Per Rosenhaus, Bills weren't an option for AB cuz 1) Beane withdrew from talks 2) (new) Rosenhaus blew them off

[bobblehead]

I think the truth, like everything, is somewhere in the middle. I think the key statement was where Beane said " it didn't make sense to either side" (paraphrasing). Yes, Beane wasn't going to pay that price and yes, AB wouldn't have reported either. I really think both sides walked.

 

 Beane is ok with paying someone like  McCoy who is here, wants to be here, and is already balls deep in the process.  

 

And yes someone leaked something to Rappaport who would rather be first than right. 

 

And yes DR is doing damage control with Beane cause Beane has a boatload of cash and picks, and the Internet Buffalo bashing got out of hand and Drew knows he can't be tied to that and still have access to that boatload of cash. 

 

 

Edited March 11, 2019 by bobblehead

[Thurman#1]

14 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

But we already laughed at the Bills for burying dead money last year on their way to 6-10 and numerous blowouts.    

 

I think I read that the amount of dead money the Bills ate last year was the most by any NFL team since the cap came into existence.........now THAT is funny.

 

 

Yup.

 

Many did laugh. The slower ones. The ones who didn't recognize a rebuild, in which we got a possible franchise QB.

 

The Steelers, though, aren't rebuilding. They're in a window where they've got a very short few more years with Roethlisberger to try to win a championship.

[Thurman#1]

4 minutes ago, bobblehead said:

I think the truth, like everything, is somewhere in the middle. I think the key statement was where Beane said " it didn't make sense to either side" (paraphrasing). Yes, Beane wasn't going to pay that price and yes, AB wouldn't have reported either. I really think both sides walked.

 

 Beane is ok with paying someone like  McCoy who is here, wants to be here, and is already balls deep in the process.  

 

And yes someone leaked something to Rappaport who would rather be first than right. 

 

And yes DR is doing damage control with Beane cause Beane has a boatload of cash and picks, and the Internet Buffalo bashing got out of hand and Drew knows he can't be tied to that and still have access to that boatload of cash. 

 

 

 

 

Rapaport was first and right, both.

 

And it was almost certainly the Steelers who leaked, to try to put pressure on the Bills to go through with it and to maybe try to draw in an extra suitor or two thinking there was a serious suitor and that it might end soon.

 

The fact that he went to Oakland, not exactly NYC or Chicago and not a team that looks like it will win this year, and not a team with a terrific QB already proven and in place IMHO makes it look very likely that what Beane thought was right ... that if they'd worked out a deal on money there would have been no problems with Brown reporting.

[Thurman#1]

2 hours ago, ProcessTruster said:

he's the guy who pulled Jason Peters out of buffalo , because it was buffalo

 

 

As thoroughly wrong a post as I've ever seen.

 

Eugene Parker, not Drew Rosenhaus, was Peters' agent.

 

And Parker's method was to say what he wanted, and to not change, knowing that he was very very good at picking a number someone would pay. Which happened in the Peters case. Peters, a hall-of-gamer soon, left Buffalo because they wouldn't pay him what he wanted and what he absolutely deserved.

[TigerJ]

11 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

What did they say? 

Murphy said he didn't think Brown had anything to do with the trade not happening - that Brown never made his comments until after the failed trade was history.  He was rather insistent on it.  I think the vigor of his statements had observers thinking it was just another example of his homerism.

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, JerseyBills said:

I'm honestly thrilled .

No WAY Beane was giving him 17-18 mil Per with 10 mil per guaranteed and I don't blame him. I'd be pretty mad if he did end up giving him that size of contract . That's a ridiculous amount of $ I'd only give to a QB and possibly pass rusher

 

I think what happened is a harbinger of the future. I expect that we'll see more guaranteed contracts in the future for difference makers like Brown (and everyone needs to recognize that he is probably the best receiver in the league, with apologies to Julio Jones). From Albert Breer today:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/03/11/antonio-brown-trade-raiders-eric-weddle-rams-nfl-free-agency

 

'As the calendar turned from 2018 to ’19, the guaranteed money on the four-year, $68 million extension Brown signed two years ago was running out; all that was left, in essence, was three team options, at $15.125 million for 2019, $11.3 million for ’20 and $12.5 million for ’21. Those set a ceiling for how much Brown could make, without guaranteeing him much of anything.

 

So maybe Brown’s frustration with the Steelers organization legitimately boiled over this fall. I heard that Brown became increasingly detached as the season wore on, and not necessarily bad, but different around those in the building, and maybe it’s only coincidence that it lines up with his financial situation changing.

 

Either way, lots of players are paying attention to what Brown just pulled off. The star wide receiver’s big score could have a ripple effect that reverberates in other cities in the not too distant future, mainly because what he just did—regardless of the motives or level of premeditation—worked.

 

With the trade to the Raiders, Brown went from $0 fully guaranteed to $30.125 million fully guaranteed. He went from $38.925 million over the next three years to $50.128 million. The APY (average per year) on that four-year extension jumped from $17 million to $19.8 million. And you better believe other players (and their agents) are taking notice of how he did it.

 

“What’s going to happen,” one prominent agent said Sunday afternoon, “is that superstar players are going to see their only leverage is to force a trade and get a new deal from their new team.”

 

Michael Thomas is going into a contract year in New Orleans. Ditto for Amari Cooper in Dallas. Julio Jones has no more guaranteed money left on the two remaining years of his deal in Atlanta, and was promised by management last summer that he’d get new contract this year. Odell Beckham, believe it or not, is only a year away from being out of guarantees in New York.

...

 

Oakland basically bought themselves value. The key thing to remember here is that plenty of teams will yield big money for a great player. And they’ll also fork over high-end draft capital for one. But they’re mostly loath to do both at once. So once it became Brown for draft picks and a ton of draft capital, an already tepid market collapsed.

 

After the Bills talks came undone, only three teams reached out to the Steelers—the Raiders, Eagles, and Redskins. Considering this is the first player in NFL history to post six consecutive 100-catch seasons, that dearth of demand is stunning, and a clear illustration of where this had gone.

 

In the end, the reason the Raiders could get Brown for the No. 66 and No. 142 picks in the draft is because of their willingness and ability to reach a revision of the contract with Rosenhaus that satisfied Brown. And even they had their problems getting there. At one point on Saturday, it looked like contract talks were on life support, only to be revived later in the day.

 

So the Raiders got their man and their bargain. Where does this leave the teams? ... For the Raiders, it’s fair to say that Mayock and Gruden effectively used the cap space they had (over $60 million) as a weapon to acquire a great player. Also, Gruden’s track record with older receivers, going back to the Jerry Rice/Tim Brown tandem he rode into contention nearly 20 years ago, has been solid. And the Raiders maintained their controlling position on the first two nights of the draft.'

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Yup.

 

Many did laugh. The slower ones. The ones who didn't recognize a rebuild, in which we got a possible franchise QB.

 

The Steelers, though, aren't rebuilding. They're in a window where they've got a very short few more years with Roethlisberger to try to win a championship.

 

Every team is rebuilding their roster every year.

 

Everybody gets to draft and shop in free agency and have the same amount of cap money.

 

First contracts are very short so you can't stack young players like it's the 1980's..........half of all 1st rounders have their 5th year option declined or are dealt/released.

 

The final step in creating parity was making the game easier for young QB's...........which the league has done in recent years.........and now virtually every team has a QB on their roster or within reach in FA that could be considered a franchise QB. 

 

This creates a very even playing field that makes very quick turnarounds the norm..........and it is what makes the NFL the best of the pro sports league's............the Bills have simply circumvented the system of parity thru utter incompetence.    It's OK to laugh at that.   It's not been good but it's been special.

 

I would love to laugh at the Steelers now too but when Big Ben is gone it's not like they are going to go Billsy and go 20 years without a 10 win season.

 

 And fwiw we were kicking dirt on an aging Drew Brees a couple years ago when he was coming off 3 straight 7-9 seasons so I'm hesitant to dance on Big Ben's grave just yet.

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

24 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

Every team is rebuilding their roster every year.

Everybody gets to draft and shop in free agency and have the same amount of cap money.

First contracts are very short so you can't stack young players like it's the 1980's..........half of all 1st rounders have their 5th year option declined or are dealt/released.

 

The final step in creating parity was making the game easier for young QB's...........which the league has done in recent years.........and now virtually every team has a QB on their roster or within reach in FA that could be considered a franchise QB. 

 

This creates a very even playing field that makes very quick turnarounds the norm..........and it is what makes the NFL the best of the pro sports league's............the Bills have simply circumvented the system of parity thru utter incompetence.    It's OK to laugh at that.   It's not been good but it's been special.

 

I would love to laugh at the Steelers now too but when Big Ben is gone it's not like they are going to go Billsy and go 20 years without a 10 win season.

 

 And fwiw we were kicking dirt on an aging Drew Brees a couple years ago when he was coming off 3 straight 7-9 seasons so I'm hesitant to dance on Big Ben's grave just yet.

 

 

I agree with most of the points here - the Bills buying into what's looking like a 4+ year rebuild (including a project 1st round QB) under McBeane is the exception not the rule and may well not work in the age of short rookie deals/FA.

But is it really true that "virtually every team has a QB on their roster or within reach in FA that could be considered a franchise QB"?

 

Looking over teams and reflecting on who they have, I'm not so sure. 

 

I guess it depends upon how one defines "franchise QB" - whether you mean Drew Brees/Aaron Rodgers/Tom Brady type talent, or just a guy who can play QB and win with the right system and pieces around him - a Nick Foles/Alex Smith type guy?

 

 

[T master]

Per this Bills fan Drew & his client are both douche bags ?!! He like a leach just along for the ride scamming as many teams as he can along the way !! ?

[JerseyBills]

3 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

 

I think what happened is a harbinger of the future. I expect that we'll see more guaranteed contracts in the future for difference makers like Brown (and everyone needs to recognize that he is probably the best receiver in the league, with apologies to Julio Jones). From Albert Breer today:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/03/11/antonio-brown-trade-raiders-eric-weddle-rams-nfl-free-agency

 

'As the calendar turned from 2018 to ’19, the guaranteed money on the four-year, $68 million extension Brown signed two years ago was running out; all that was left, in essence, was three team options, at $15.125 million for 2019, $11.3 million for ’20 and $12.5 million for ’21. Those set a ceiling for how much Brown could make, without guaranteeing him much of anything.

 

So maybe Brown’s frustration with the Steelers organization legitimately boiled over this fall. I heard that Brown became increasingly detached as the season wore on, and not necessarily bad, but different around those in the building, and maybe it’s only coincidence that it lines up with his financial situation changing.

 

Either way, lots of players are paying attention to what Brown just pulled off. The star wide receiver’s big score could have a ripple effect that reverberates in other cities in the not too distant future, mainly because what he just did—regardless of the motives or level of premeditation—worked.

 

With the trade to the Raiders, Brown went from $0 fully guaranteed to $30.125 million fully guaranteed. He went from $38.925 million over the next three years to $50.128 million. The APY (average per year) on that four-year extension jumped from $17 million to $19.8 million. And you better believe other players (and their agents) are taking notice of how he did it.

 

“What’s going to happen,” one prominent agent said Sunday afternoon, “is that superstar players are going to see their only leverage is to force a trade and get a new deal from their new team.”

 

Michael Thomas is going into a contract year in New Orleans. Ditto for Amari Cooper in Dallas. Julio Jones has no more guaranteed money left on the two remaining years of his deal in Atlanta, and was promised by management last summer that he’d get new contract this year. Odell Beckham, believe it or not, is only a year away from being out of guarantees in New York.

...

 

Oakland basically bought themselves value. The key thing to remember here is that plenty of teams will yield big money for a great player. And they’ll also fork over high-end draft capital for one. But they’re mostly loath to do both at once. So once it became Brown for draft picks and a ton of draft capital, an already tepid market collapsed.

 

After the Bills talks came undone, only three teams reached out to the Steelers—the Raiders, Eagles, and Redskins. Considering this is the first player in NFL history to post six consecutive 100-catch seasons, that dearth of demand is stunning, and a clear illustration of where this had gone.

 

In the end, the reason the Raiders could get Brown for the No. 66 and No. 142 picks in the draft is because of their willingness and ability to reach a revision of the contract with Rosenhaus that satisfied Brown. And even they had their problems getting there. At one point on Saturday, it looked like contract talks were on life support, only to be revived later in the day.

 

So the Raiders got their man and their bargain. Where does this leave the teams? ... For the Raiders, it’s fair to say that Mayock and Gruden effectively used the cap space they had (over $60 million) as a weapon to acquire a great player. Also, Gruden’s track record with older receivers, going back to the Jerry Rice/Tim Brown tandem he rode into contention nearly 20 years ago, has been solid. And the Raiders maintained their controlling position on the first two nights of the draft.'

Very interesting point of view about the whole situation and looks to be a trend this off season. Trent Brown apparently is going to Oakland for 4 years/60+ mil and 30 mil guaranteed. Kwon Alexander to 49ers for 35 mil guaranteed over 3 years , so maybe I was wrong but I guess I'm not a huge fan of this trend but at the same time if you're talking about an elite, consistent player , you give them what they want. Tread lightly though

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

..I was in Aruba for the week with my kids and daughter-in-law.......saw a gang with Bills hats/cold cups at a table in the pool bar (strange, right??).....found out about the Bell "deal and then no deal"......was shocked......got to listen to Terrell Davis on NFLN on the plane yapping about how it was a "good deal for Brown to be paired with a great young QB versus a potential disaster in Bflo with Josh Allen".....isn't "Used Carr" the "same great young QB" that the Raiders were allegedly shopping??....

[dave mcbride]

31 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

Very interesting point of view about the whole situation and looks to be a trend this off season. Trent Brown apparently is going to Oakland for 4 years/60+ mil and 30 mil guaranteed. Kwon Alexander to 49ers for 35 mil guaranteed over 3 years , so maybe I was wrong but I guess I'm not a huge fan of this trend but at the same time if you're talking about an elite, consistent player , you give them what they want. Tread lightly though

Yep.

18 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

..I was in Aruba for the week with my kids and daughter-in-law.......saw a gang with Bills hats/cold cups at a table in the pool bar (strange, right??).....found out about the Bell "deal and then no deal"......was shocked......got to listen to Terrell Davis on NFLN on the plane yapping about how it was a "good deal for Brown to be paired with a great young QB versus a potential disaster in Bflo with Josh Allen".....isn't "Used Carr" the "same great young QB" that the Raiders were allegedly shopping??....

I am in no way saying the outsiders are right, but it does seem to be the case that the vast majority of NFL people who are outsiders to Buffalo regard Allen as a probable bust. 

[oldmanfan]

7 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Yep.

I am in no way saying the outsiders are right, but it does seem to be the case that the vast majority of NFL people who are outsiders to Buffalo regard Allen as a probable bust. 

Saying that the "vast majority" are claiming this really is just wishful thinking in your part.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

8 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Yep.

I am in no way saying the outsiders are right, but it does seem to be the case that the vast majority of NFL people who are outsiders to Buffalo regard Allen as a probable bust. 

 

...certainly agree...but realistically and if you want an ounce of journalistic (my favorite urinalists) credibility, shouldn't the jury be out on the entire class at this early juncture?..

Edited March 11, 2019 by OldTimeAFLGuy

[Low Positive]

6 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Yep.

I am in no way saying the outsiders are right, but it does seem to be the case that the vast majority of NFL people who are outsiders to Buffalo regard Allen as a probable bust. 

A lot of NFL pundits declared Josh Allen a bust on draft day. And if you are only looking at numbers, he didn't do enough to force them to declare that they were mistaken. In order to see Josh Allen's progress, you had to actually watch the games and most national NFL people are not watching Bills games.

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, oldmanfan said:

Saying that the "vast majority" are claiming this really is just wishful thinking in your part.

This is ridiculous. Why would you ever think I "wished" for this? Please be specific, and cite posts in which I've been down on Allen. 

2 minutes ago, FrenchConnection said:

A lot of NFL pundits declared Josh Allen a bust on draft day. And if you are only looking at numbers, he didn't do enough to force them to declare that they were mistaken. In order to see Josh Allen's progress, you had to actually watch the games and most national NFL people are not watching Bills games.

I agree. The downside, though, is that perception can drive decision-making among players looking for their next team.

3 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...certainly agree...but realistically and if you want an ounce of journalistic (my favorite urinalists) credibility, shouldn't the jury be out on the entire class at this early juncture?..

Yeah, I agree completely. But life ain't fair ...

[oldmanfan]

Just now, dave mcbride said:

This is ridiculous. Why would you ever think I "wished" for this? Please be specific, and cite posts in which I've been down on Allen. 

I'm glad you don't feel that way.  As glad as I am that the vast majority of commentators are really not saying Allen is a bust.

 

Interesting you ask for cites but didn't offer any to back your allegation.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

This is ridiculous. Why would you ever think I "wished" for this? Please be specific, and cite posts in which I've been down on Allen. 

I agree. The downside, though, is that perception can drive decision-making among players looking for their next team.

Yeah, I agree completely. But life ain't fair ...

...we should be well accustomed to "Buffalo Bias".....

[Low Positive]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

This is ridiculous. Why would you ever think I "wished" for this? Please be specific, and cite posts in which I've been down on Allen. 

I agree. The downside, though, is that perception can drive decision-making among players looking for their next team.

Exactly! The players on other teams are only going to watch Bills games if they are on national TV or if they are playing the Bills. The Stealers didn't play the Bills last year so AB probably didn't watch a single Bills game. So, all anyone has to go on are the numbers and pre-draft assessments. Comments like those made by Jalen Ramsey certainly didn't help; I'm sure most players were laughing at the joke.

[dave mcbride]

3 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I'm glad you don't feel that way.  As glad as I am that the vast majority of commentators are really not saying Allen is a bust.

 

Interesting you ask for cites but didn't offer any to back your allegation.

Find me non-Buffalo media and non-Bills players who speak highly of Allen.  You might find a couple, but almost everything I've read is a verbal version of this: 

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb

 

Let me be clear: I like Allen and think the ceiling is very high provided the accuracy gets moderately better. 

Edited March 11, 2019 by dave mcbride