NewEra Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 10 hours ago, mannc said: T Hill is probably the most valuable non-QB in the league, but this is not his first problem with the law. Incredible that KC has moved on from (arguably) the best back in the league and now might be parting ways with the best WR...maybe there is something to The Process... Kareem Hunt the best back in the league? ? Hill is a special talent, but he’s not the best WR in the league and certainly not the most valuable non QB in the league.
aristocrat Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 21 minutes ago, NewEra said: Kareem Hunt the best back in the league? ? Hill is a special talent, but he’s not the best WR in the league and certainly not the most valuable non QB in the league. Hes certainly in the conversation for best wr. There’s not much separation from him and the top guys. 1
mannc Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, NewEra said: Kareem Hunt the best back in the league? ? Hill is a special talent, but he’s not the best WR in the league and certainly not the most valuable non QB in the league. Hill is definitely in the conversation. First team All-Pro. He had 1500 yards receiving and a couple hundred yards rushing last year. I've never seen him drop a ball. He is an absolutely electrifying player that the defense has to account for every second of every play. Oh, and he's also got 5 career kick return touchdowns in three seasons. Who do you think is better, or more valuable right now? And Hunt is definitely in the conversation, too, or at least he was until he was released. He's averaged 80 yards rushing per game (4.7 ypc) and 120 yards from scrimmage per game, along with 25 TDs in 25 career games. And only 1 fumble in his entire career. Again, who's clearly better? Edited April 19, 2019 by mannc
NewEra Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 4 minutes ago, mannc said: Hill is definitely in the conversation. First team All-Pro. He had 1500 yards receiving and a couple hundred yards rushing last year. I've never seen him drop a ball. He is an absolutely electrifying player that the defense has to account for every second of every play. Oh, and he's also got 5 career kick return touchdowns in three seasons. Who do you think is better, or more valuable right now? And Hunt is definitely in the conversation, too, or at least he was until he was released. He's averaged 80 yards rushing per game (4.7 ypc) and 120 yards from scrimmage per game, along with 25 TDs in 25 career games. And only 1 fumble in his entire career. Again, who's clearly better? In the conversation.....but never landing in the top spot at this point in his career imo. AB, Hopkins, Julio and Beckham are all clearly better WRs at this point. Regarding most valuable, I’d say Aaron Donald and Khalil Mack are without a doubt more valuable. That’s just 2 off the top of my head that are clearly more valuable imo. Bell and Gurley are CLEARLY BETTER than Hunt. It’s so clear that you should be ashamed to even ask. You can recite all the stats you want. I have eyes. My eyes tell me that Kareem Hunt has never been in the running for the best RB in the league. He was the #1 RB for an Andy Reid offense. He’s going to get stats.
mannc Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, NewEra said: In the conversation.....but never landing in the top spot at this point in his career imo. AB, Hopkins, Julio and Beckham are all clearly better WRs at this point. Regarding most valuable, I’d say Aaron Donald and Khalil Mack are without a doubt more valuable. That’s just 2 off the top of my head that are clearly more valuable imo. Bell and Gurley are CLEARLY BETTER than Hunt. It’s so clear that you should be ashamed to even ask. You can recite all the stats you want. I have eyes. My eyes tell me that Kareem Hunt has never been in the running for the best RB in the league. He was the #1 RB for an Andy Reid offense. He’s going to get stats. If you're going to say someone is CLEARLY BETTER, then you need to back it up with something other than the ol' eye test. My eyes tell me that there is no receiver in football who's harder to cover and who causes more trouble for defenses than Hill. And Hill's numbers last season compare favorably with all the guys you mention above. My eyes also tell me that Bell and Gurley are good backs, but not "clearly better" (or even "better") than Hunt. The Chiefs definitely weren't the same without him, whereas the Rams and Steelers were just fine at RB when those guys were out. 1
NewEra Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, mannc said: If you're going to say someone is CLEARLY BETTER, then you need to back it up with something other than the ol' eye test. My eyes tell me that there is no receiver in football who's harder to cover and who causes more trouble for defenses than Hill. And Hill's numbers last season compare favorably with all the guys you mention above. My eyes also tell me that Bell and Gurley are good backs, but not "clearly better" (or even "better") than Hunt. The Chiefs definitely weren't the same without him, whereas the Rams and Steelers were just fine at RB when those guys were out. Ok. I retract clearly better because I don’t have time to dig up stats and efficiently ratings and such. Nor do I really care. Regardless. Tyreek Hill isn’t the most valuable non QB in the league. If your eyes tell you that Kareem Hunt is better than Bell and Gurley you should to get your eyes checked. Clearly
mannc Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, NewEra said: Tyreek Hill isn’t the most valuable non QB in the league. If your eyes tell you that Kareem Hunt is better than Bell and Gurley you should to get your eyes checked. Yes, he is. See how that works?
NewEra Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 5 minutes ago, mannc said: Yes, he is. See how that works? Yes, I see how that works. Doesn’t mean that you’re right. I am though. Put a couple polls up. I would, but I don’t want to be that kind of a jerk.
LABILLBACKER Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 On 3/15/2019 at 2:08 PM, Mark92 said: He is one.player I have no use for. It's like the Cubs winning the world series because of Aroldis Chapman the wife beater. Makes me sick. If you don't ever punish these idiots they'll just keep doing it. Our judicial system is a joke.
BringBackOrton Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 40 minutes ago, NewEra said: Ok. I retract clearly better because I don’t have time to dig up stats and efficiently ratings and such. Nor do I really care. Regardless. Tyreek Hill isn’t the most valuable non QB in the league. If your eyes tell you that Kareem Hunt is better than Bell and Gurley you should to get your eyes checked. Clearly You could make an argument that at Tyreek’s investment and current salary, he is the most valuable per dollar.
Rob's House Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 I think he should be out of the league or, at the very least, the AFC. Unless of course the Bills acquire him, in which case I'm open to the notion that this is all a big misunderstanding. 3
Doc Posted April 19, 2019 Posted April 19, 2019 23 minutes ago, Rob's House said: I think he should be out of the league or, at the very least, the AFC. Unless of course the Bills acquire him, in which case I'm open to the notion that this is all a big misunderstanding. Has he been charged? I have no dog in this fight and don't want the Bills to go after him if he's released (and if he's innocent the Chefs will keep him), just asking.
Zerovoltz Posted April 20, 2019 Posted April 20, 2019 ....here is my perspective as a KC fan.....and I am telling you all now....my opinion on this isn't a popular one among Chiefs fans...but this may help offer some clarifacation.. Back in January/February....a couple of police reports were filed regarding Hills 3 year old son. The first one was dropped with no charges filed and the second one doesn't name Hill, but rather his fiance (and mother of his child) Apparently, the second report has to do with an incident that resulted in the 3 year old childs arm being broken. The authorities in KS, opted to have the child removed from the home. It's important from a legal standpoint (not a football standpoint, I'll get to that) to understand that in kansas, having a child removed from a home doesn't consitute guilt or innocence of parents/guardians...it's done as a precaution for the safety of the child until the matter is sorted out. It is also important to note that in Kansas, when these happen, the biological parents of the child must both appear in court, even if one isn't named as a perp...or if one isn't the custodial parent...if your name is on the birth certificate, you are required to appear. Now....given that.....Hills child is in the custody of the state. Both Hill and the child mother appeared in court per Kansas Law. Hill wasn't named in the report. Those are the facts. That said...the situation is that KC Drafted Hill, who had been convicted of punching his then pregnant fiance (this is the same woman listed in child abuse report) in the belly and choking her. He was on many teams DO NOT DRAFT list. KC took him the 5th round of the 2016 NFL Draft. The front office took a lot of heat for the pick at the time. Andy Reid held a post draft press conference and assured the media that they had done their homework on Hill and that he would be a good dude going forward. Not too long ago, a local TV station even did a feature on Hill and his Fiance showing them at an amusement park with the son and that they are still engaged and she is now pregnant with twins. Hunt had his issues and was released. Now Hills Child, is in state custody...alledgly, Hill wasn't even in town when the second report was filed and again, only names the fiance as an involved party. STILL...this is a horrible horrible look for Hill and the Chiefs...they took him in the draft with an obvious red flag...promised he'd be good. They had the whole Hunt thing happen and released Hunt for lying to the team. Even if Hill was not directly involved in the incident...this is a HORRIBLE look for him. You are Tyreek Hill. You got drafted in the 5th round because you were convicted of a horrible violent act. You land on a good team with a good offensive coach. Knowing that extra eyes will always be on you, AND approaching your BIG PAYDAY...you find you are associated with a child abuse issue and your kid is in state custody. ....There is no way KC can or will sign him to an extension (this is the part unpopular with my fellow Chiefs fans) You already set a precedent by cutting Hunt, (who was never charged with anything) and now you have Hill, already convicted of horrible things, being now mentioned and heavily associated with horrible things he may or may not have directly been responsible for. Chiefs fans keep looking at this as a legal matter and that if/when Hill is cleared, it's all over, we can go back to worrying with football etc and Hill will get his extension...bla bla bla. There is NO WAY KC is going to give a guaranteed mega signing bonus to a guy who is THISCLOSE to being the next dude on Roger Goodells list. Hill is a GREAT WR. He is the fastest man in pads I've ever seen. He takes hits, runs good routes, can leap, gets separatoin, returns kicks and comes up big in big spots...and he's a good teammate by all accounts and not an A-hole Diva type. He's everything you'd want on the field. Personally, I don't care...Just move on already...I don't want, and don't need a guy who has punched and choked a pregnant woman....who can't keep his domestic life on the up and up, having been given a great second chance....on my team. Frankly...when you have Mahomes....moving on from Hill isn't that hard. If you take away ALL of Hills catches, TD's Yards etc..AND you assume NO ONE would have made up even a single catch TD, or yard...Mahomes still would have led the NFL in TD throws, and remained top 10 in yards and completions. I can't say what will happen, but I suspect the team IS looking to trade him and at minimum, won't offer an extension.
Doc Posted April 20, 2019 Posted April 20, 2019 Huh? If he's innocent, why is this latest incident on him?
Zerovoltz Posted April 20, 2019 Posted April 20, 2019 7 minutes ago, Doc said: Huh? If he's innocent, why is this latest incident on him? ....as I said in my post...by law, in Kansas, ANY case/report of child endangerment, abuse, and/or neglect that goes to court..REQUIRES both biological parents to attend court appearances. Hill, being the biological father of the child, therefore is required to attend court hearings about this case and he therefore has been in court regarding this case. If you don't live in KC where this whole thing has been discussed ad naseum, and you don't have all the details..this looks REALLY Bad....basically as a national storty it looks like this....Tyreek Hills child taken into state custody due to charges of child abuse. Hill appears in court. The whole thing is still awful, but without all the details, it sounds and seems even worse.
Doc Posted April 20, 2019 Posted April 20, 2019 8 minutes ago, Zerovotlz said: ....as I said in my post...by law, in Kansas, ANY case/report of child endangerment, abuse, and/or neglect that goes to court..REQUIRES both biological parents to attend court appearances. Hill, being the biological father of the child, therefore is required to attend court hearings about this case and he therefore has been in court regarding this case. If you don't live in KC where this whole thing has been discussed ad naseum, and you don't have all the details..this looks REALLY Bad....basically as a national storty it looks like this....Tyreek Hills child taken into state custody due to charges of child abuse. Hill appears in court. The whole thing is still awful, but without all the details, it sounds and seems even worse. So...appearances and not facts. If he was out of town as you said he might have been, he's innocent. What it looks like means nothing. But whatever. The Chefs drafted him knowing his history. If they want to give up on him over appearances, they're free to do so.
mannc Posted April 20, 2019 Posted April 20, 2019 11 minutes ago, Zerovotlz said: ....as I said in my post...by law, in Kansas, ANY case/report of child endangerment, abuse, and/or neglect that goes to court..REQUIRES both biological parents to attend court appearances. Hill, being the biological father of the child, therefore is required to attend court hearings about this case and he therefore has been in court regarding this case. If you don't live in KC where this whole thing has been discussed ad naseum, and you don't have all the details..this looks REALLY Bad....basically as a national storty it looks like this....Tyreek Hills child taken into state custody due to charges of child abuse. Hill appears in court. The whole thing is still awful, but without all the details, it sounds and seems even worse. This makes no sense...you’re ready to kick your best player to the curb and you can’t even say what he did wrong?? Because it’s “a bad look”? WTH?
Zerovoltz Posted April 20, 2019 Posted April 20, 2019 Just now, Doc said: So...appearances and not facts. If he was out of town as you said he might have been, he's innocent. What it looks like means nothing. But whatever. The Chefs drafted him knowing his history. If they want to give up on him over appearances, they're free to do so. They also drafted Kareem Hunt knowning he had some issues in college...he has continued to have some issues....and even though he was NEVER CHARGED, the Chiefs released him, and the NFL suspended him 8 games. Roger Goodell (and Clark Hunt, Chiefs chairman) don't need a conviction etc to take action. I really really hope that this whole thing comes out as some rediculous coincidence the kid broke his arm falling off the slide at daycare while Tyreek was out of town or something. Unless there is solid proof that this whole thing is just a misunderstanding...there is no way he gets and extension here (in KC)
Doc Posted April 20, 2019 Posted April 20, 2019 Just now, Zerovotlz said: They also drafted Kareem Hunt knowning he had some issues in college...he has continued to have some issues....and even though he was NEVER CHARGED, the Chiefs released him, and the NFL suspended him 8 games. Roger Goodell (and Clark Hunt, Chiefs chairman) don't need a conviction etc to take action. I really really hope that this whole thing comes out as some rediculous coincidence the kid broke his arm falling off the slide at daycare while Tyreek was out of town or something. Unless there is solid proof that this whole thing is just a misunderstanding...there is no way he gets and extension here (in KC) If Hill has no alibi then yes, he deserves what's coming to him. If he wasn't even there...he doesn't deserve to be excoriated.
Zerovoltz Posted April 20, 2019 Posted April 20, 2019 Just now, mannc said: This makes no sense...you’re ready to kick your best player to the curb and you can’t even say what he did wrong?? Because it’s “a bad look”? WTH? He was already convicted of choking and punching a pregnant woman in the stomach....so he gets a second chance in KC....he technically hasn't done anything wrong. He also is an NFL player who plays for a team that just released Kareem Hunt for arguably much less, and who was NEVER CHARGED. I would prefer to keep Hill. As I said..GREAT PLAYER...but how can you sign the guy to an extension at this point when he is quite possibly subject to the whim of Roger Goodells morality at any given moment now?
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