Music to my ears...McD on offense

[JESSEFEFFER]

15 hours ago, john wawrow said:

 

But what if that's exactly what he meant?

They get to 21, and that's it. He puts in the second- and third-stringers.

 

Maybe, one day, they score 17. And the next he stops at 24.

What if they get shut out one week, and now he's gotta score 42 just to make the average.

 

I pretty sure it's especially important on this day ... checks calendar ... Feb. 28, that everything said must be taken seriously and without question.

There's no room for inferringness.

 

jw

 

 

 

I can see the post game press conference now.  The Bills just lost by giving up a FG as time expired, 23-21.  Brady had been given the ball with just under 2 minutes to play but the Bills' D couldn't stop Brady from doing Tom Brady things.  Sean McDermott opens by saying "We hit our points quota at the end of the first half when we went up 21-10 and I was convinced that 21 was all we should need to win so we decided not to try anything risky to score additional points."

[eball]

24 minutes ago, JESSEFEFFER said:

I think you have that right.  There was a question posed by a WGR poll about which offseason is more important to the Bills future, 2018 or 2019.  Tasker was waffling about it and the reason for that, in my opinion, is  last year's draft was more important, mostly for the draft moves made to get Allen and Edmunds, than this year's but that the sum total of all the offseason moves, draft + FA + long term cap commitments + coaching staff changes(as you mentioned +ST) for this year will be more important to their future.  Last year's dead cap space handicap is converted to bigger risk/reward opportunities for this year. 

 

One of my favorite movie quotes:

 

Andy Dufresne in the letter to Red: Remember Red, hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies.

 

Thanks; I appreciate this well-reasoned response.  It's also why I don't understand how people can be so critical of the FA moves last offseason when Beane was clearly trying to plug holes in the dam with only a couple of fingers.  The draft last year was crucial and it looks like they did a pretty good job.  Now, it's up to Beane to continue drafting well and also use that pot of cash to get difference makers in FA.

 

Shawshank is on my top 5 list all time.

 

Edited March 1, 2019 by eball

[MPT]

3 hours ago, eball said:

 

You mean the stated philosophy that "you have to build an offense to score points to win consistently in today's NFL and can't just rely on defense?" 

 

 

I mean the one that we're talking about in this thread. Thought that would be understood.

[dubs]

On 2/28/2019 at 6:53 AM, CommonCents said:

One team averaging 21 ppg made the playoffs. The rest were all over 25 ppg. 

 

25 is the right number, it would get you into the top ten in scoring. For atleast the past two seasons 21 is in the bottom 1/3 of the league. 

 

You’re just excited that he knows he needs to score. I get it.

 

He said they want to score at least 21 points every game. He didn’t say he wants to score exactly 21 points every game or average 21 ppg. 

 

If you score at least 21 a game, your average is going to be much higher than 21, getting in the range of the top offenses on a ppg basis. 

 

UPDATE: Glad to see some others understood this too. Was late to the ? 

 

Edited March 1, 2019 by dubs

[eball]

15 minutes ago, MPT said:

 

I mean the one that we're talking about in this thread. Thought that would be understood.

 

Oh, so you mean the philosophy that wasn't actually stated?  The one in which you seem to think McD said the Bills only need to score 21 points per game when he didn't say that at all?  I think you're the one who needs a lesson in reading comprehension.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

17 minutes ago, dubs said:

 

He said they want to score at least 21 points every game. He didn’t say he wants to score exactly 21 points every game or average 21 ppg. 

 

If you score at least 21 a game, your average is going to be much higher than 21, getting in the range of the top offenses on a ppg basis. 

 

UPDATE: Glad to see some others understood this too. Was late to the ? 

 

 

Here was the exact quote:

 

"I think to be a legitimate contender in this league you've got to be able to score, week in or week our, or a threat to score 21 points a game."

[Chuck Wagon]

Feeling in my gut is we go with veteran FAs at C & G to replace the experience of Wood & Richie, then take a young potential franchise LT in the draft and shift Dawkins either to RT or G.  Beane has mention we are team that builds from the front and I think given the success of Foster and their comments on "true #1 wrs" they aren't likely to spend premium money or draft capital on the position.

 

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

There was no "minimum" 21 points per game about it. 

[dubs]

8 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

 

Here was the exact quote:

 

"I think to be a legitimate contender in this league you've got to be able to score, week in or week our, or a threat to score 21 points a game."

 

That’s not what eball put in the OP. And he also was quoting McDermott. 

 

 

5 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

There was no "minimum" 21 points per game about it. 

 

Youre right. McDermott only wants to score 21 points a game. He’s striving for below average. Makes sense too. I mean, the clearest path to career success is to aspire to below average results.  

 

??‍♂️

 

Or....maybe, just maybe, you’re reading into it to confirm something, a bias perhaps?

Edited March 1, 2019 by dubs

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Just now, dubs said:

 

That’s not what eball put in the OP. And he also was quoting McDermott. 

 

 

That's the quote Joe B had in his blog: 

https://www.wkbw.com/sports/bills/joe-b-5-takeaways-from-buffalo-bills-hc-sean-mcdermott-at-the-nfl-combine

 

Anyway you dice it, I think the criticism is fair. 

 

21 points is a low bar, and 21 points ain't going to cut it against Playoff teams. 

 

A threat to score 21 a game is like an NBA team saying they are a threat to score 95 a game. 

 

 

[GreggTX]

Much ado about nothing. Of course he understands this.

[dubs]

4 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

That's the quote Joe B had in his blog: 

https://www.wkbw.com/sports/bills/joe-b-5-takeaways-from-buffalo-bills-hc-sean-mcdermott-at-the-nfl-combine

 

Anyway you dice it, I think the criticism is fair. 

 

21 points is a low bar, and 21 points ain't going to cut it against Playoff teams. 

 

A threat to score 21 a game is like an NBA team saying they are a threat to score 95 a game. 

 

 

 

“McDermott's premise was that for sustained success, they have to be able to put up 21-plus points consistently.”

 

Joe B says it right here. This is the point. Maybe McD said it in a clumsy way, but the point is they need to score a lot more. I think it’s very obvious what he means. 

[oldmanfan]

13 minutes ago, dubs said:

 

“McDermott's premise was that for sustained success, they have to be able to put up 21-plus points consistently.”

 

Joe B says it right here. This is the point. Maybe McD said it in a clumsy way, but the point is they need to score a lot more. I think it’s very obvious what he means. 

The person you are responding to has a history of slanting every single thing ever written or said about the team in a negative direction.  Ignores anything that does not fit his negative agenda and hysterically inflates anything he or she can to try and make the team look bad.  Really a sad thing.

[MPT]

33 minutes ago, eball said:

 

Oh, so you mean the philosophy that wasn't actually stated?  The one in which you seem to think McD said the Bills only need to score 21 points per game when he didn't say that at all?  I think you're the one who needs a lesson in reading comprehension.

 

I never said that either. In fact, I explicitly took that into account in all of my posts because I know some people have a hard time understanding simple arguments. Take your own advice and learn to read before you reply. Maybe try formulating some points of your own instead of just attacking what people didn't say.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

9 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

The person you are responding to has a history of slanting every single thing ever written or said about the team in a negative direction.  Ignores anything that does not fit his negative agenda and hysterically inflates anything he or she can to try and make the team look bad.  Really a sad thing.

When your franchise doesn't have a Playoff win since 1995 there is next to nothing positive to push. 

 

What is sad are the fans that continue to lower the bar. 

 

I want the Bills to win too. But how many "free passes" does this organization get before some results are expected? I don't want to hear 6-10, but that they were "competitive" or that the team is "young". 

 

Luckily for all of us, there are no excuses this year. 

[dubs]

11 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

When your franchise doesn't have a Playoff win since 1995 there is next to nothing positive to push. 

 

What is sad are the fans that continue to lower the bar. 

 

I want the Bills to win too. But how many "free passes" does this organization get before some results are expected? I don't want to hear 6-10, but that they were "competitive" or that the team is "young". 

 

Luckily for all of us, there are no excuses this year. 

 

Just to set some standards for consistency sake, a few questions:

 

1) how many years grace period does a team have from their last “playoff win”?

2) is playoff win the best indicator of success or failure in your view, or are there other, better metrics?

3) Do current owners/front offices/coaching/players own the history of the team before they arrived?

 

[oldmanfan]

11 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

When your franchise doesn't have a Playoff win since 1995 there is next to nothing positive to push. 

 

What is sad are the fans that continue to lower the bar. 

 

I want the Bills to win too. But how many "free passes" does this organization get before some results are expected? I don't want to hear 6-10, but that they were "competitive" or that the team is "young". 

 

Luckily for all of us, there are no excuses this year. 

You are the one who misquoted Joe B, and when shown that you ignore it because it doesn't fit your negative agenda.  And I am so tired of your crap about people lowering the bar.  It's crap, pure unadulterated crap.  What did I say just this morning?  That Beane and McD have the picks they want, the cap space they want, the QB and MLB they wanted, and now it is up to them.  And if they don't succeed they'll be looking for jobs, AS IT SHOULD BE.  I capitalize not to yell but provide emphasis, because you yet again apparently show a predilection to ignoring those things that don't fit your agenda.  Two year ago they were in the playoffs, last year they got tools they felt they needed and dumped guys for cap space.  That was their plan, they executed it, and now the pressure is on to continue executing their plan.  That is not a free pass, that is not lowering the bar.  That is how it is, not only with the Bills but pretty much any other professional sports enterprise you care to name.

 

Your stuff is nonsense.  All here know these guys have to succeed or they won't have jobs down the line.  And I suspect no one knows that more than Beane and McDermott.

[vorpma]

20 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

If you think the offense the first 2 years is the offense he "built" then I don't know what to tell you dude.  He clearly didnt build year one, and year 2 was it torn down so it can be built back up.  Honestly do not know how this is confusing to you.

 

Lets say you are a contractor who buys a house to live in while he remodels it for a flip.  When do you analyze the quality of that contractors overall work?

• When he first closes escrow and moves his stuff into the house?
• During the process of the remodel where he has torn most the things out?
• When the house is actually complete and ready to be sold or lived in?

You are obsessed with stages 1 and 2 with no patience to see stage 3.  Got news for you, stages 1 and 2 are always necessary on a remodel just like they are on a rebuild.  Sometimes a coach can enter the picture with part of the rebuild started.  Like when McVay took over the Rams and it had talent on D, its franchise QB already on the roster, and an elite RB to help his offense.  Thats like taking over a house that already had the heavy lifting done and now you just gotta come in and add the amenities.  Much quicker flip, much quicker team rebuild.  

 

McD didnt have that luxury.  And what he and Beane have done in 2 combined seasons is pretty encouraging.  Year 3 (or year 2 for Beane) is now about doing the finishing work to really make the place shine.  And if they don't do a good job, they will be on the hot seat.  But their body of work is not what they did to get here, its what they do NOW that we are ready for this stage.  

Great post; some adult input!

Just now, oldmanfan said:

You are the one who misquoted Joe B, and when shown that you ignore it because it doesn't fit your negative agenda.  And I am so tired of your crap about people lowering the bar.  It's crap, pure unadulterated crap.  What did I say just this morning?  That Beane and McD have the picks they want, the cap space they want, the QB and MLB they wanted, and now it is up to them.  And if they don't succeed they'll be looking for jobs, AS IT SHOULD BE.  I capitalize not to yell but provide emphasis, because you yet again apparently show a predilection to ignoring those things that don't fit your agenda.  Two year ago they were in the playoffs, last year they got tools they felt they needed and dumped guys for cap space.  That was their plan, they executed it, and now the pressure is on to continue executing their plan.  That is not a free pass, that is not lowering the bar.  That is how it is, not only with the Bills but pretty much any other professional sports enterprise you care to name.

 

Your stuff is nonsense.  All here know these guys have to succeed or they won't have jobs down the line.  And I suspect no one knows that more than Beane and McDermott.

Oldmanfan comes through again; great post!

15 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

"You have to score points to win in this league".  But you insist on taking anything said by this organization and spin it into a negative. 

 

Hyperbolic lunacy.

I swear many who post on TBD really know little about football, it is a passing fancy much like following trending entertainment. Then there is the "temper tantrum" approach - I want it and I want it now, give it to me, and if I don't get I throw a temper tantrum. Fire everyone now! 

[MPT]

32 minutes ago, vorpma said:

Great post; some adult input!

Oldmanfan comes through again; great post!

I swear many who post on TBD really know little about football, it is a passing fancy much like following trending entertainment. Then there is the "temper tantrum" approach - I want it and I want it now, give it to me, and if I don't get I throw a temper tantrum. Fire everyone now! 

 

Show me one post where someone demanded a firing please.

[vorpma]

46 minutes ago, MPT said:

 

Show me one post where someone demanded a firing please.

Can't even respond, I have watched it posted on TBD quite often over the last year by many providing the negative posts on this topic. As one post stated, many members of TBD will never be happy with anything this organization does!