Does it seem like the Bills are adding FA more selectively and with more purpose this year as opposed to previous years?

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS said:

it is just possible Beane and McDermott are the first true professionals we have had running the FO since the 90s.

 

...just trying to antagonize the "fire McBeane and McDermott now!" crowd??.....j/k......McBeane assembled his "Gang of 17 (staff)" made up of several NFL VP's of Player Personnel and Directors of Pro Player Personnel execs ALL on Pegula's nickel.....guessing a $5+ mil payroll including McBeane....McDermott has orchestrated the long awaited and long needed "culture cleanup"......like the "either you're in or you're out...NO exceptions" inference......this gang beats the snot out of ANY "F Troop" misfits running the show post Polian...AND....could even exceed the Polian era....stay tuned.....

[3rdand12]

1 hour ago, ProcessAccepted said:

I think it's more than that. How we freed up all the cash and how quickly we got involved in FA clearly shows that there is a well thought out strategy at play here. This is a very different organization from the Whaley power struggle game of thrones that we had before 

Focused. determined and disciplined.
amazing to experience from a Fans pov , for me at least.

[ROCBillsBeliever]

46 minutes ago, billsredneck1 said:

what are we gonna do with a dozen line guys and a dozen receivers?...seriously?

 

 

[3rdand12]

16 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Yes, this.  While there might be a lot of line and receivers, I can only see a handful at best of locks from each position.

some very good competition at a healthy number of Offensive positions. Must be a hell of a locker room

[DCbillsfan]

6 minutes ago, RPbillsfan said:

The NFL has a huge gap in even average offensive lineman, the Bills have added depth and with cap space they can hold onto guys like Ducasse and Bodine until after the draft and see if they can trade them for late round picks in 2020.

 

its all about building depth at as many positions as financially possible.

I have to agree.  Especially after the Bengals signed Miller to 3 yrs $16.5 M.  Somebody will probably be interested in Ducasse and Bodine.  They have a lot of starting experience.

[3rdand12]

7 minutes ago, RPbillsfan said:

The NFL has a huge gap in even average offensive lineman, the Bills have added depth and with cap space they can hold onto guys like Ducasse and Bodine until after the draft and see if they can trade them for late round picks in 2020.

 

its all about building depth at as many positions as financially possible.

good points.

 

i agree.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

5 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said:

Focused. determined and disciplined.
amazing to experience from a Fans pov , for me at least.

 

...'bout DAMN TIME bud...and mega kudos to the Pegulas for PUBLICLY owning up to their mistakes/gaffes early on to get us to where we are today with NO expense spared regarding FO and coaching......throw in new workout facility ($18 mil) and new field surface for good measure.......like the Allstate guy said, "you're in good hands with....the Pegulas (paraphrased)".......this era has the potential to top the Polian era IMO....

[ColoradoBills]

58 minutes ago, billsredneck1 said:

what are we gonna do with a dozen line guys and a dozen receivers?...seriously?

 

I say keep signing better FAs to compete.  Draft the BPAs.

There is plenty of room at the bottom of the completion list.

Is anyone going to truly upset for Di'Mari Scott, Cam Phillips, Vlad, Sirles if these guys get pushed off the roster before camp?

 

Like many others have said, it's a new and exciting time for the Bills!

Edited March 23, 2019 by ColoradoBills

[JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS]

29 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...just trying to antagonize the "fire McBeane and McDermott now!" crowd??.....j/k......McBeane assembled his "Gang of 17 (staff)" made up of several NFL VP's of Player Personnel and Directors of Pro Player Personnel execs ALL on Pegula's nickel.....guessing a $5+ mil payroll including McBeane....McDermott has orchestrated the long awaited and long needed "culture cleanup"......like the "either you're in or you're out...NO exceptions" inference......this gang beats the snot out of ANY "F Troop" misfits running the show post Polian...AND....could even exceed the Polian era....stay tuned.....

credit to Pegulas for all this … and firing Russ was HUGE step forward.

 

Pegs aint cheap!

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Actually they are being far less selective. Beane is making volume moves and hoping he hits a few. That is not a criticism. Its a perfectly fine strategy and it is what Belichick did in his first couple of years with Patriots.

Beane has added 5 OL only one of which was a full time starter last year, Morse. The rest are journeymen that we have to hope are better than Miller, Mills, and Teller while improving the overall depth of talent. I'm more worried about RT than any other spot. I really don't think they have improved over Mills so far, but I also think they will draft OT relatively high in the draft.

The OL success may be mostly determined by Morse though. Did he overpay? Depends on how you frame the question. Beane likely paid market value but I doubt even this board thinks Morse is the #1 center in the league as he is now being paid. If i'm Beane I keep Bodine. He was adequate and they have the cap room to keep him.

As for WR. He added speed and slot guys but they still don't have a true #1. I'm perfectly fine with that. I think both strategies can work. A dominant #1 like AB, AJ, or Julio works just as effectively as a group with multiple threats. I can't wait to see Foster, Brown, and Beasely line up in a bunch formation. Add a star TE and the group can be much better than last year.

 

Edited March 23, 2019 by Ethan in Portland

[Ronin]

2 hours ago, Florida Bills Fanatic said:

It has occurred to me over the last few days that Beane has taken a very strategic approach to the FA's that he has signed.  None of them just scream "camp fodder" to me. They all seem to address an obvious need.  Under previous regimes, we were signing players that didn't address an obvious need and that most of us knew would not make the final 53 or the practice squad.  Am I just drinking the Kool-Aid or has there really been a change?

 

They all scream back-up/depth to me.  

 

Either way, they're not much better than what we have.  I like the Morse signing but he's missed nearly half of his games over the past two seasons due to injury.  That's risky.  If he misses even three or four games this season it won't be good and will render his signing questionable.  

 

Otherwise, there isn't a player that we've signed that made a big impact on their former teams.  They're all categorically in that mediocre-average range for the most part.  

 

I don't see a plan, frankly, other than for what you say, namely as camp fodder with the "pool of average-mediocre" simply being larger to choose from, presumably thereby hoping that one or more players will emerge as something greater than what thye've been elsewhere.  That doesn't sound like much of a strategy to me.  

 

To McBeane's credit, there wasn't a whole lot available at top levels this season offensively speaking in free agency.  Having said that, every seasoned football fan knows that teams are built via the draft, not via free agency which is more used to plug holes and leaks.  

 

The offensive strategy for McBeane to date has left us in this unenviable position of having an offense all but completely bereft of starting caliber talent.  Excuses can be made, "reasons" given, but that's the state of the O right now and it's on them.  

 

To add some relevance to that, I've seen a whole lot of people applauding the WR Brown and Beasley signings.  They've both averaged only a few TDs season and not any more yards than any other WR we currently have.  So, if Brown's going to be a bona fide #1 WR, as I've read more than just a few people suggest while applauding McBeane, then he'll have to add then again at least 50% more to his average annual stat-line than he's averaged.  Also, I posted elsewhere that he's had only few deep TDs in his career, lastly notable in '14 & '15 with Palmer playing QB.  He's also bottom-dwelling in terms of catch-%, almost as bad as Jones is. 

 

As to Beasley, same thing.  Are we expecting his numbers to then again increase by 50% over his average?  Would that make sense to expect that?  Re: him, he'll be playing a position that Allen overlooked in terms of finding open receivers last season.  Beasley's good, but he's not the type of WR that Allen utilizes to that extent.  

 

Between 'em they've averaged 542 yards/season.  Is that something to get excited about?  

Between 'em they've averaged 3.75 TDs/season.  Is that something to get excited about?  

Between 'em, of their 45 TDs, only 7 have been greater than 24 yards.  Only 4 have been greater than 33 yards.  Does that fit the "deep game" narrative that we hear incessantly?  Is it anything even approaching being game-changing to the point where it'll win games for us?  

 

Either way, I'm not seeing much of departure here from the free-agency methodologies of the first two season to be honest.  

 

Just my two-cents.  

Edited March 23, 2019 by TaskersGhost

[LabattBlue]

Nothing but paper transactions at this point.  Until live bullets start flying, no one really knows if the moves are good, bad or somewhere in between.

[oldmanfan]

3 minutes ago, TaskersGhost said:

 

They all scream back-up/depth to me.  

 

Either way, they're not much better than what we have.  I like the Morse signing but he's missed nearly half of his games over the past two seasons due to injury.  That's risky.  If he misses even three or four games this season it won't be good and will render his signing questionable.  

 

Otherwise, there isn't a player that we've signed that made a big impact on their former teams.  They're all categorically in that mediocre-average range for the most part.  

 

I don't see a plan, frankly, other than for what you say, namely as camp fodder with the "pool of average-mediocre" simply being larger to choose from, presumably thereby hoping that one or more players will emerge as something greater than what thye've been elsewhere.  That doesn't sound like much of a strategy to me.  

 

To McBeane's credit, there wasn't a whole lot available at top levels this season offensively speaking in free agency.  Having said that, every seasoned football fan knows that teams are built via the draft, not via free agency which is more used to plug holes and leaks.  

 

The offensive strategy for McBeane to date has left us in this unenviable position of having an offense all but completely bereft of starting caliber talent.  Excuses can be made, "reasons" given, but that's the state of the O right now and it's on them.  

 

To add some relevance to that, I've seen a whole lot of people applauding the WR Brown and Beasley signings.  They've both averaged only a few TDs season and not any more yards than any other WR we currently have.  So, if Brown's going to be a bona fide #1 WR, as I've read more than just a few people suggest while applauding McBeane, then he'll have to add then again at least 50% more to his average annual stat-line than he's averaged.  Also, I posted elsewhere that he's had only few deep TDs in his career, lastly notable in '14 & '15 with Palmer playing QB.  He's also bottom-dwelling in terms of catch-%, almost as bad as Jones is. 

 

As to Beasley, same thing.  Are we expecting his numbers to then again increase by 50% over his average?  Would that make sense to expect that?  Re: him, he'll be playing a position that Allen overlooked in terms of finding open receivers last season.  Beasley's good, but he's not the type of WR that Allen utilizes to that extent.  

 

Either way, I'm not seeing much of departure here from the free-agency methodologies of the first two season to be honest.  

 

Just my two-cents.  

I don't think you get it.  The only thing to analyze is whether the guys brought in represent improvements.  And if you don't think the guys they've brought in are better it's because you don't want to.

[Logic]

7 minutes ago, TaskersGhost said:

 

They all scream back-up/depth to me.  

 

Either way, they're not much better than what we have.  I like the Morse signing but he's missed nearly half of his games over the past two seasons due to injury.  That's risky.  If he misses even three or four games this season it won't be good and will render his signing questionable.  

 

Otherwise, there isn't a player that we've signed that made a big impact on their former teams.  They're all categorically in that mediocre-average range for the most part.  

 

I don't see a plan, frankly, other than for what you say, namely as camp fodder with the "pool of average-mediocre" simply being larger to choose from, presumably thereby hoping that one or more players will emerge as something greater than what thye've been elsewhere.  That doesn't sound like much of a strategy to me.  

 

To McBeane's credit, there wasn't a whole lot available at top levels this season offensively speaking in free agency.  Having said that, every seasoned football fan knows that teams are built via the draft, not via free agency which is more used to plug holes and leaks.  

 

The offensive strategy for McBeane to date has left us in this unenviable position of having an offense all but completely bereft of starting caliber talent.  Excuses can be made, "reasons" given, but that's the state of the O right now and it's on them.  

 

To add some relevance to that, I've seen a whole lot of people applauding the WR Brown and Beasley signings.  They've both averaged only a few TDs season and not any more yards than any other WR we currently have.  So, if Brown's going to be a bona fide #1 WR, as I've read more than just a few people suggest while applauding McBeane, then he'll have to add then again at least 50% more to his average annual stat-line than he's averaged.  Also, I posted elsewhere that he's had only few deep TDs in his career, lastly notable in '14 & '15 with Palmer playing QB.  He's also bottom-dwelling in terms of catch-%, almost as bad as Jones is. 

 

As to Beasley, same thing.  Are we expecting his numbers to then again increase by 50% over his average?  Would that make sense to expect that?  Re: him, he'll be playing a position that Allen overlooked in terms of finding open receivers last season.  Beasley's good, but he's not the type of WR that Allen utilizes to that extent.  

 

Between 'em they've averaged 542 yards/season.  Is that something to get excited about?  

Between 'em they've averaged 3.75 TDs/season.  Is that something to get excited about?  

Between 'em, of their 45 TDs, only 7 have been greater than 24 yards.  Only 4 have been greater than 33 yards.  Does that fit the "deep game" narrative that we hear incessantly?  Is it anything even approaching being game-changing to the point where it'll win games for us?  

 

Either way, I'm not seeing much of departure here from the free-agency methodologies of the first two season to be honest.  

 

Just my two-cents.  

The below chart makes very clear what the Bills are doing. They have less money committed on big contracts than any team in the league. Why is this? I would postulate it ties into why they have only been signing average to slightly above average players to no more than modest contracts: They are planning to do the majority of their spending on the retention of their own young core in the coming years: Milano, Edmunds, White, Allen, Dawkins, [Edge draftee], etc, etc.

Rather than spending big chunks of their cap on overpaid free agents, they are meticulously and intelligently allocating their money in a way that will allow them to retain all of their own home grown talent, rather than be forced to watch anyone walk away because the Bills can't afford their contract demands.

It's a breath of fresh air and a massive change from the way things were done under Whaley.
 

 

[Ronin]

17 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I don't think you get it.  The only thing to analyze is whether the guys brought in represent improvements.  And if you don't think the guys they've brought in are better it's because you don't want to.

 

Oh, I think I do. 

 

Also, according to who, what, the narrative?  

 

I don't think that they are.  I just added to my post, reread it and tell me where you disagree.  

 

I'm interested as to why you, not anyone else, thinks that they're a whole lot better than what we have? 

 

As well, allow me to put it another way, suppose that all of these new players start.  Do you really think that they represent an above average team?  

 

I'm happy to go thru them one-by-one with you, pick one and we'll start.  But I can tell you that if Brown and Beasley are our #'s 1 & 2 WRs, well, I'm not exactly thinking division winners here, or even playoffs based on that.  

 

Sorry, but no, I'm not seeing how a pair of WRs that have one 1,000-season between 'em, and barely at that, and that have each averaged a mere 3-4 TDs/season are somehow our Smith-Shuster/AB or Woods/Cooks tandem.  Seems to me that Foster just did that and Jones too, and neither of them are good pending whether Foster's three good games can translate to an entirely good season.  Either way, you're talking about free-agents, not what's here.  If I had my choice I'd pick Foster over Brown and take my lumps.  

 

As to Morse, do you not think that there's an injury risk for a player that's missed nearly half of his games the past two seasons due to injury?  

 

Edited March 23, 2019 by TaskersGhost

[fansince88]

2 hours ago, HOUSE said:

The draft is the big mystery to me. Nothing would surprise me now.

 

 

This is true. 2 weeks ago I was thinking OL for sure. Now Im in the opinion that as long as the guy plays football I am fine with the pick they make.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

28 minutes ago, JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS said:

credit to Pegulas for all this … and firing Russ was HUGE step forward.

 

Pegs aint cheap!

 

..NOT bashful or cheap.....cleaned out all of the errant wankers from the organization.....to borrow GMC's slogan, Pegulas are "professional grade"......dopey Brandon's indiscretions cost him his" 5 year, $10 mil contract"...and now his underlings have been terminated...NONE will EVER work in Buffalo again.....let's say "unofficial ban"...the Pegulas mean business in fielding a perrenial winner.....as TP said in inner circle, "the Bills are Kim's baby"......she is the driving force (league wide respected as well) behind "draining the swamp"...good for her...we will ALL benefit...stay tuned.........

[Ronin]

12 minutes ago, Logic said:

The below chart makes very clear what the Bills are doing. They have less money committed on big contracts than any team in the league. Why is this? I would postulate it ties into why they have only been signing average to slightly above average players to no more than modest contracts: They are planning to do the majority of their spending on the retention of their own young core in the coming years: Milano, Edmunds, White, Allen, Dawkins, [Edge draftee], etc, etc.

Rather than spending big chunks of their cap on overpaid free agents, they are meticulously and intelligently allocating their money in a way that will allow them to retain all of their own home grown talent, rather than be forced to watch anyone walk away because the Bills can't afford their contract demands.

It's a breath of fresh air and a massive change from the way things were done under Whaley.
 

 

 

Last time I checked, the amount of money players got wasn't necessarily correlated to how good they are.  

 

See Lotulolei as one prime example.  

 

The money is irrelevant.  Does it really need to be reiterated how many horrible huge contracts we've handed out that have A, made no sense, and B, weren't anywhere near what we paid them?   Many of the same people opining here applauding McBeane were also likely the same ones that applauded some of the asinine moves that we made in that way back then too.  

 

Money/contract is one thing, performance is another.  

 

I think it's a case of fans seeing what they want to see, to start, and also partly from being down for so long, which for many having absolutely no recollection of the teams from the early '90s, that they really don't know what a good team looks like looking at it from an unbiased perspective.  

 

The other thing that you have to keep in mind is that McBeane is in a little bit of a bind.  I said last season that it was prime (actually the season prior was) to trade Shady because of his age, an age where RBs routinely decline in performance.  I realize that fans rarely see that day coming, but coaches and GMs should know better.  Either way, the kept their eggs in his basket.  Otherwise, they didn't make many good changes.  Benjamin, Jordan, other moves on offense didn't work out well.  

 

So now they're in a bind.  They've "gotta do something" or they'll be viewed poorly, so despite the notion that this isn't the best free-agency for offense, nowhere near or even above-average, they're making moves with the perception that they're improving things when the reality is that they're really simply brining in players from other teams that don't have performance histories much better than what we have had, which has been below average, offensively speaking that is.  

Edited March 23, 2019 by TaskersGhost

[Logic]

14 minutes ago, TaskersGhost said:

 

Last time I checked, the amount of money players got wasn't necessarily correlated to how good they are.  

 

See Lotulolei as one prime example.  

 

The money is irrelevant.  Does it really need to be reiterated how many horrible huge contracts we've handed out that have A, made no sense, and B, weren't anywhere near what we paid them?   Many of the same people opining here applauding McBeane were also likely the same ones that applauded some of the asinine moves that we made in that way back then too.  

 

Money/contract is one thing, performance is another.  

 

I think it's a case of fans seeing what they want to see, to start, and also partly from being down for so long, which for many having absolutely no recollection of the teams from the early '90s, that they really don't know what a good team looks like looking at it from an unbiased perspective.  

I agree. Except I think the bolded leads to some people going overboard on the pessimistic outlooks. Why wouldn't they? The Bills have been so bad for so long that many Bills fans are conditioned to expect the worse, even when there are signs that optimism may be warranted.

I believe that what we're looking at now is the beginning of the 3rd year of a complete teardown and rebuild. Year 1 they jettisoned bad contracts and players and began to build a defense. Year 2 they identified and selected a quarterback and continued to bolster the defense (it finished 2nd in the league). Year 3 is all about building around Allen and making sure he's the franchise QB they think he is. In years 4 and 5, we'll start to see contract extensions for homegrown stars. I also think we'll start to see bigger free agent contracts handed out, being that they are projected to be in the top 5 in cap space again NEXT offseason. 

So yeah, we're still toward the beginning end of a complete rebuild. As such, big dollars have yet to really be committed across the roster. Right now, the team hasn't proven anything and has to be considered below average at worst, average at best. Anything above that, they must prove on the field. But as for the cap dollars the Bills are spending? They look exactly like they SHOULD look for a team in this stage of a rebuild. As always, I am cautiously optimistic. I understand why some choose pessimism, though, whether consciously or subconsciously.
 

Edited March 23, 2019 by Logic

[TPS]

It takes time to change perception, and like it or not, buffalo has not been a destination for FAs. With the exception of Morse, maybe their #1 need, they were very strategic this year; much like in McD's first year, but with more money.

McD brought in two under the radar players to man the backfield in Poyer and Hyde. This year I am sure they had Nsekhe, Feliciano, Brown, Kroft, and Beasley high on their target list. Individually, not a lot to get excited about, collectively they markedly improve the O, especially when you throw in their one high-end FA Morse. 

I think Dan Morgan probably deserves a lot of credit for their FA moves this year.