Buffalo86 Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 1 hour ago, 947 said: After all the "Combine Heros" who have burned GMs over the past 25 years, you'd think this stuff wouldn't happen. Metcalf's 40-time in shorts, bench press, and muscularity isn't the same as ability to run routes, catch contested balls, and producing like a WR1 on the field. He may look, run, & jump like Julio Jones- but that isn't enough to make him a star in the NFL. I'm VERY concerned about his agility numbers. Sure, he may end up a really good player in time. But he is an extremely raw prospect at this point, and can basically only run fly patterns. I want no part of him the first round, and I hope he's somebody else's mistake. Well said. Making it in the NFL is more than running fast, jumping far, and having a good shirtless pic, as countless teams have learned over the years. Having missed large chunks of 2 of his 3 college seasons, durability should be a huge concern. It's fun to think of what Metcalf might've done had he been able to stay on the field, but he didn't. However, he does fit the "athletic freak" profile that McBeane seems to favor in the 1st, so it wouldn't surprise me if he's the pick.
Andrew Son Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 DK was widely considered the top WR in this class prior to the combine. He’s not just a workout warrior. lot of hot takes in this thread. Limited route tree was a product of a basic Ole Miss offense, not DK.
HappyDays Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 20 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: Change of direction issues are a huge red flag for any receiver, I generally agree but in our offense straight line speed is arguably more important. The injuries do scare me. But anyone we take at 9 is going to have concerns. If Metcalf had above average agility on top of his elite physical traits he would be guaranteed to go top 3.
BuffAlone Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, SWATeam said: DK was widely considered the top WR in this class prior to the combine. He’s not just a workout warrior. lot of hot takes in this thread. Limited route tree was a product of a basic Ole Miss offense, not DK. So, his change of direction speed doesn't alarm you as a top ten pick? 2 minutes ago, HappyDays said: I generally agree but in our offense straight line speed is arguably more important. The injuries do scare me. But anyone we take at 9 is going to have concerns. If Metcalf had above average agility on top of his elite physical traits he would be guaranteed to go top 3. But he doesn't... And we have deep speed. We need a possession receiver before we need depth at speed Edited March 3, 2019 by BuffAlone 1
HappyDays Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 15 minutes ago, BuffAlone said: His talents are for naught in the system we are going to run. I don't agree with that at all. Our receivers are running routes 15-20 yards down field. If our offense was built around Allen's skill set, we would ideally have strong pass protection, 2 burners on the outside, and a receiving TE to act as our possession receiver. We don't need Metcalf to run short crossers and curls. He would run screens and deep routes all day long.
YoloinOhio Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, Buffalo86 said: Well said. Making it in the NFL is more than running fast, jumping far, and having a good shirtless pic, as countless teams have learned over the years. Having missed large chunks of 2 of his 3 college seasons, durability should be a huge concern. It's fun to think of what Metcalf might've done had he been able to stay on the field, but he didn't. However, he does fit the "athletic freak" profile that McBeane seems to favor in the 1st, so it wouldn't surprise me if he's the pick. He does fit their tendencies but I think it’s possible they look at the WR position through a different lens than QB and MLB, and place a heavier weight on factors like route running. We can look at guys like Zay though who the drafted high (Beane wasn’t here yet but he was reportedly high on their board) and assume they may value production in college. 2
Logic Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 Wait...why should we be "all in" on Metcalf? Because he tested well at the combine? Measurables are great, but what does his film look like? Who will be keeping Josh Allen upright so that he can GET the ball to Metcalf? I'm fine with the Bills drafting him at 9, but I'm also perfectly fine with a big ugly at that spot.
K-9 Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 4 minutes ago, Buffalo86 said: Well said. Making it in the NFL is more than running fast, jumping far, and having a good shirtless pic, as countless teams have learned over the years. Having missed large chunks of 2 of his 3 college seasons, durability should be a huge concern. It's fun to think of what Metcalf might've done had he been able to stay on the field, but he didn't. However, he does fit the "athletic freak" profile that McBeane seems to favor in the 1st, so it wouldn't surprise me if he's the pick. He’s only an athletic freak in terms of feats involving moving in a straight line, either straight up (vertical jump) or straight ahead (long jump and 40). He is the exact opposite of athletic freak in the change of direction tests. He will make some team very happy if that team only requires a receiver to move in a straight line. 1
thebandit27 Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 4 minutes ago, SWATeam said: DK was widely considered the top WR in this class prior to the combine. He’s not just a workout warrior. lot of hot takes in this thread. Limited route tree was a product of a basic Ole Miss offense, not DK. No and no. I saw more than one analyst with Marquise Brown as WR1, including Daniel Jeremiah...and if the combine showed anything, it's that his COD skills may have had a sizable role in his limited route usage.
BuffAlone Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 1 minute ago, HappyDays said: I don't agree with that at all. Our receivers are running routes 15-20 yards down field. If our offense was built around Allen's skill set, we would ideally have strong pass protection, 2 burners on the outside, and a receiving TE to act as our possession receiver. We don't need Metcalf to run short crossers and curls. He would run screens and deep routes all day long. We will remain a run first team. Deep speed in Foster, a shifty slot guy, and a big reliable possession receiver. I'm not sure where, or if, Zay fits in, but regardless, if speed was all we covet, that can be found in lower rounds, or via FA. Not at the cost/risk of a #9 overall pick 3 minutes ago, Logic said: Wait...why should we be "all in" on Metcalf? Because he tested well at the combine? Measurables are great, but what does his film look like? Who will be keeping Josh Allen upright so that he can GET the ball to Metcalf? I'm fine with the Bills drafting him at 9, but I'm also perfectly fine with a big ugly at that spot. All about value!
BillsSB2020 Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 1 minute ago, K-9 said: He’s only an athletic freak in terms of feats involving moving in a straight line, either straight up (vertical jump) or straight ahead (long jump and 40). He is the exact opposite of athletic freak in the change of direction tests. He will make some team very happy if that team only requires a receiver to move in a straight line. My rebuttal would be that his straight line speed makes him a threat to score on every play, especially if you pair him with Josh Allen. That makes it impossible for a corner to "cheat." Also taking into account his frame, a quick cut isn't nearly as essential as it is for an average sized receiver. He can simply outbody people on deep outs, curls, etc.
Virgil Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 20 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: Or Breshad Perriman Or David Boston 2
K-9 Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 5 minutes ago, BillsSB2020 said: My rebuttal would be that his straight line speed makes him a threat to score on every play, especially if you pair him with Josh Allen. That makes it impossible for a corner to "cheat." Also taking into account his frame, a quick cut isn't nearly as essential as it is for an average sized receiver. He can simply outbody people on deep outs, curls, etc. I cannot disagree more with this entire take. I’ll just leave it at that.
HappyDays Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 7 minutes ago, BillsSB2020 said: Also taking into account his frame, a quick cut isn't nearly as essential as it is for an average sized receiver. He can simply outbody people on deep outs, curls, etc. Exactly, we're not talking about a small speedy guy like Marquise Brown. Metcalf is big and strong and fast, he has a big catch radiradius, he's dedicated to the game. That's a lethal combination in the vertical offense that we run. I get the injury concerns though. That would scare me off more than his 3 cone drill. 1
Andrew Son Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 15 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: No and no. I saw more than one analyst with Marquise Brown as WR1, including Daniel Jeremiah...and if the combine showed anything, it's that his COD skills may have had a sizable role in his limited route usage. I didn't know it needed to be unanimous.
BuffAlone Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, HappyDays said: Exactly, we're not talking about a small speedy guy like Marquise Brown. Metcalf is big and strong and fast, he has a big catch radiradius, he's dedicated to the game. That's a lethal combination in the vertical offense that we run. I get the injury concerns though. That would scare me off more than his 3 cone drill. That said, I just can't see the overall value meeting the investment. Not when there are equal, or even greater holes to fill this year
Wayne Cubed Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 29 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: Or Breshad Perriman or Darrius Heyward-Bey He was one trick pony coming out of school. Great straight line speed (4.30 40) but had questionable hands and couldn't generate separation out on his cuts. Sound familiar?
Alphadawg7 Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 Metcalf did exactly what I said and expected he would do at the combine. He is a freak and a crazy exciting prospect. That being said, he also did terrible in agility drills which does leave questions on how complete a WR he can be if he will struggle changing directions. HOWEVER: The WR that I think took over the top WR spot in the draft is NOT Metcalf, although I do believe Metcalf will still be drafted first based on a "Josh Allen" type ceiling with those freakish numbers. The guy who to me cemented the best overall WR prospect was my 2nd favorite WR heading into the combine, and that is N'Keal Harry. The ONLY concern on Harry was his speed, and going into the combine he was expected to run high 4.6's to low 4.7's and most said that would be fine given his immense talent and still be a first or early 2nd round pick. HOWEVER: Harry blew away those expectations (as I had been saying he would) and ran a 4.54 which is faster than Antonio Brown and many other elite WR's in the NFL. He by far has one of the most impressive tapes in this draft, insane hands, insane catch radius, strong, highly productive with a terrible QB, and now showed he has the speed too. There is no longer any knock on him, its all gone. 1
Misterbluesky Posted March 3, 2019 Posted March 3, 2019 2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: I’m going OL or DL in the 1st and WR in the 2nd Beane made it to two Bulls games this year...with Johnson not running,I bet his stock falls around the league but it shouldn't effect what Beane knows about him. AJ in the second?????
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