Walter is just a guy. His insights and connections are below many poster we have here.

[whorlnut]

16 minutes ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

Because you can't get good, pass-catching TEs in rounds 2-4?  Good pass-catching TEs such as: Zach Ertz and Travis Kelce who went in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, respectively?

Same can be said for other positions. Hockenson is a complete TE. The others are not. 

[PIZ]

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

29 minutes ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

Because you can't get good, pass-catching TEs in rounds 2-4?  Good pass-catching TEs such as: Zach Ertz and Travis Kelce who went in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, respectively?

 

You can’t get good DL in rounds 2-4?  Do yourself a favor and google some

 

Lmao, you just won’t stop with your illogical comments.  

[Bring it]

31 minutes ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

Will Hockenson help the pass rush and run defense be better?

Not unless he can play both ways at DE also. Maybe I should have said if it makes the team better, but that’s obvious!! I just want a great talent at 9 that will push this team closer to the goal of perennial playoff team. If Hock is it great, if it’s Oliver great. Our run D could use it.

[Cornette's Commentary]

2 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

You can’t get good DL in rounds 2-4?  Do yourself a favor and google some

 

Lmao, you just won’t stop with your illogical comments.  

Name for me, please, the DL available in rounds 2-4 of this year's Draft that Beane can take, that are as good as Oliver, Sweat, Gary and Christian Wilkins.

[Putin]

4 hours ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

Because you can't get good, pass-catching TEs in rounds 2-4?  Good pass-catching TEs such as: Zach Ertz and Travis Kelce who went in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, respectively?

So who’s your Travis Kelce and Zach in this draft in round 2-4 ?

[Dopey]

4 hours ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

Name for me, please, the DL available in rounds 2-4 of this year's Draft that Beane can take, that are as good as Oliver, Sweat, Gary and Christian Wilkins.

Apples to oranges. Come on, man! You start with naming already established te's who were drafted after the 1st round, then when confronted with the fact the good dl have been drafted after the 1st round, you somehow want to change the narrative to players not even drafted yet?!  I am Dopey, but even I can see how illogical that argument is. Can't you?

[Prickly Pete]

While I like the idea of having a good TE, I wonder if that is the type pf receiver that will most benefit Allen at this point in his career. Allen is a home run hitter. A home run hitter needs guys that are fast, and can get deep....not a big guy that catches passes 10 yards downfield. In fact, the short passing game is the weakness in Allen's game.

 

I'm not sure a TE will be the "safety blanket" that  most people here seem to think it will be for Allen.

On 4/11/2019 at 4:37 PM, njbuff said:

 

 

It's difficult to go against Gronk, but Kellen Winslow was my guy as he was a beast when healthy. He was very underrated for his blocking ability, but I think he is the greatest receiving TE who ever lived.

 

 

And maybe, just maybe, the biggest douchebag to ever play the position. Well, besides his son....

[HOUSE]

I should add drafting both Hockinson and Metcalf is not impossible. Would probably require a #2 & #3 to move up for an additional 1st rounder.

 

Probably won't happen but it could

 

 

..

Edited April 19, 2019 by HOUSE