SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted April 8, 2019 Posted April 8, 2019 17 minutes ago, Boca BIlls said: He has to be trolling no one could be that ignorant to not see what this team is trying to do. No one knows of it will work but saying they can't see the plan is scary knowing these people vote. LOL
#34fan Posted April 8, 2019 Posted April 8, 2019 11 hours ago, Boca BIlls said: He has to be trolling no one could be that ignorant to not see what this team is trying to do. No one knows of it will work but saying they can't see the plan is scary knowing these people vote. Trolling? Who acted like he knew the plan but went mute when asked to explain... Dead air... Is the wi-fi not reaching your mom's basement? 11 hours ago, ShadyBillsFan said: It's not that difficult. I can see the plan (aka process) for the past 3 seasons. I've questioned it for sure, but there is a plan. Clear the Cap hell Retool the Defense to a Top 10 Get your QB of the future while still doing 1 and 2 Build the Offense to support the young QB. The only thing truly not addressed (thus far) is a young (long term stud) RB. All I can say is that if you don't see the plan and actions taken to improve the team then maybe you just don't want to? 1. Fine. 2. It already was. 3., 4. Josh needs weapons that aren't hurt (Kroft) Ancient (Gore) and tiny (Brown, Beasley) Sorry, but I don't GAF what you and Boca-boy think. In two months the mosquitoes will be eating him alive, and this won't look any more like a plan than it does today. 13 hours ago, eball said: No, there's only one idiot hanging out in this thread... Yah, the guy who started it.
HardyBoy Posted April 8, 2019 Posted April 8, 2019 I just got to the bottom of page one, so not sure if it came out on the next 5 pages, but gotta be Gentlemen right?
Mat68 Posted April 9, 2019 Posted April 9, 2019 They retooled their poorest positions. Beasley was the best slot wr availabe, who gets open quickly underneath. Brown was the best deep threat available. Pairing him with Allen makes sense. The Oline was terrible. They added the best center, and 5 veterans who could either be the starter or main backup. After all of that they can get out of almost all those deals after 2019 or 2020 at the latest. Sitting at 9 they can do whatever they want. Auction it for a vetran Probowler. Draft a probable impact player. With the surplus of day 3 picks I would imagine they use them to move up to get more players day 2 or another one in the first. Until the draft has played out it's hard to say they have no plan. Whether it's running back, dline or weapons for Allen that leaves more to be desired, they all could be corrected.
LSHMEAB Posted April 9, 2019 Posted April 9, 2019 The most underrated aspect of the addition of Beasley is his ability to create space late in a play. Allen has a tendency to take off a bit early and slide around in the pocket, so a receiver able to improvise when the initial route is done is a plus.
Alphadawg7 Posted April 9, 2019 Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) On 4/7/2019 at 5:02 PM, #34fan said: So says the lucid, ever-positive, TBD elder-statesman... Unfortunately, I'm not reading a lot of winning into that plan... The unnamed exec is well within his rights to be skeptical if you're right... For example, I don't think two years in is the time to be figuring out "what they have" in their franchise QB. -That's what a rookie season is for... Lest we forget that these are NFL professionals with decades of experience between them. -They should all know what they have by now... To your point about development, I think JA has already proven he can not only develop, but also adapt, and improvise within an offense. Through his first eight games JA had 464 rushing yards. -That's more than Michael Vick had at the same point in his career. (418) Through weeks 11, 12, and 13 Allen averaged 111.7 rush ypg. -That's more than Zeke Elliot through the same period (97.1)... A kid like that deserves a better o-line, which I credit Mcbeane for addressing. However, he also deserves easier, more reliable passing targets. -Players who can actually score... Loading up on 2 sub 6-foot WR's, a TE coming off major foot surgery, and the oldest RB in the league does not inspire much confidence in McBeane's offensive planning. I'm waiting see what they do in the draft, but I submit that any plan that doesn't involve securing a top flight TE, and reliable #1 receiver for this Athletic, rocket-armed, QB, is misguided, and likely won't serve the team's best interest, A.K.A. winning football games. While I don't really disagree with a chunk of this, I so disagree a bit downplaying Cole and Brown signings as much as you are. Cole is going to be a tremendous asset to a young developing QB like Allen specifically. Look at Beanes comments about debunking the accuracy issue some talk about still with Allen. He said he doesn't see that, he sees a kid taking a lot more low percentage throws, many of which most QB's wouldn't even attempt because Josh is so competitive and has so much arm talent. Part of the coaching they are doing is getting him to take shorter options at times to keep the sticks moving and keep guys like Brady on the sidelines longer. Cole will be an excellent addition to this team in that regard. He is fast and twitchy and can quickly create openings and find creases all over the place for Josh underneath. Meanwhile, whether fans like or dislike Brown, the fact remains, the opposing defense is going to have to show both him and Foster great deep threat respect with Allens cannon, which will also open up other things underneath and mid range for Josh. Very much how Watkins impacted the Rams offense while not being highly productive, he was still double covered and respected as a major deep threat and guys like Woods and Kupp feasted and that helped Goff greatly. And I think its not only possible, but very likely that Beane will take BOTH a WR and TE in first few rounds of this draft. And I wont be shocked to see him end up with 3 or 4 picks in first 2 rounds after he maneuvers around, 2 of which I believe will include a WR and TE. Beane has made two things clear...he is comfortable with the state of the defense (obviously wont hesitate to improve it if the right pick is there early) and is prioritizing protection and weapons for Allen, and I do not think he is done. I do however think any OL drafted will come from mid rounds or later, I think they build that through FA and will go after 4 positions early in the draft...DL, WR, TE, RB. As of now, they got a ton to work with at the OL from FA. I think they are done investing big in into this offseason, so I dont expect any OL picks in first few picks. They can always go OL in the first next year if they didn't shore it up enough this FA. Edited April 9, 2019 by Alphadawg7
eball Posted April 9, 2019 Author Posted April 9, 2019 2 hours ago, #34fan said: Trolling? Who acted like he knew the plan but went mute when asked to explain... Dead air... Is the wi-fi not reaching your mom's basement? 1. Fine. 2. It already was. 3., 4. Josh needs weapons that aren't hurt (Kroft) Ancient (Gore) and tiny (Brown, Beasley) Sorry, but I don't GAF what you and Boca-boy think. In two months the mosquitoes will be eating him alive, and this won't look any more like a plan than it does today. Yah, the guy who started it. Dude, I give up. I feel like I’m trying to explain something to a child. Or Trump. Go on with your delusions. 1 2
#34fan Posted April 9, 2019 Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said: While I don't really disagree with a chunk of this, I so disagree a bit downplaying Cole and Brown signings as much as you are. Cole is going to be a tremendous asset to a young developing QB like Allen specifically. Look at Beanes comments about debunking the accuracy issue some talk about still with Allen. He said he doesn't see that, he sees a kid taking a lot more low percentage throws, many of which most QB's wouldn't even attempt because Josh is so competitive and has so much arm talent. Part of the coaching they are doing is getting him to take shorter options at times to keep the sticks moving and keep guys like Brady on the sidelines longer. Cole will be an excellent addition to this team in that regard. He is fast and twitchy and can quickly create openings and find creases all over the place for Josh underneath. I think Allen to Beasley can be a good thing... However, I can't dismiss Allen's 52.8% completion percentage VS. Dak Prescott's 67.7% completion perentage... While I don't believe it represents horrible inaccuracy issues on Josh's part, I do think it represents a QB that needs solid help... I look at WR's in systems where RB's get a lot of passing targets, and they often feast... Zeke was a mainstay in that DAL passing offense with 95 targets/77catches (81.1%rec) to Beasley's 87 targets/65 catches (74.7% rec.)... Bob Woods and Gurley were beasts for Jared Goff (64.9 completion%) with 130 targets/86 catches (66.2% rec.) and 81 targets/59 catches (72.8% rec.) respectively. Lesean McCoy by contrast racked up just 44 targets... Gurley and McCoy hauled in roughly the same percentage of balls from those targets (around 73%), but there were way more balls thrown at Gurley. Zay had the most targets of any Bills WR with 102 targets/56 catches (54.9 % rec.) with Benjamin catching just 23 out of 62 balls thrown his way (37.1% rec.) I see Beasley doing better in a system where the serious passing threats aren't just the WR's... I have more to add to this in the next reply. 5 hours ago, LSHMEAB said: The most underrated aspect of the addition of Beasley is his ability to create space late in a play. Allen has a tendency to take off a bit early and slide around in the pocket, so a receiver able to improvise when the initial route is done is a plus. The cream of last season's playoff TE's, Ebron, Ertz, Kelce all had 110+ targets during the 2019 season.... All 3 Bills TE's (Croom Thomas, Clay) combined for just 88 targets and 55 catches. Superbowl winning TE Rob Gronkowski had down year with just 72 targets/47 catches (65.3% rec).... The lions-share of passing targets for Brady went to RB James White! He was targeted 123 times and hauled in 87 balls (70.7% rec.) That eclipsed Julian Edelman's 108 targets/74 catches (65.8% rec.) Edelman and White were able to feast together, while Gronk kept a low profile. He would end up with 26.3% of his targets, and 27.6% of his catches in the post season. (When it mattered most) In 2018 Frank Gore played 14 games for MIA, but was targeted just 16 times for 12 catches... A good percentage (75% rec.) but paltry production... In fact, at age 36 his production in the passing game has steadily dropped over the past 3 seasons...He didn't even have any rushing TD's last year! McBeane would seem to be bucking a trend of young, feature backs helping-out, if not anchoring the passing game... It's been working for a lot of teams, -why not get on board? Again, I like Beasley, but if he's the class of our WR's at 5' 8", -getting nominal help in the passing game from other positions like RB and TE, I don't like his chances. A top TE (one named Hockenson preferably) and a stud value RB (there are several) would have the makings of a good plan to me. Not another plan to evaluate, or to 'see what we have'... A plan to win football games and take ownership of this friggin' division. Edited April 9, 2019 by #34fan
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted April 9, 2019 Posted April 9, 2019 9 hours ago, eball said: Dude, I give up. I feel like I’m trying to explain something to a child. Or Trump. Go on with your delusions. I tried to have a reasonable convo. I see now how difficult that is. 1
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted April 9, 2019 Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) 9 hours ago, #34fan said: I think Allen to Beasley can be a good thing... However, I can't dismiss Allen's 52.8% completion percentage VS. Dak Prescott's 67.7% completion perentage... While I don't believe it represents horrible inaccuracy issues on Josh's part, I do think it represents a QB that needs solid help... I look at WR's in systems where RB's get a lot of passing targets, and they often feast... Zeke was a mainstay in that DAL passing offense with 95 targets/77catches (81.1%rec) to Beasley's 87 targets/65 catches (74.7% rec.)... Bob Woods and Gurley were beasts for Jared Goff (64.9 completion%) with 130 targets/86 catches (66.2% rec.) and 81 targets/59 catches (72.8% rec.) respectively. I don't get you. You downplayed Bease and then you post his #'s Cole Beasley - has a catch rate of 74.7%. That's 34 th of over 200 players on pro football reference stats page His rate is better than Danny Amendola (#35), Adam Thielen (43), Cooper Kupp (55), Sammy Watkins (56), Julian Edelman (87), JuJu Smith-Schuster*(97), Rob Gronkowski (115) Edited April 9, 2019 by ShadyBillsFan
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted April 9, 2019 Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) The Bills have Shady, Gore, Zay, Beasley, Brown - They can win with that line up and win now! 1 Minute in he hits his mark Edited April 9, 2019 by ShadyBillsFan
billsfan1959 Posted April 9, 2019 Posted April 9, 2019 9 hours ago, #34fan said: Not another plan to evaluate, or to 'see what we have'... A plan to win football games and take ownership of this friggin' division. This statement is so lacking in any sort of objective observations of what this team is doing that it borders on completely nonsensical....
LSHMEAB Posted April 9, 2019 Posted April 9, 2019 16 hours ago, #34fan said: Again, I like Beasley, but if he's the class of our WR's at 5' 8", -getting nominal help in the passing game from other positions like RB and TE, I don't like his chances. I didn't really disagree with much of what you said. I'm not a cockeyed optimist. Just noting that Beasley's ability to improvise should theoretically help a QB like Allen who likes to extend plays(sometimes unnecessarily). Outside of Morse, the free agents we picked up are average starters. Even Morse is really only marginally above average. The draft is going to be key in finding impact players. 1
#34fan Posted April 10, 2019 Posted April 10, 2019 On 4/8/2019 at 6:58 PM, eball said: Dude, I give up. I feel like I’m trying to explain something to a child. Or Trump. Go on with your delusions. 15 hours ago, ShadyBillsFan said: I tried to have a reasonable convo. I see now how difficult that is. You'll be pleased to know that I'm yielding from my previous stance... After some research, and deep personal reflection, Mcbeane's designs do appear less clouded than before... Admittedly, when broken down and put into context, the off-season moves seem more transparent, and methodical than previously thought... As much as it pains me to admit this, I am starting to see 'a plan'. A plan to get this entire regime fired by January. Why the hell else would you overpay for an ex-arena-league tackle who's never started more than 5 games in any of his 5 NFL seasons?( Nsekhe) Or, sign a guard from an o-line that allowed more sacks on the QB than any team in their division? (Spain) Or, sign a center/guard best known for his snaps over the QB's head? (Long) I won't even mention the RB old enough to have fathered the starting MLB! -Oops, I kinda mentioned that, sorry! 7 hours ago, LSHMEAB said: I didn't really disagree with much of what you said. I'm not a cockeyed optimist. Just noting that Beasley's ability to improvise should theoretically help a QB like Allen who likes to extend plays(sometimes unnecessarily). Outside of Morse, the free agents we picked up are average starters. Even Morse is really only marginally above average. The draft is going to be key in finding impact players. Look, Cole Beasley is solid. Full stop. However, It's difficult to take on blind faith that Daboll can fashion an offense where specialty players like Beasley and Brown can thrive. The simple fact is that he hasn't been able to succeed in any of his previous stints as OC, and has yet to prove himself capable of making our own offense consistent. To your point about finding "impact players", I feel like the early picks should be made with a range of production in mind... For example, I would target a WR/TE I thought could handle 120-150 targets per season, catching at least 70% of those balls at 12-15ypr... That's the minimum standard for a #1 WR/TE in this league. That's what most of divisional champs are working with at the moment. I'd also target a RB that could bear a minimum of 80 targets in the passing game per season, -catching 75% of those balls for 8-10ypr, and still giving me 70-75 ypg on the ground. To me, that's the gold standard.. Think of what pieces like that could open up for a guy like Beasley who seems to excel in a system where the feature back is an established passing threat, and he's overlooked as a legit #2 WR because of his size. 1
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted April 10, 2019 Posted April 10, 2019 that's bet worthy. If Beane and McDermott get fired after this season I will change my name to Shady#34Fan If Beane and McDermott do not get fired after this season ..... you will ....... (suggestions welcome)
eball Posted April 10, 2019 Author Posted April 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said: that's bet worthy. If Beane and McDermott get fired after this season I will change my name to Shady#34Fan If Beane and McDermott do not get fired after this season ..... you will ....... (suggestions welcome) ...spend schedule release day with @Jay_Fixit 1
Jay_Fixit Posted April 10, 2019 Posted April 10, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, eball said: ...spend schedule release day with @Jay_Fixit I’ll probably be out for a nice steak dinner, then get a notification the schedule is released, look at my phone, say the word “neat” and then finish my dinner, a few bevs and head home. If you can handle not being prepped and all geared up for finding out some dates against opponents we already know are being played, you’re welcome to join. Edited April 10, 2019 by Jay_Fixit
GunnerBill Posted April 10, 2019 Posted April 10, 2019 On 4/9/2019 at 6:22 AM, #34fan said: Not another plan to evaluate, or to 'see what we have'... A plan to win football games and take ownership of this friggin' division. If what they have (Allen) is good, then they will win lots of football games. Do we still lack elite playmakers at TE and WR? Yep. I am not as high on Hock as you, but I do think this is a good TE draft and there will be guys who can develop into top flight difference makers in later rounds. I like Josh Oliver from San Jose State a lot. I think he could end up the best tight end in this class. He runs routes like a receiver, has very good speed for the position and has good hands and contested catch ability. His blocking is a work in progress but he is certainly no liability as a blocker and he could come in and be a 3 down guy pretty early on to my mind. Also worth saying I think Tyler Kroft was a really good pickup. He will surprise some people I suspect and is a definite upgrade on what we had. At WR I just don't think there is an elite difference maker in this draft. There are some guys who can play.... but I don't see an elite, true, number 1 guy. Nor was there one available in FA. I suspect the Bills recognised both of these facts hence they were in on Antonio Brown. Getting a true #1 might have to wait another year.
Bobby Hooks Posted April 10, 2019 Posted April 10, 2019 24 minutes ago, Jay_Fixit said: I’ll probably be out for a nice steak dinner, then get a notification the schedule is released, look at my phone, say the word “neat” and then finish my dinner, a few bevs and head home. If you can handle not being prepped and all geared up for finding out some dates against opponents we already know are being played, you’re welcome to join. Guys, please stop! I’m excited as it is, I can’t constantly be reminded it’s almost here. Oh! Why can’t it just be schedule release day... TODAY?!?!
foreboding Posted April 10, 2019 Posted April 10, 2019 On 4/5/2019 at 7:59 AM, JoeF said: $5 Million a year for a tackle is really not a lot. And if Nsekhe sucks this year the out is $1.5 million next. So I definitely don't understand that one. These contracts for the second tier offensive lineman other than Morse are essentially all one-year deals (Waddle and Spain) or prove it deals (Long, Feliciano and Nsekhe)...Brown was projected to get more than the Bills paid by most pundits and has shined when he is paired with a QB with a good deep ball. The Johnson signing I can see room for critique but the Bills have his old Corner Coach who knows him best and then the Bills signed Gaines for insurance. If each Johnson and Gaines give us 1/2 a season ;-), they have earned their pay. Easy to refute everything that was said by the anonymous source. I agree, this Bills FA O-Line strategy seems to me as if Beane is mining the NFL for nuggets of gold and risking moderate amounts of cash to do it. Of course we would all like a sure-fire FA, but who the hell wants to pay that much? He is assembling a group who all have experience and are hungry and the best will stay. Some are hungry vets, some are younger guys who were stuck behind established players. I think this looks like a great strategy and not unlike the Pats.
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