Albany,n.y. Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 45 minutes ago, Mark80 said: There is absolutely zero reason whatsoever why this should impact their desire / need to draft a QB early....well, except for Elway's ego thinking he can get by with such a bad QB because he is just so much smarter than everyone (in his mind at least). Are you really comparing Peyton and Flacco? Please tell me this is sarcasm and i just missed it. I'm saying not all GMs are interested in drafting & developing a QB because they realize every year on the job could be their last. They'd rather go for the quick fix with a proven veteran and win more games than develop the next guy's QB. Elway's experience with Manning compared with Osweiller & Lynch puts him in the mindset that a veteran is a much better way to go. It's like the Bills during Ralph's years. The team never had any success with rookie head coaches. The most successful coaches in Bills history were retreads. Both wall of fame coaches were in the league before they came here. You go with what has worked before, even if the guy isn't as talented as the last guy who succeeded.
prissythecat Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 13 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: To be fair, he had a couple of throw it up and pray plays that saved their playoff run. Few very low percentage plays at end of games that went their way. 19 minutes ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said: Flacco is a mystery to me. I think he had one of the best playoff and super bowl performances ever, he was so amazing as a passer in that playoff/super bowl run. I don't know why his numbers took such a dive, I still think if you put talent around Flacco that he could be a top 10 QB. If the Broncos can just make it to the playoffs they should be ok, Flacco seems to flick a switch in the playoffs and is just deadly accurate. There is no mystery in Flacco's numbers. He had a nice run for one Super Bowl but his main body of work speaks more of mediocrity . Flacco's career QB rating is 84.1. Even for the 2012 season when the Ravens won the Super Bowl, he only had an 87.7 rating. That is not very good at all in a league where elite QBs have ratings hovering in the high 90s to low 100s. There is no switch that will magically turn on. 1
whatdrought Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 I don't know how John Elway hasn't been "retired" yet... This is a good move out of context, as it gives them a proven winner who is... meh?... I guess? But in the context of what he's done since the gods gave him Manning, this is ridiculous.
DCOrange Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: They were whiskers away from being 10-6 last season. They lost a ton of close games that could have flipped them to 10-6 if Flacco had been the QB. He really is a better player than Keenum, who had one outlier season and showed us who he really was this a year: a guy who can't really throw a deep out with any effectiveness. Are they 13-3 good with Flacco? No, but there's no QB out there who'll get them to 13-3. Flacco is a measurable upgrade over Keenum and the team will be better for it. I don't see why anyone would mock this decision. Getting to the playoffs is where you start and always the goal, and Flacco has shown he can perform well in the postseason. https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2018/deep-ball-project This was done prior to this season, but Football Outsiders reviewed all of the QBs deep balls from the prior season (in which Keenum was a borderline MVP candidate) and determined that Keenum was the worst deep ball thrower in the league. Flacco was 2nd worst and the only QB Flacco had a higher accuracy percentage (different from completion percentage) than was Brett Hundley.
whatdrought Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 Also, if the Dolphins are really wanting to tank, don't be shocked if they make a move for Keenum. Step one of tanking is to have a respectable vet be the fall guy. Sucks for Keenum. Minnesota had lightening in the bottle and got too big for their britches.
Buffalo_Stampede Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said: This is so Elway. He has no clue how to draft and develop a QB. Not many people do. Biggest thing is patience, and not many people have it. Honestly if I needed a franchise QB I would want a solid veteran starter in place while the young kid develops. That's just how I would do. I think there is less pressure that way. Edited February 13, 2019 by TheTruthHurts
whatdrought Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 (edited) Stats aren't everything, but damn if this doesn't make you wonder: https://twitter.com/MatthewBerryTMR/status/1095732187058585606/photo/1 From tweet above: Past two years. Edited February 13, 2019 by whatdrought
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 3 minutes ago, prissythecat said: There is no mystery in Flacco's numbers. He had a nice run for one Super Bowl but his main body of work speaks more of mediocrity . Flacco's career QB rating is 84.1. Even for the 2012 season when the Ravens won the Super Bowl, he only had an 87.7 rating. That is not very good at all in a league where elite QBs have ratings hovering in the high 90s to low 100s. There is no switch that will magically turn on. ..true but certainly don't see the Ravens infatuation with Jackson....... 1
Rico Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 Only a 4th for Flacco, while the Bills got a 3rd for TT. Beane is a genius. 8 1
whatdrought Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 (edited) I think buried in this story is that Jackson was by far the least impressive (maybe second to Rosen) rookie from last years class as a quarterback. I really wonder what will happen in Bmore if he doesn't take a step forward. Also, we all have opinions on this, but I think we can mostly all agree that this is good news: the offseason is here and it's gonna be as insane as last years was! Get your popcorn! Edited February 13, 2019 by whatdrought 1
dave mcbride Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, DCOrange said: https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2018/deep-ball-project This was done prior to this season, but Football Outsiders reviewed all of the QBs deep balls from the prior season (in which Keenum was a borderline MVP candidate) and determined that Keenum was the worst deep ball thrower in the league. Flacco was 2nd worst and the only QB Flacco had a higher accuracy percentage (different from completion percentage) than was Brett Hundley. Huh?? That tells me nothing. The Ravens had no receivers the year before, and in any event no way no how are Brissett, Prescott, and Tyrod Taylor better deep throwers than, say, Roethlisberger or Matthew Stafford. I mean, come on. So much of these stats are functions of the team around the QBs. I'm focusing on arm strength and the ability to make throws. Keenum struggles; Flacco doesn't. He has a good arm. I really like FO, but this is a garbage chart assuming we're meant to draw conclusions from it. Taylor was a good deep thrower when he was throwing to Sammy Watkins, Hogan, Woods, and and a healthy Percy Harvin; he became a garbage deep thrower when tossing it to Matthews, Benjamin, and Zay Jones. Go figure. 1
Buffalo_Stampede Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 I'm just happy we aren't in the QB market this year because we would have been all over Flacco. Big strong arm QBs get Buffalo GMs all hot and bothered. Probably end up giving a 2nd.
DCOrange Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 1 minute ago, whatdrought said: Stats aren't everything, but damn if this doesn't make you wonder: https://twitter.com/MatthewBerryTMR/status/1095732187058585606/photo/1 For those thinking that this is simply because Keenum had the Vikings WRs to throw to and it was a fluke season for him (which it was), here's his numbers this season in which he sucked compared to Flacco's last two years (Flacco first, Keenum 2nd): Comp %: 62.9% vs. 62.3% Yd/Att: 6.04 vs. 6.63 AY/Att: 5.76 vs. 6.10 TD/Int: 1.58 vs. 1.2 TD%: 3.2% vs. 3.1% INT%: 2.0% vs. 2.6% QB Rating: 81.9 vs. 81.2 It's very close.
MrEpsYtown Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 22 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said: Shocking right? I think he makes a lot of sense for Arizona. Could help Rosen take a step back and I think he's a great fit for what Kingsbury wants to do. A lot of similar concepts to what he did in college at Houston. The other option is to be the starter for whatever team drafts Kyler Murray. Keenum would be the perfect mentor for Murray. Outside of that, the Redskins make sense as well.
vincec Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, BillsFan4 said: Not the first team that came to mind when I thought about trade destinations for Flacco. Wonder what happens with Keenum? Does he have any trade value, or will he just be cut? I don't think they ever saw him as more than a "bridge" QB. I assume they'll just keep him in the backup role. Maybe with a "restructured" contract. Edited February 13, 2019 by vincec
whatdrought Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 1 minute ago, DCOrange said: For those thinking that this is simply because Keenum had the Vikings WRs to throw to and it was a fluke season for him (which it was), here's his numbers this season in which he sucked compared to Flacco's last two years (Flacco first, Keenum 2nd): Comp %: 62.9% vs. 62.3% Yd/Att: 6.04 vs. 6.63 AY/Att: 5.76 vs. 6.10 TD/Int: 1.58 vs. 1.2 TD%: 3.2% vs. 3.1% INT%: 2.0% vs. 2.6% QB Rating: 81.9 vs. 81.2 It's very close. I can't tell if you're arguing against me, or with me... My point was that they doesn't seem to be a huge disparity between the two.
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 8 minutes ago, whatdrought said: I think buried in this story is that Jackson was by far the least impressive (maybe second to Rosen) rookie from last years class as a quarterback. I really wonder what will happen in Bmore if he doesn't take a step forward. Also, we all have opinions on this, but I think we can mostly all agree that this is good news: the offseason is here and it's gonna be as insane as last years was! Get your popcorn! ...at least we know why Harbaugh signed the extension QUICKLY......
whatdrought Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 1 minute ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...at least we know why Harbaugh signed the extension QUICKLY...... Honestly... Harbaugh is a good football mind, you have to wonder if he really believes he can make a full scale college offense work, or if he's just going with the flow. The reality is that they got outclassed by a team that was then immediately taken to the whipping post. 1
DCOrange Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, whatdrought said: I can't tell if you're arguing against me, or with me... My point was that they doesn't seem to be a huge disparity between the two. I'm with you; was just anticipating that people will try to disparage your post because one of the two years included for Keenum was almost certainly a fluke year. I was pointing out that even with Keenum coming back down to Earth last season, he's still comparable to Flacco. Edited February 13, 2019 by DCOrange 1
vincec Posted February 13, 2019 Posted February 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Stank_Nasty said: this is awesome. its blows my mind how much a playoff run nearly a decade ago clouds peoples judgment on this guy.... he's been barely average ever since. Obviously Denver thinks that his mediocre results are mostly the result of Baltimore's offensive system and/or surrounding personnel, and that he has the ability and leadership qualities to become a top tier QB in the right situation. I guess we'll see.
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