"Reviewing what the media had to say about Buffalo Bills drafting Josh Allen"

[JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS]

2 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

.....saddled with low estrogen levels...........

LMAO

[NoSaint]

2 hours ago, Aussie Joe said:

Interesting to revisit...

 

Lets be honest though - a lot of us thought the same at the time...

 

I think it’s interesting that there were some media reports the day after the draft  that the Cardinals wanted Allen over Rosen as well... 

 

 

 

Most aren’t inaccurate even in hindsight. There are definitely some inflammatory attention seekers but most real ones were fair.

[PIZ]

I was disappointed that they chose Allen over Rosen for about 5 seconds.  As soon as I saw that smile and pride he showed in putting on that Bills hat, I was a fan of Josh Allen.  Go Bills!

 

 

[RoyBatty is alive]

The experts appear much more inaccurate on Jos Rosen than Josh Allen,

[MJS]

Anyone who thought Jackson should be drafted high in the 1st was on crack. He's got bust written all over him.

 

Harbaugh will scheme him to some wins, but he'll flame out. His biggest weakness is the most fundamental aspect of playing QB: staying in the pocket and making throws. It's the same reason why Tyrod won't ever be a franchise guy. Russell Wilson can do it and Cam Newton can do it. Their running ability enhances their play, but it doesn't define it.

 

If the best defense is to make you be a QB, you won't succeed at QB in the NFL.

[JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS]

2 hours ago, Michael1962 said:

Is Buffalo really that windy? I lived near there for a long time and don't remember the wind being that significant.  At least not compared with parts of Colorado.

Wyoming has some of the worst weather in America.  Buffalo is tame compared to Laramie.

[JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS]

5 hours ago, Aussie Joe said:

Interesting to revisit...

 

Lets be honest though - a lot of us thought the same at the time...

 

I think it’s interesting that there were some media reports the day after the draft  that the Cardinals wanted Allen over Rosen as well... 

 

 

most of these arnt really that unbalanced, and Im an Allen guy.  Except Barrett Sallee.  Apparently, that guy is a moron.

[C.Biscuit97]

Only in Buffalo do you float over a guy who had a lower rookie year QB rating than EJ Manuel.

 

post this after Allen gets a HOF plague or at least when he is an a good starting for 3 years.  This is silly now. 

[LikeIGiveADarn]

8 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Only in Buffalo do you float over a guy who had a lower rookie year QB rating than EJ Manuel.

 

post this after Allen gets a HOF plague or at least when he is an a good starting for 3 years.  This is silly now. 

 

If you aren't excited about what we saw out of Allen at this point, it's because you don't want to be.

[Alphadawg7]

12 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

Yup.  I overlooked his athletic ability as well.  He's exactly the passer I thought he'd be with some "wow" throws and some "wtf" throws.

 

I was all about drafting him, especially over Rosen. But even though I knew he was athletic, I didn't realize just how off the charts it was.

 

As far as WTF throws, certainty were some but as the season went on there more and more WOW moments than WTF.  Overall, I don’t think there as much WTF throws as many expected or predicted. Especially once Josh came back from injury and after the KB cut.  

 

His final comp % wasn’t great but it also doesn’t tell the whole story of dropped passes, penalties, and miscommunications that brought it down a lot too.  

 

So while accuracy is for sure an area to improve still, it was not really as bad as people predicted, nor as bad as the stat suggests.  More importantly, he got better and better over the course of the season.

 

For me, I am not that concerned about accuracy, I think he is going to be fine and will break out with some better talent to work with as soon as this year.  

Edited February 22, 2019 by Alphadawg7

[C.Biscuit97]

19 minutes ago, LikeIGiveADarn said:

 

If you aren't excited about what we saw out of Allen at this point, it's because you don't want to be.

Dude, I want to be.  But to gloat like it’s a sure thing and laugh at certain comments is silly now.

 

 

but I will be there opening day like I am every year

[Alphadawg7]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

Dude, I want to be.  But to gloat like it’s a sure thing and laugh at certain comments is silly now.

 

 

but I will be there opening day like I am every year

 

Fair to not be sold yet.  I love what I saw and still find myself frequent watching his highlights with a huge smile still.  But even I know he has more to prove still on the field before we know without question he is a long term solution.  That being said, I do believe he is right now.  I think he is not only a long term solution, but he will soon be a top 5 QB in the NFL for the next 15 years.  

 

And super jealous.  Living in LA, I only been to west coast Bills games, always wanted to do opening day in Buffalo.  Going to try and make it this year for sure though.  

 

 

 

[Thurman#1]

6 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

An article from Buffalo Rumblings... I'll post some gems 

 

 

 

Remember what you thought about Allen around then?

 

There was a thread about him a week or two before the draft and you were all over his poor completion percentage. You were absolutely positive he was going to be a bust, remember?

 

I said something in the thread pointing out that his mechanics had been improved by working with Palmer and that the fact that he'd gotten better and more accurate through the draft prep process was a good sign. I finished up by trying to be a bit conciliatory and said something like, "at the very least there's a legitimate argument that taking him might possibly work out." Remember what you said? I hadn't quoted you or engaged you at all, but you replied and were very very lofty about the fact that I was simply wrong, and that there wasn't even a legitimate argument for the guy.

 

Does that count as a gem?

Edited February 22, 2019 by Thurman#1

[transplantbillsfan]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

 

Remember what you thought about Allen around then?

 

There was a thread about him a week or two before the draft and you were all over his poor completion percentage. You were absolutely positive he was going to be a bust, remember?

 

I said something in the thread pointing out that his mechanics had been improved by working with Palmer and that the fact that he'd gotten better and more accurate through the draft prep process was a good sign. I finished up by trying to be a bit conciliatory and said something like, "at the very least there's a legitimate argument that taking him might possibly work out." Remember what you said? I hadn't quoted you or engaged you at all, but you replied and were very very lofty about the fact that I was simply wrong, and that there wasn't even a legitimate argument for the guy.

 

Does that count as a gem?

 

Oh absolutely. My pre-draft feelings were certainly reminiscent of many of these negative posts. 

 

I'm willing to admit when I'm wrong, though.

 

My pre-draft feelings of Allen--which were based on a very small amount of game-watching and mostly history and analytics--were almost hateful of the thought of picking him.

 

But c'mon now, let's be real here, my responsibility to be thorough in any scouting of him was based on the "I was right!!!" nature of an Internet message board, not to a public paying my salary for my expert opinion.

 

The problem and part of the fun of posting these, of course, is the fact that these guys don't change their opinions easily or willingly, in spite of the facts in front of them. Andy Benoit, for example, called Rosen the most "pro-ready QB by far" at draft time. And then, mid December with plenty of (terrible) film on Rosen and Allen:

This is seriously just ridiculous. As someone who actually watched all passes from all QBs, it's downright irresponsible.

 

See, much of the media is a lot like you in that sense, Thurm. They either go radio silence when they're blatantly wrong or they stubbornly cling to misguided opinions and do everything in their power to obfuscate as long as possible.

 

I was wrong in my pre-draft feelings about Allen, bit frankly they were based on a pretty superficial dismissal of the kid. The media, especially guys like Benoit, should be better about this. They have a responsibility to be.

 

It's one of the big reasons I went through every single pass from Allen and 6 other rookie QBs... I wanted to see if the narrative that Allen is somehow so much significantly more raw and inaccurate than other typical highly regarded rookies. He's not.

Edited February 22, 2019 by transplantbillsfan

[Thurman#1]

 

 

Transplant, your views were not "certainly reminiscent of many of these negative posts," as you try to put it. Your views were far far beyond them in negativity.

 

Transplant, you say you're willing to admit when you're wrong.

 

But that's not what happened.

 

Evidence didn't change your view. The fact that it was the Bills that drafted him changed your view. Your habit is to pick one Bills QB and venerate him. This wasn't some change you were making. This was an exact continuation of your old M.O. ... pick your fave Bills QB, and perceive him positively regardless of what the evidence actually shows. You didn't change your mind from evidence. You slotted Josh Allen into your "he's my guy regardless of what happens" slot and started perceiving him differently. He's your new Tyrod.

 

 

 

And if I "went radio silence when I was blatantly wrong," I would be on here all the time, without letup. It's you who's been wrong, Transie. Relentlessly. How many posts did you spend trying to argue that Tyrod was a franchise guy, that he was near-elite, that he was going to be here another year? It was well into the thousands, probably five thousand or more if you combine both boards. You're the guy with the relentless history of being wrong. I've been right.

 

When I go radio silent, it's because I'm busy in my life and am improving my sense of the value of posting on here and how it compares in value to the alternatives. The times I'm on here a lot are generally times in my life when I'm procrastinating. If you see me gone for a few days, be happy for me, I'm doing something interesting.

 

 

Edited February 22, 2019 by Thurman#1

[transplantbillsfan]

Just now, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Transplant, your views were not "certainly reminiscent of many of these negative posts," as you try to put it. Your views were far far beyond them in negativity.

 

Transplant, you say you're willing to admit when you're wrong.

 

But that's not what happened.

 

Evidence didn't change your view. The fact that it was the Bills that drafted him changed your view. Your habit is to pick one Bills QB and venerate him. This wasn't some change you were making. This was an exact continuation of your old M.O. ... pick your fave Bills QB, and perceive him positively regardless of what the evidence actually shows. You didn't change your mind from evidence. You slotted Josh Allen into your "he's my guy regardless of what happens" slot and started perceiving him differently. He's your new Tyrod.

 

Thurm, I can direct you to the thread of my negative views. You don't need to remind me and I'm not hiding them.

 

You're wrong, though. I know that's hard for you to believe, but you're wrong, as you so often are.

 

Evidence did change my perspective on Allen. And you can actually see that in real time in the link I provided if it goes to page 11.

 

The Bills drafting him only forced me to go look at the evidence out there on him, since I'm a Bills fan and I was so convinced--and I truly was--that we wouldn't draft Allen and hadn't really looked much into him because I was so focused on Baker, Rosen and Darnold primarily, utterly confident we'd draft one of them.

 

We didn't. I was forced to spend more time looking at the evidence for why we would make what I thought at the time was a colossal mistake in drafting Allen.

 

And then the evidence changed my mind.

 

 

I think it's funny when you address me directly because it seems to be when you're so incredibly confident you can embarrass me about some kind of wrong opinion or incomplete analysis.

 

Then you get proven wrong.

 

Then you turn into Ninja Thurm and disappear rather than admit you were mistaken.

 

It's the Thurm way.

 

Too funny.

[Ol Dirty B]

This thread reads like Allen has done something...

 

Being better than Josh Rosen is not the standard. This city, fanbase, and ownership with this small time ***** has to stop.

5 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Thurm, I can direct you to the thread of my negative views. You don't need to remind me and I'm not hiding them.

 

You're wrong, though. I know that's hard for you to believe, but you're wrong, as you so often are.

 

Evidence did change my perspective on Allen. And you can actually see that in real time in the link I provided if it goes to page 11.

 

The Bills drafting him only forced me to go look at the evidence out there on him, since I'm a Bills fan and I was so convinced--and I truly was--that we wouldn't draft Allen and hadn't really looked much into him because I was so focused on Baker, Rosen and Darnold primarily, utterly confident we'd draft one of them.

 

We didn't. I was forced to spend more time looking at the evidence for why we would make what I thought at the time was a colossal mistake in drafting Allen.

 

And then the evidence changed my mind.

 

 

I think it's funny when you address me directly because it seems to be when you're so incredibly confident you can embarrass me about some kind of wrong opinion or incomplete analysis.

 

Then you get proven wrong.

 

Then you turn into Ninja Thurm and disappear rather than admit you were mistaken.

 

It's the Thurm way.

 

Too funny.

 

You were convinced the Bills wouldn't draft Allen? Why? It was him or Darnold. How can anyone can talk like they know this team after the past few years say they thought Allen was out of the question...

[Thurman#1]

38 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Thurm, I can direct you to the thread of my negative views. You don't need to remind me and I'm not hiding them.

 

You're wrong, though. I know that's hard for you to believe, but you're wrong, as you so often are.

 

Evidence did change my perspective on Allen. And you can actually see that in real time in the link I provided if it goes to page 11.

 

The Bills drafting him only forced me to go look at the evidence out there on him, since I'm a Bills fan and I was so convinced--and I truly was--that we wouldn't draft Allen and hadn't really looked much into him because I was so focused on Baker, Rosen and Darnold primarily, utterly confident we'd draft one of them.

 

We didn't. I was forced to spend more time looking at the evidence for why we would make what I thought at the time was a colossal mistake in drafting Allen.

 

And then the evidence changed my mind.

 

 

I think it's funny when you address me directly because it seems to be when you're so incredibly confident you can embarrass me about some kind of wrong opinion or incomplete analysis.

 

Then you get proven wrong.

 

Then you turn into Ninja Thurm and disappear rather than admit you were mistaken.

 

It's the Thurm way.

 

Too funny.

 

 

 

You crack me up, Transie, really.

 

You seem to think people view you as somebody who proves people wrong, in such a terrifying way that they then run away from you.

 

You're like one of those little yap dogs that thinks it's a German Shepherd. A little yap dog with leprosy. Not that you have leprosy, but a little yap dog with leprosy would get the living ***** beaten out of him but the disease's effects would leave him not feeling pain. So he'd leap up after the fight, say, "Hey, that doesn't hurt, I must've won, I guess I really am a German Shepherd. The dog I was fighting with has left, clearly there's no other reason for him to have left, he must be terrified.

 

I can't recall a single time you've proved me wrong on here. I've been wrong more than a few times, and I've learned plenty from other folks on here. Not you, though. I'm sure you've corrected me on some small factual mistakes I've made, we've had enough arguments that that must have happened and I've certainly done the same to you. But having been wrong on a major issue? Nah. Hasn't happened. I do remember a bunch of previous times when you claimed it had happened. A ton of times when you thought you'd proved how wrong I was when I said Tyrod wasn't a franchise guy. Once you thought you had corrected me when you told me there's simply no reasonable argument for thinking Josh Allen could ever succeed in the NFL. Not one when you were correct about that, though.

 

 

 

And no, the evidence didn't change your mind about Josh Allen. In the interval between the Bills drafting him and you having a religious conversion, he didn't throw a single ball in anger. There was no new evidence. Just time for you to say ... "oh, wait, he's the Bills new QB, let me go back and look at everything again ... understanding that he's the new possible franchise guy ... wow, my perception is totally different on this guy now that he's a Bill. Clearly I was wrong back when I looked at the same stuff not knowing he would be a Buffalo Bill. How strange I didn't see the obvious aura until he was on the roster. Now it's time for me to do the research projects I did on Tyrod that made Tyrod look so absolutely terrific to me for years."

 

The link you sent proves precisely that. He's drafted on the 26th and on the 30th you're already saying " I'm already growing to really like Allen because I'm a Bills fan and am purely a fan of my team ..."

 

Exactly. And you throw up a few PR videos that you can say you used as a trigger. But none of those would convince a guy who felt that  it was the simple factual truth that his college completion percentages ruled out pro success. And that was you. Yeah, you found a few things that would support your view. None of which had much to do with completion percentage. You'd already heard and in your opinion ruled out the possibility that he might be successful. What changed that? A video on his upbringing in Firebaugh? Would that have convinced you if it had been the Cards who'd drafted him? Puh-leeze.

 

The little switch in your brain, the one I might call the Tyrod switch, had been flipped when the Bills drafted him.

Edited February 22, 2019 by Thurman#1

[Doc Brown]

10 hours ago, BillsSB2020 said:

To be fair, he only had 202 yards rushing his last season at Wyoming. Now I know college rushing stats include sacks, but I don't see how anyone could have predicted his elite mobility at the NFL level.

His 40 yard dash wasn't anything special either.  It was slower than Trubisky's which I saw as having similar scrambling abilities.

[JinxedBill1]

12 hours ago, ndirish1978 said:

I wanted Rosen but Allen won me over.

This was me as well. Pleasantly surprised so far but work to do.  Love the pick now.