BeginnersMind Posted February 21, 2019 Author Share Posted February 21, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Foxx said: stay the ***** out of my life. Don't kill my kid, or me, or other people and I'll be happy to stay out. You can be as stupid as you want and lather up in the conspiracy pool all day, but I have those boundaries. Edited February 21, 2019 by BeginnersMind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 minute ago, whatdrought said: And preventing transmission of the disease comes from preventing the disease!!! An epidemic is not an outbreak of the transmission of the disease, but rather it's an outbreak of the disease! Define "outbreak." No, I'll do it for you: it's the transmission of an infectious disease through a population over a given period of time. An "epidemic" of an infectious disease is literally the transmission of that disease. Hell, you yourself said that vaccines aren't 100% effective. With that constraint, the only way they would work is if they prevented transmission, because you certainly couldn't argue they prevent disease. That's exactly the argument anti-vaxxers use, in fact: that vaccines aren't effective at disease prevention, because they're not 100% effective. And it's exactly why they're wrong: because they are completely effective at stopping epidemics, by blocking the transmission of disease. For example: smallpox. Also, in the US, polio, rubella, and - once upon a time - measles. Measles is, in fact, the perfect example of the concept I'm trying to pound in to your thick skull. Measles ceased to be an epidemic disease in the US in 2000 - there were still cases, imported from other countries, but which didn't spread. There were no native cases of measles in the US in 2000. Now, 20 years later, with vaccination rates low in some communities, those communities are seeing the transmission of measles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeginnersMind Posted February 21, 2019 Author Share Posted February 21, 2019 California, Washington have lax to no school requirements...this is, as I mentioned earlier...an interesting intersection of the fringes of Ds and Rs coming together. Conspiracy "think" overlap. The measles thing is incredible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Just now, BeginnersMind said: California, Washington have lax to no school requirements...this is, as I mentioned earlier...an interesting intersection of the fringes of Ds and Rs coming together. Conspiracy "think" overlap. The measles thing is incredible. What's funny is seeing the anti-vaxxers migrate over the past 30 years from being fringe leftists to fringe rightists. Best evidence I've seen that when you get to the fringe, there is no "left" or "right." Just loons. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacka Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 I'm all for a vaccine against TDS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 15 minutes ago, BeginnersMind said: Don't kill my kid, or me, or other people and I'll be happy to stay out. You can be as stupid as you want and lather up in the conspiracy pool all day, but I have those boundaries. typical liberal mindset. stay. the. *****. out. of. my. life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeginnersMind Posted February 21, 2019 Author Share Posted February 21, 2019 Just now, Foxx said: typical liberal mindset. stay. the. *****. out. of. my. life. Don't. Kill. Other. People. (Stupid-head.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 minute ago, Foxx said: typical liberal mindset. stay. the. *****. out. of. my. life. Then keep yellow fever out of mine, and never leave your house. You want to be completely uninfluenced by others? Fine. Don't associate with anyone. But if you're going to, then adhere to a minimum requirement of responsibility in social interaction, which should include not giving me yellow fever. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, DC Tom said: Then keep yellow fever out of mine, and never leave your house. You want to be completely uninfluenced by others? Fine. Don't associate with anyone. But if you're going to, then adhere to a minimum requirement of responsibility in social interaction, which should include not giving me yellow fever. i never said i wouldn't vaccinate (nor that i would for that matter). those who would have the government tell me that i have to, are idiots. governmental intervention is rarely the correct answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 minute ago, Foxx said: i never said i wouldn't vaccinate (nor that i would for that matter). those who would have the government tell me that i have to, are idiots. governmental intervention is rarely the correct answer. I also never said you had yellow fever. It's called "illustrating a point." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeginnersMind Posted February 22, 2019 Author Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Foxx said: i never said i wouldn't vaccinate (nor that i would for that matter). those who would have the government tell me that i have to, are idiots. governmental intervention is rarely the correct answer. Here’s the thing. The pursuit of life and happiness gets ***** up when you (apparently not you personally but the you of this argument) contribute to the spread of polio, measles, etc. So if you want to send your kid into a school, where disease transmission is on hyperdrive, the government can require you to vaccinate your kid. So they don’t help kill other kids. And if you don’t like it, homeschool that kid up, live in the compound bubble, and please order your deliveries by drone. Don’t use hospitals. Don’t go to movies. Never leave and re enter the US. And on and on. There will be moments when the government will give you a choice: vaccine and some privilege (like school) vs life in a bubble in Colorado. Make the better choice. Edited February 22, 2019 by BeginnersMind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 Who are the the two idiots? Too bad not public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) On 2/20/2019 at 3:56 PM, LABillzFan said: I look forward to the election when some idiot starts a moronic thread like "Smollet and Harris: Your Stance," followed by "Smollet faked his attack, blamed it two black men, and Kamala Harris called it a modern day lynching. Do you agree with Harris or are you not a completely freaking moron and realize that Smollet pulled a Kaepernick to hide the fact that he is about to lose his job!" Let me guess? You're one of the 2 idiots. WTF does this have to do with vaxxing. Holy ExiledInIllinois non-sequitur Batman! You've out did me! Okay Rain Man... I will try and follow. Wopner coming on, you got your Fruit of the Loom's on? Edited February 22, 2019 by ExiledInIllinois Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 2 hours ago, DC Tom said: Define "outbreak." No, I'll do it for you: it's the transmission of an infectious disease through a population over a given period of time. An "epidemic" of an infectious disease is literally the transmission of that disease. Hell, you yourself said that vaccines aren't 100% effective. With that constraint, the only way they would work is if they prevented transmission, because you certainly couldn't argue they prevent disease. That's exactly the argument anti-vaxxers use, in fact: that vaccines aren't effective at disease prevention, because they're not 100% effective. And it's exactly why they're wrong: because they are completely effective at stopping epidemics, by blocking the transmission of disease. For example: smallpox. Also, in the US, polio, rubella, and - once upon a time - measles. Measles is, in fact, the perfect example of the concept I'm trying to pound in to your thick skull. Measles ceased to be an epidemic disease in the US in 2000 - there were still cases, imported from other countries, but which didn't spread. There were no native cases of measles in the US in 2000. Now, 20 years later, with vaccination rates low in some communities, those communities are seeing the transmission of measles. And the concept that I'm trying to pound into your thick skull is that your original assertion: 4 hours ago, DC Tom said: Again, misunderstanding vaccines as preventing disease, when they prevent epidemics. Is ridiculous because you cannot prevent epidemics without preventing the disease! You're being stupid and splitting hairs! If the disease spreads it becomes an epidemic, ergo, stopping the disease stops the outbreak/epidemic! 2 hours ago, BeginnersMind said: Vaccines prevent disease at a high rate, but more importantly, they prevent the SPREAD of disease to those people who might otherwise be in the low percentage of people for whom they are ineffective. How hard is this to understand? I, too, am against government overreach. But if your stupidity goes so far that you think it's your right not to vaccinate your kids and that action along with the other morons who think similarly, OF COURSE, leads to epidemics that kill and infect lots of other people, then yes, I'm for government intervention. I'd prefer that people were just plan smarter and got vaccinated...like they used to. But Jenny McCarthy has won and the Internet can give echo to any kooky belief, so people read that if they get a vaccine, their kid will get autism and go with that. And now we have polio outbreaks in America. Polio FFS. You're arguing for the wholesale conscription into a system that is "good enough." If you believe in vaccines then vaccinate your kids and they'll be safe. So what you're saying is you don't like government overreach when it doesn't line up with your opinion and your views. The reason we're discussing this is because it isn't a cut and dry situation. There are two sides to this debate and you like to pretend that there isn't instead of having the actual conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 2 hours ago, DC Tom said: Then keep yellow fever out of mine, and never leave your house. You want to be completely uninfluenced by others? Fine. Don't associate with anyone. But if you're going to, then adhere to a minimum requirement of responsibility in social interaction, which should include not giving me yellow fever. Or, how about you never leave yours? That coin has two sides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeginnersMind Posted February 22, 2019 Author Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) Vaccines work. Except when morons don’t vaccinate and kill people. Can I make it any simpler? Are we really doing this in 2019? This isn’t rocket science people. There’s no grand conspiracy. Vaccines just work. But to prevent transmission for many diseases, they need mass adoption. Please read up on the measles comeback. It was 100% preventable. And then came the anti vax make beleive non science. Edited February 22, 2019 by BeginnersMind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulus Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) The push against anti-vaccers gets so absurd that they lose all touch with reality and tend to make more folks anti-vaccers. Just acknowledge there are potential-side effects which we should prepare ourselves for, just in case. Even the medical staff does after I get my son's shots updated. Why is it so hard to do, without adding some smarmy comment? Knowledge is power. Man, if not getting vaccines weren't so stupid, I'd consider doing it myself just because of how annoying the anti-anti-vaccers are. You guys do a disservice to society by being so daft. More bees with honey, dipshits. Half of PPP right there. So content to be unaware. Edited February 22, 2019 by Paulus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 2 hours ago, whatdrought said: And the concept that I'm trying to pound into your thick skull is that your original assertion: Is ridiculous because you cannot prevent epidemics without preventing the disease! You're being stupid and splitting hairs! If the disease spreads it becomes an epidemic, ergo, stopping the disease stops the outbreak/epidemic! The difference is that you're a moron, and I'm correct. I've given you objective examples of my being correct, and you being a moron. But by all means, keep being a moron. 2 hours ago, whatdrought said: Or, how about you never leave yours? That coin has two sides. No, it doesn't. Your unvaccinated ass puts the entire public at risk. My vaccinated ass doesn't. They're not equivalent. That's the crux of your stupidity: you can't differentiate between public health and individual health. You're not alone in that regard, of course...but your persistence in remaining completely ignorant of it whilst having it explained to you is somewhat unique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulus Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 For Tom... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Paulus said: The push against anti-vaccers gets so absurd that they lose all touch with reality and tend to make more folks anti-vaccers. Just acknowledge there are potential-side effects which we should prepare ourselves for, just in case. Even the medical staff does after I get my son's shots updated. Why is it so hard to do, without adding some smarmy comment? Knowledge is power. Man, if not getting vaccines weren't so stupid, I'd consider doing it myself just because of how annoying the anti-anti-vaccers are. You guys do a disservice to society by being so daft. More bees with honey, dipshits. Half of PPP right there. So content to be unaware. That's because most, if not all of "anti-vaxxers" are morons. You don't get to cry persecution from being called a ###### when you're acting ######ed. Furthermore, moron bees think the honey is poisoned. How do you "prepare" yourself for "potential side effects?" Do you even know anything about the talking points you're spouting? EDIT: this site's word filter sucks. Mentally ######ed is blocked? Edited February 22, 2019 by BringBackOrton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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