When Does Taxation Become Oppression?

[Tiberius]

39 minutes ago, The_Dude said:

 

Tibs, how much should YOU pay in taxes? How much of the money you make should go to taxes? I want to know what you’d make your tax rate if given the chance. Honest question. 

I should pay enough to have the government funded well enough to keep the peace, provide for the public welfare and pay for defense 

[The_Dude]

11 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

I should pay enough to have the government funded well enough to keep the peace, provide for the public welfare and pay for defense 

 

N-n-no....

 

Percentage wise, of YOUR paycheck, how much total should go to taxes? Don’t cowardly duck the question. You won’t appease me by doing so. 

[Tiberius]

2 minutes ago, The_Dude said:

 

N-n-no....

 

Percentage wise, of YOUR paycheck, how much total should go to taxes? Don’t cowardly duck the question. You won’t appease me by doing so. 

I don't know, never really thought about it before. So I don't want to give an answer that is not well informed. 

[Koko78]

24 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

So I don't want to give an answer that is not well informed. 

 

Like that's ever stopped you.

[The_Dude]

50 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

I don't know, never really thought about it before. So I don't want to give an answer that is not well informed. 

 

I’m not surprised. I’d wager most liberals have never confronted that question.  

 

Well maybe you should. Think of it like this, if a man is taxed 20% that’s the government confiscating 2.5 months worth of his paychecks. That’s only 20%. Were all paying more than that. 

 

So, what is a fair percentage, and what is the Social Contract? Because right now what liberals are advocating for is very close to slavery. 

[Foxx]

1 hour ago, Tiberius said:

I don't know, never really thought about it before. So I don't want to give an answer that is not well informed. 

let's go the other route... at what point would you consider it to be oppression?

Edited February 24, 2019 by Foxx

[Tiberius]

19 hours ago, The_Dude said:

 

I’m not surprised. I’d wager most liberals have never confronted that question.  

 

Well maybe you should. Think of it like this, if a man is taxed 20% that’s the government confiscating 2.5 months worth of his paychecks. That’s only 20%. Were all paying more than that. 

 

So, what is a fair percentage, and what is the Social Contract? Because right now what liberals are advocating for is very close to slavery. 

Most Liberals? Ya, because we are not full of sh it like some people. 

 

Cry all you want, but we only live in the most prosperous society on earth. And you are crying. 

19 hours ago, Foxx said:

let's go the other route... at what point would you consider it to be oppression?

Ok, well, to start, I'd say certainty not now for general taxes. Not even sure why this is a conversation now. 

 

The oppressive nature would would be if it were being simply wasted on things like corruption and just plain old bad policy. Trump's taxes on imports and the trade war they started and really hurting American farmers. Would you consider that oppressive? 

 

 

[The_Dude]

42 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Most Liberals? Ya, because we are not full of sh it like some people. 

 

Cry all you want, but we only live in the most prosperous society on earth. And you are crying. 

Ok, well, to start, I'd say certainty not now for general taxes. Not even sure why this is a conversation now. 

 

The oppressive nature would would be if it were being simply wasted on things like corruption and just plain old bad policy. Trump's taxes on imports and the trade war they started and really hurting American farmers. Would you consider that oppressive? 

 

 

 

Tibs, think about it honestly and then answer. How many work weeks of the year should you hand over to the government. A 20% tax rate is over 10 weeks of labor. Should 10 of your 52 work weeks be confiscated by the government? Should it be more? Should it be less? I’m asking because 20% is the threshold I deem fair. What do you think is fair?

[Tiberius]

2 hours ago, The_Dude said:

 

Tibs, think about it honestly and then answer. How many work weeks of the year should you hand over to the government. A 20% tax rate is over 10 weeks of labor. Should 10 of your 52 work weeks be confiscated by the government? Should it be more? Should it be less? I’m asking because 20% is the threshold I deem fair. What do you think is fair?

Government does a lot for us, that has to be paid for. My mom is on Medicare, so I don't mind paying for that. 

 

Trumps tariffs are oppressive, right? 

[The_Dude]

5 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Government does a lot for us, that has to be paid for. My mom is on Medicare, so I don't mind paying for that. 

 

Trumps tariffs are oppressive, right? 

 

Dude, again, how many work weeks proceeds of yours should be confiscated by the government. That’s all I’m asking. How many work weeks out of the year? You’re scared to answer because you’re scared to contemplate the question.  

[DC Tom]

Ironically, the point at which gator and Dude start responding to each other is both oppressive and taxing.

[The_Dude]

19 minutes ago, DC Tom said:

Ironically, the point at which gator and Dude start responding to each other is both oppressive and taxing.

 

I like you more than I respect you, and I don’t like you even a little. 

 

I appreciate wit wherever it can be found, and as a truthful person I must say I appreciate your wit. But that’s where your positive traits end. Abruptly. 

 

The thing about you is you only seem to chime in with insults and rarely add anything of substance to any conversations. It’s as if you’re completely void of convictions. To me, the most pathetic kind of man is one void of convictions. But that’s why you’re you and I’m an achiever.  

[Foxx]

4 hours ago, Tiberius said:

...Ok, well, to start, I'd say certainty not now for general taxes. Not even sure why this is a conversation now. 

 

The oppressive nature would would be if it were being simply wasted on things like corruption and just plain old bad policy. Trump's taxes on imports and the trade war they started and really hurting American farmers. Would you consider that oppressive? 

well, to be honest Trump is only correcting a long time wrong. it is not Trumps fault that trade imbalances exist, they are a byproduct of the previous, what... 40/50 years of our elite's wrong headed views. while these trade imbalances might have been a good idea at some point in the past, the point where they turned into bad ideas has long passed. sometimes taking a step backwards in order to go forward in a better more prosperous way is required. Trump is doing what needs to be done by doing the heavy lifting. 

 

i understand that some are going through pains with this process but the fault for that lies at the feet of previous administrations for not dealing with it prior. as you can see, these policies are beginning to bear fruit as we have the new NAFTA, the USMCA which is a lot more fair to America. China is determined to correct the trade imbalance that exists. 

 

cheer up, things are turning around for the better. we really do have a populist president, it is just that the media and the Left don't want you to understand that.

 

 

Edited February 25, 2019 by Foxx

[Tiberius]

58 minutes ago, The_Dude said:

 

Dude, again, how many work weeks proceeds of yours should be confiscated by the government. That’s all I’m asking. How many work weeks out of the year? You’re scared to answer because you’re scared to contemplate the question.  

It's a dumb question. 

9 minutes ago, Foxx said:

well, to be honest Trump is only correcting a long time wrong. it is not Trumps fault that trade imbalances exist, they are a byproduct of the previous, what... 40/50 years of our elite's wrong headed views. while these trade imbalances might have been a good idea at some point in the past, the point where they turned into bad ideas has long passed. sometimes taking a step backwards in order to go forward in a better more prosperous way is required. Trump is doing what needs to be done by doing the heavy lifting. 

 

i understand that some are going through pains with this process but the fault for that lies at the feet of previous administrations for not dealing with it prior. as you can see, these policies are beginning to bear fruit as we have the new NAFTA, the USMCA which is a lot more fair to America. China is determined to correct the trade imbalance that exists. 

 

cheer up, things are turning around for the better. we really do have a populist president, it is just that the media and the Left don't want you to understand that.

 

 

No, Trump just campaigned on an issue he was told his base supposedly cared about. He was going to take on China! What that meant no one knew and the tariff war is just to show he is doing something. The something happens to be really stupid and his hurting his base. If you do not understand that Trump is a total idiot, you won't understand anything he is doing 

[oldmanfan]

The fundamental issue you have to answer related to this question is what is the role of the federal government in society?  If you want a society where the people want a lot of government programs like universal heath care, etc, then you have to set tax rates at a point to provide the resources for such.  If you don't want that, then you set them lower.

 

I think federal tax rates should be low because I think the federal government should only do things that a federal government can do that local and state governments cannot.  The federal government should do things like national defense, interstate commerce, etc.  So set a low tax rate, and eliminate every single deduction such that people actually pay what they should to support those essential federal programs.  I would then follow it down through both state and local levels; i.e. the state does what the state can only do vs local government, and so on.  With again no deductions available.

 

To me, for example, I would eliminate things like the Department of Education on a federal level; that is a state and really more local responsibility.   I would rely on volunteer organizations like churches, etc. to help offset some of the perceived losses from limiting programs and resources.

 

Should you not tax at all?  No.  Government has essential roles to play in society, and as citizens we have to pay for those. 

[The_Dude]

2 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

It's a dumb question. 

Actually it's not. You're ducking it. It makes a lot of sense. Now, if you're like me, a small business owner, you'd definitely ponder the question without being prompted. Why? I can't tell you how many times I haven't had money to pay myself after making payroll and payroll TAXES on the ides of every month. So let's look at it....

 

If I'm taxed 20% which I think is fair, and I convert money into different units, say "work weeks," then 10.4 work weeks a year I would labor and give all my money for those weeks to the government. Over 2 months a year, 20% is. But I'm getting taxed way more than 20%. 

So, Tibs, my question to you is how many work weeks should you work for the government and reap none of the fruits of your labors? How many. Quit being a *****, and answer the question. It's not hard ya know. 

Then, I want to know:

1. How many weeks should a man making $100,000 a year be forced to labor for the government?

2. How about a man making $1,000,000....how many weeks a year should he be a slave?

3. $10,000,000? AOC wants that man a slave for 36.4 weeks per year. You?

[Tiberius]

1 minute ago, The_Dude said:

Actually it's not. You're ducking it. It makes a lot of sense. Now, if you're like me, a small business owner, you'd definitely ponder the question without being prompted. Why? I can't tell you how many times I haven't had money to pay myself after making payroll and payroll TAXES on the ides of every month. So let's look at it....

 

If I'm taxed 20% which I think is fair, and I convert money into different units, say "work weeks," then 10.4 work weeks a year I would labor and give all my money for those weeks to the government. Over 2 months a year, 20% is. But I'm getting taxed way more than 20%. 

So, Tibs, my question to you is how many work weeks should you work for the government and reap none of the fruits of your labors? How many. Quit being a *****, and answer the question. It's not hard ya know. 

Then, I want to know:

1. How many weeks should a man making $100,000 a year be forced to labor for the government?

2. How about a man making $1,000,000....how many weeks a year should he be a slave?

3. $10,000,000? AOC wants that man a slave for 36.4 weeks per year. You?

I already told you I don't know. 

[The_Dude]

Just now, Tiberius said:

I already told you I don't know. 

 

Well think about it, Tibs. Because it's an important question. I don't even care what your answer is, I just want you to confront the question because maybe you'll realize that taxation isn't that much different from theft or slavery. Unlike theft or slavery, taxation is a necessary evil -- to a point. It's necessary to fulfill the social contract, but beyond that its oppression. 

[Tiberius]

2 minutes ago, The_Dude said:

 

Well think about it, Tibs. Because it's an important question. I don't even care what your answer is, I just want you to confront the question because maybe you'll realize that taxation isn't that much different from theft or slavery. Unlike theft or slavery, taxation is a necessary evil -- to a point. It's necessary to fulfill the social contract, but beyond that its oppression. 

Would your rate of taxation mean my mom couldn't get medicare? 

[Warcodered]

14 minutes ago, The_Dude said:

Actually it's not. You're ducking it. It makes a lot of sense. Now, if you're like me, a small business owner, you'd definitely ponder the question without being prompted. Why? I can't tell you how many times I haven't had money to pay myself after making payroll and payroll TAXES on the ides of every month. So let's look at it....

 

If I'm taxed 20% which I think is fair, and I convert money into different units, say "work weeks," then 10.4 work weeks a year I would labor and give all my money for those weeks to the government. Over 2 months a year, 20% is. But I'm getting taxed way more than 20%. 

So, Tibs, my question to you is how many work weeks should you work for the government and reap none of the fruits of your labors? How many. Quit being a *****, and answer the question. It's not hard ya know. 

Then, I want to know:

1. How many weeks should a man making $100,000 a year be forced to labor for the government?

2. How about a man making $1,000,000....how many weeks a year should he be a slave?

3. $10,000,000? AOC wants that man a slave for 36.4 weeks per year. You?

This is a weird way to ask about tax rates at different income levels.