Unpopular Take. The Bills should trade for Rosen

[Tenhigh]

11 hours ago, Zerovotlz said:

.....In 1989, Jimmy Johnson, having just drafted Troy Aikman, 1/1, used what ended up being his 1990 first round draft pick in the 1989 Supplemental draft on QB Steve Walsh from the U.  Some of you may remember Walsh was a big time college QB at the time.  Johnson, when asked why he had done this said that QB was too important to get wrong.  He needed to make sure he had one.  No one really remembers much about it because Aikman won that competition, went on to win 3 Super Bowls...and Walsh was traded to the Saints for draft picks.  ....keep that in mind....

 

As much as many of you have cherry picked the stats to pieces and conjured up every possible scenario to hide the blight of Josh Allens horrendous 52% completion PCT....the fact is, as exciting and athlietic as he is...Josh Allen is still a major question mark to everyone outside western New York (yes Bills fans...where you see a an ascending future MVP QB, the rest of the country sees a gifted athlete who isn't a good thrower)  

 

Rosen is cheap.  He can be had for a 2nd round draft pick.

 

While the Bills certainly still have plenty of spots to fill and could use that 2nd to do that....what if you had Rosen on hand in case Josh Allen can't get that Comp % up above 55?  What if you had the next blue chip prospect already on your roster and under contract if it turns out you've rebuilt the roster, have all this young talent ready to go, and your QB turns out to be a bust?  You wouldn't need to rebuild again...you'd have Rosen ready to go.

 

You might argure making such a move would damage Allens confidence.  Maybe it would...but Aikman handled Johnson drafting Walsh, manned up and won that battle.  If Allen has the fortitude he's said to posses around here...he'd compete.  

 

If Allen did turn out to be what you all are hoping for, Rosen would remain something of an unknown blue chip prospect that had value and could be traded for something useful next year.  

 

If the object of having a pro football team is to WIN...then getting QB right is worth making this kind of move.  That's why Jimmy did it.  Just something to think about....these kind of situations don't come around often.

Interesting take. But realistically,  I think it's a better bet for the Chiefs should probably pick him up.  If Allen sucks,  the Bills won't win any games and can draft a QB early in 2020.  But If it turns out that Mahomes doesn't have the stones to beat Brady in a playoff game, you guys have too much talent on that team to be able to draft a decent QB to replace the Mahomes.  He could turn out to be the next RG3, a one year wonder.  What then?

[Zerovoltz]

 

13 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

• This isn't 1989 ... in case you didn't notice.
• The Cowboys essentially traded the #1 overall pick in 1990 (they crapped the bed again) for the opportunity to draft another QB at the end of the 1989 draft who ended up a career backup, who in a 10 year career, was active for all of 80 games, threw 40 TDs and 50 INTs.  How, exactly, is this a move to emulate???? 
• With the salary cap, no team can realistically afford to use so much cap space on 2 unproven first round QBs from the same draft class for "insurance". 
• How do you know that "Rosen is cheap"?  Except for speculation by media sports mavens, there's no indication that Rosen is even on the market.  

 

.....if Jimmy Johnson knew Aikman would be the man then he of course in hindsight wouldn’t have also aquired Walsh.  He didn’t know what he had.  He got both with the idea that one of them would hit.  

 

With the rookie pay scale, it’s actually never been easier to afford two of these guys at once.

 

Rosen will likely fetch a second round pick.  That is cheap for a QB that still has “potential”.  

 

 

3 minutes ago, Tenhigh said:

Interesting take. But realistically,  I think it's a better bet for the Chiefs should probably pick him up.  If Allen sucks,  the Bills won't win any games and can draft a QB early in 2020.  But If it turns out that Mahomes doesn't have the stones to beat Brady in a playoff game, you guys have too much talent on that team to be able to draft a decent QB to replace the Mahomes.  He could turn out to be the next RG3, a one year wonder.  What then?

 

.......another person who clearly hasn’t read the thread.  I DO want KC to get him.  

[Wsam4031]

11 hours ago, Zerovotlz said:

.....In 1989, Jimmy Johnson, having just drafted Troy Aikman, 1/1, used what ended up being his 1990 first round draft pick in the 1989 Supplemental draft on QB Steve Walsh from the U.  Some of you may remember Walsh was a big time college QB at the time.  Johnson, when asked why he had done this said that QB was too important to get wrong.  He needed to make sure he had one.  No one really remembers much about it because Aikman won that competition, went on to win 3 Super Bowls...and Walsh was traded to the Saints for draft picks.  ....keep that in mind....

 

As much as many of you have cherry picked the stats to pieces and conjured up every possible scenario to hide the blight of Josh Allens horrendous 52% completion PCT....the fact is, as exciting and athlietic as he is...Josh Allen is still a major question mark to everyone outside western New York (yes Bills fans...where you see a an ascending future MVP QB, the rest of the country sees a gifted athlete who isn't a good thrower)  

 

Rosen is cheap.  He can be had for a 2nd round draft pick.

 

While the Bills certainly still have plenty of spots to fill and could use that 2nd to do that....what if you had Rosen on hand in case Josh Allen can't get that Comp % up above 55?  What if you had the next blue chip prospect already on your roster and under contract if it turns out you've rebuilt the roster, have all this young talent ready to go, and your QB turns out to be a bust?  You wouldn't need to rebuild again...you'd have Rosen ready to go.

 

You might argure making such a move would damage Allens confidence.  Maybe it would...but Aikman handled Johnson drafting Walsh, manned up and won that battle.  If Allen has the fortitude he's said to posses around here...he'd compete.  

 

If Allen did turn out to be what you all are hoping for, Rosen would remain something of an unknown blue chip prospect that had value and could be traded for something useful next year.  

 

If the object of having a pro football team is to WIN...then getting QB right is worth making this kind of move.  That's why Jimmy did it.  Just something to think about....these kind of situations don't come around often.

he cant be had for a 2nd. They were already offered a 2nd and turned it down. They want a 1st and will probably get it. Not hanks we have the better Josh already

[Tenhigh]

2 minutes ago, Zerovotlz said:

 

 

.....if Jimmy Johnson knew Aikman would be the man then he of course in hindsight wouldn’t have also aquired Walsh.  He didn’t know what he had.  He got both with the idea that one of them would hit.  

 

With the rookie pay scale, it’s actually never been easier to afford two of these guys at once.

 

Rosen will likely fetch a second round pick.  That is cheap for a QB that still has “potential”.  

 

 

 

.......another person who clearly hasn’t read the thread.  I DO want KC to get him.  

So you agree that when Mahomes becomes the next RG3 you should have another solution?  

[nucci]

1 hour ago, Zerovotlz said:

go back a couple pages....I'm not Jeffismagic or crayon eater or anyone else.

 

no, you are special, though

[CLTbills]

11 hours ago, Zerovotlz said:

 

For the millionth time....if EVERY QB in the NFL had 2 less drops a game, their pct would also be higher.  ....By this theory Josh Allen has had the unusual bad luck to have been around nothing but a bunch of butterfingers catching his passes since he was 12 apparently.

Did you watch any of our games and see the receivers he was throwing to?

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

9 minutes ago, Zerovotlz said:

Rosen will likely fetch a second round pick.  That is cheap for a QB that still has “potential”.  

We don't need Rosen on this team.   

 

We have the right Josh and he's good enough for me. 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/good-morning-football/0ap3000001020903/How-does-Josh-Rosen-compare-to-2019-rookie-quarterback-prospects

 

watch the video....  It says a lot.  

This years QB crop isn't All That ....

 

how many put Rosen on top?  

[Zerovoltz]

Just now, Wsam4031 said:

he cant be had for a 2nd. They were already offered a 2nd and turned it down. They want a 1st and will probably get it. Not hanks we have the better Josh already

 

4 minutes ago, Tenhigh said:

So you agree that when Mahomes becomes the next RG3 you should have another solution?  

 

The answer to Which backup QB would I rather have?  Chad Henne or Josh Rosen?  The answer is Rosen.  If for some reason Mahomes gets hurt, sucks whatever the reason, then I would love to have Rosen as my next man up.  As of today, he is still a well thought of prospect with potential.  The Chiefs current back up, Chad Henne is NOT.

 

if Allen were to bust, get hurt, etc, the question here is would you want Matt Barkley or Josh Rosen as the next man up?  

 

That is is what the thread is about.  The Arizona Cardinals, are about to put Rosen on the market (they should take Murray and keep Rosen, but they aren’t). 

 

It it presents an interesting set of circumstances where a QB with a potentially high cieling, will be available at a relatively low price and inexpensive rookie contract 

 

 

[TAinLack.]

with all due respect...……………………………………………………………, I got nothing!!!

[BigBuff423]

In a storied history of terrible takes on this board....*this* one, must be near the top 5. 

[DCOrange]

12 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Welcome back Jeffismagic.  

I only know this because I've seen his comments on Rumblings...me and him were both very low on Rosen going into the draft and remain low on him. I had him as a late 1st round type prospect; Jeff didn't even consider him to be a first round guy.

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

Bottom Line:  Bills got their QB; the back-up Barkley just signed a 2-year extension and is of more value to the development of Allen and the overall team than Rosen would be;  Rosen would just be a distraction.  The front office would lose all credibility doing this, showing they have no confidence in Allen (which we know is not true) and by blowing a 2nd round pick when they could have gotten another young WR, DT, TE, etc.   It's not going to happen, time for this thread to DIE.

[Zerovoltz]

1 minute ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

Bottom Line:  Bills got their QB; the back-up Barkley just signed a 2-year extension and is of more value to the development of Allen and the overall team than Rosen would be;  Rosen would just be a distraction.  The front office would lose all credibility doing this, showing they have no confidence in Allen (which we know is not true) and by blowing a 2nd round pick when they could have gotten another young WR, DT, TE, etc.   It's not going to happen, time for this thread to DIE.

 

This is a perfectly rational counterpoint.  

[Rebel101]

12 hours ago, Zerovotlz said:

.....In 1989, Jimmy Johnson, having just drafted Troy Aikman, 1/1, used what ended up being his 1990 first round draft pick in the 1989 Supplemental draft on QB Steve Walsh from the U.  Some of you may remember Walsh was a big time college QB at the time.  Johnson, when asked why he had done this said that QB was too important to get wrong.  He needed to make sure he had one.  No one really remembers much about it because Aikman won that competition, went on to win 3 Super Bowls...and Walsh was traded to the Saints for draft picks.  ....keep that in mind....

 

As much as many of you have cherry picked the stats to pieces and conjured up every possible scenario to hide the blight of Josh Allens horrendous 52% completion PCT....the fact is, as exciting and athlietic as he is...Josh Allen is still a major question mark to everyone outside western New York (yes Bills fans...where you see a an ascending future MVP QB, the rest of the country sees a gifted athlete who isn't a good thrower)  

 

Rosen is cheap.  He can be had for a 2nd round draft pick.

 

While the Bills certainly still have plenty of spots to fill and could use that 2nd to do that....what if you had Rosen on hand in case Josh Allen can't get that Comp % up above 55?  What if you had the next blue chip prospect already on your roster and under contract if it turns out you've rebuilt the roster, have all this young talent ready to go, and your QB turns out to be a bust?  You wouldn't need to rebuild again...you'd have Rosen ready to go.

 

You might argure making such a move would damage Allens confidence.  Maybe it would...but Aikman handled Johnson drafting Walsh, manned up and won that battle.  If Allen has the fortitude he's said to posses around here...he'd compete.  

 

If Allen did turn out to be what you all are hoping for, Rosen would remain something of an unknown blue chip prospect that had value and could be traded for something useful next year.  

 

If the object of having a pro football team is to WIN...then getting QB right is worth making this kind of move.  That's why Jimmy did it.  Just something to think about....these kind of situations don't come around often.

I’m sure a lot of people of calling for your head. But honestly there has been numerous occasions in the NFL where a team has taken 2 QBs. I wouldn’t mind it and I’ve heard he might be available for a 3rd. McBeane has been trying to put competition at every position but he’s also said they are set at QB. So I dunno if they’d do it but it would be interesting and odds are one of them will work out

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

Teams like the Chargers, Patriots, Giants, Broncos, etc make sense because they have aging QBs coming to the end of their careers and you could arguably get a QB with a 1st round grade for the cost of a 2nd/3rd round pick (depending on how desperate AZ is in trading him).

[Shamrock]

How much of that was the college coach wanting his college quarterback when opportunity presented?

[chris heff]

Luckily everyone that thinks this is a good idea is not named Brandon Beane.

[Bray Wyatt]

With all thats been said, I dont think I have seen anyone else say it, but our team should not be trading a 2nd round pick for an insurance policy as the OP states. Notice the teams that are interested in doing so are teams that have most of their pieces in place and can afford to use a pick like that on insurance or for future consideration. We are not in that place yet. 

[SoTier]

2 hours ago, Zerovotlz said:

 

 

.....if Jimmy Johnson knew Aikman would be the man then he of course in hindsight wouldn’t have also aquired Walsh.  He didn’t know what he had.  He got both with the idea that one of them would hit.  

 

With the rookie pay scale, it’s actually never been easier to afford two of these guys at once.

 

Rosen will likely fetch a second round pick.  That is cheap for a QB that still has “potential”.  

 

 

Aikman is irrelevant.  Johnson essentially screwed the pooch by giving up the #1 pick in the 1990 draft pick for a QB who was still available after 336 picks in 1989.   The chances of Walsh "hitting" anything besides an opposing DB in the hands were infinitesimal.

 

Even under the rookie pay scale, a first round QB goes for at least $5 or $6 million a year, which is the going rate for a backup QB who can win a few games for a team (like Tannehill).  Nobody knows if Rosen can develop half as well as Tannehill.

 

The Bills have way too many needs to waste a second round pick on a backup QB. 

 

Johnson's move was an utter fail in 1989.  The Bills attempting to recreate it (at least in your mind) by trading a 2nd rounder for Rosen in 2019 is simply too stupid to merit any consideration.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Maybe Someday]

While I'm sure that Beane & Co have at least had this discussion, it was most likely a very brief one.  There are just too many reasons why this wouldn't make any sense for a team like the Bills or even the Chiefs.  If he goes anywhere, Rosen will go to a team that is currently or will soon be looking for their franchise QB, not one that believes they have drafted one in the past 3 years.  All of those teams, the Bills and Chiefs included, are all in on the guy they drafted and will use those resources to build a team around them.  In the salary cap and FA era, that 1st or 2nd round pick that it would take to get Rosen is too valuable for any team to use on a player that they hope will never see the field.  Teams need contributions from players while they are on those rookie deals.  Anyone who trades a 1st or 2nd round pick for Rosen does so expecting him to be their starter in the very near future, not to be insurance.