Jachai Polite - your new edge?

[Thurman#1]

15 hours ago, Cripple Creek said:

he had nothing of the sort

 

 

He did. No player or coach ever questioned his motor or his work habits. He simply wasn't talented. Speed but no muscle.

 

16 hours ago, CSBill said:

Arron Maybin had a really high motor, how'd that work out?

 

 

Please. Nobody is saying that a high motor is enough, or that a high motor guarantees success. Of course you have to have talent. Polite appears to have it. 

 

Maybin played at 230 in college. Polite at 261. It's not a good comparison.

 

11 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Please don't ever use the term lunch pail again. Did we not learn from the mediocrity of Chris Kelsay.

 

 

Or the success of Kyle Williams, another lunch pail guy.

Edited February 10, 2019 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

 

 

10 hours ago, LSHMEAB said:

He was a below average player at the most important defensive position who got paid like he was rock solid. It's not that he was terrible. It's that he should have been strictly a rotational guy. He's very emblematic of the Bills mediocrity over the last 20 years.

 

 

LDE is not the most important defensive position and it was even less so back in Kelsay's day. Kelsay was a very good run stopper who didn't have a lot of talent at rushing the passer.

 

If he is emblematic, it's only because fans keep saying it's so. It's not his fault he was a bit overpaid or that they never brought in someone who could take his job. Larry Triplett, John DiGiorgio, Angelo Crowell, Donte Whitner, Ko Simpson, Jeff Posey, Lawyer Milloy, Tim Anderson, Keith Ellison, Kawika Mitchell, Drayton Florence, Nick Barnett, Spencer Johnson ... there were plenty of other players without a ton of talent.

 

Blame the GMs. Was it Kelsay's fault that when the GMs decided they needed a pass rush from the left side the guy they chose to accomplish that was Maybin?

9 hours ago, Just Joshin' said:

Not if there are 5 better.

 

 

Agreed. I like Polite. Not sure he's a top nine guy but I like him. I'll trust that Beane will spend a lot more time ranking these guys than I will.

 

Not sure if this has been posted here yet, but this is a good article on Polite. Did you know as a freshman he put on ten pounds because the coaches wanted to get him on the field so they put him at DT?

 

https://www.si.com/college-football/2018/10/23/jachai-polite-florida-gators-mom-twitter-nfl-draft

Edited February 10, 2019 by Thurman#1

[BUFFALOKIE]

6 hours ago, Clyde Smith said:

It is the worst, but like did we really need a description of the lyrics?

Bad judgement on my part. I sincerely meant no offense. Sorry.

Edited February 10, 2019 by BUFFALOKIE

[Clyde Smith]

13 hours ago, LSHMEAB said:

I definitely didn't need the description. Not quite sure why that was necessary.

 

Kid looks good, but it's a highlight video. Still not a fan because of size/speed/productivity. Not quite sure why this guy is considered some hot prospect. Maybe I'm missing something.

Exactly, very unnecessary. I look at him as a 2-3rd. If he’s there give me Ferrell in the 1st. Honestly I’m pretty content with Murphy and Shaq.

[MrEpsYtown]

He and Morse are the most obvious adds in free agency. And those moves alone fix a lot. 

[LSHMEAB]

1 hour ago, Clyde Smith said:

Exactly, very unnecessary. I look at him as a 2-3rd. If he’s there give me Ferrell in the 1st. Honestly I’m pretty content with Murphy and Shaq.

Can't agree with the confidence in Murphy, but yes to everything else.

[LSHMEAB]

11 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

 

 

LDE is not the most important defensive position and it was even less so back in Kelsay's day. Kelsay was a very good run stopper who didn't have a lot of talent at rushing the passer.

I respect the distinction between LDE and RDE and you make some valid points. That said, Kelsay had plenty of opportunities to rush the passer and he almost never got home. Fine. If they wanted him to stop the run, you better have a pass rusher to bring in on third down. Like I said, he wasn't a terrible player, but as a pass rusher, he didn't get home. That's a big problem. Plenty of LDE's got home during the 2000's.

Edited February 10, 2019 by LSHMEAB

[Prickly Pete]

There are complaints here about him celebrating while the ball is still live, but there is also a play where he hustles his ass off winding his way around players to get 25 yards downfield to make a tackle. I think he's a awareness is fine.

[WideNine]

2 hours ago, OJ Tom said:

There are complaints here about him celebrating while the ball is still live, but there is also a play where he hustles his ass off winding his way around players to get 25 yards downfield to make a tackle. I think he's a awareness is fine.

 

I saw that play first and did not discount it. Love that kind of hustle.

 

Just questioned the football IQ of someone who celebrates while the play is still live, as that happened on a few of his highlight  clips.

 

 

[Brand J]

On 2/9/2019 at 11:30 AM, RPbillsfan said:

6'2", 260, projected 4.8 forty.  Think he may be drafted higher then his measureables merit.

 

No thank you

At 6'3" 260 Terrell Suggs ran a 4.84 forty. Straight line speed is overrated for a DL. I'm not advocating we take him at 9, but this guy looks like he bends the edge extremely well.

[Prickly Pete]

5 hours ago, WideNine said:

 

I saw that play first and did not discount it. Love that kind of hustle.

 

Just questioned the football IQ of someone who celebrates while the play is still live, as that happened on a few of his highlight  clips.

 

 

 

Frankly, I question the IQ of anyone who uses the term "Football IQ".

 

In the video....

2:10 - I don't know, I wouldn't consider that play a glaring example, he was facing the other way, it seemed like an incomplete pass, and he probably didn't;t have a shot at recovering.

2:40 Same again, and even more ridiculous to attack this guy for celebrating, when he is out of the play at that point.

6:18 this is the only play that could legitimately be criticized, but he just made the play, got up, and the ball is downfield, where plenty of other players on the field also thought the play was dead. Not a big deal. 

 

The whole video is of him causing fumbles! There are plenty of plays where he causes the fumble and attempts to recover. Geez, when you cause as many fumbles as this guy did, there might be a few where you think the play is dead. WTF!

 

I can see critiquing his pro prospects, but he is a ***** wrecking machine in the video, and I think some here are being taskmasters regarding his celebrations. I'm not a big celebration guy, but this guy isn't taunting, and the plays are BIG, and I can see why he celebrates them.

 

Edited February 11, 2019 by OJ Tom

[WideNine]

4 minutes ago, OJ Tom said:

 

Frankly, I question the IQ of anyone who uses the term "Football IQ".

 

In the video....

2:10 - I don't know, I wouldn't consider that play a glaring example, he was facing the other way, it seemed like an incomplete pass, and he probably didn't;t have a shot at recovering.

2:40 Same again, and even more ridiculous to attack this guy for celebrating, when he is out of the play at that point.

6:18 this is the only play that could legitimately be criticized, but he just made the play, got up, and the ball is downfield, where plenty of other players on the field also thought the play was dead. Not a big deal. 

 

The whole video is of him causing fumbles! There are plenty of plays where he causes the fumble and attempts to recover. Geez, when you cause as many fumbles as this guy did, there might be a few where you think the play is dead. WTF!

 

I can see critiquing his pro prospects, but he is a ***** wrecking machine in the video, and I think some here are being taskmasters regarding his celebrations. I'm not a big celebration guy, but this guy isn't taunting, and the plays are BIG, and I can see why he celebrates them.

 

 

Ok then. That's your opinion.

 

If you don't like the use of football IQ I will just say it is dumb to dance around celebrating before a play is whistled dead.

 

Maybe even more stupid to include plays where you are doing that in your highlight video. 

 

That's my opinion.

[Prickly Pete]

6 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

Ok then. That's your opinion.

 

If you don't like the use of football IQ I will just say it is dumb to dance around celebrating before a play is whistled dead.

 

Maybe even more stupid to include plays where you are doing that in your highlight video. 

 

That's my opinion.

 

?

[Thurman#1]

8 hours ago, LSHMEAB said:

I respect the distinction between LDE and RDE and you make some valid points. That said, Kelsay had plenty of opportunities to rush the passer and he almost never got home. Fine. If they wanted him to stop the run, you better have a pass rusher to bring in on third down. Like I said, he wasn't a terrible player, but as a pass rusher, he didn't get home. That's a big problem. Plenty of LDE's got home during the 2000's.

 

 

I don't have a problem with criticism of the GM for not bringing in better players. It makes sense.

 

I think it makes no sense to criticise a guy for playing at his absolute best, doing everything he can. And Kelsey did that, in games, in practice, and he was a team leader in the locker room. We had plenty of players who weren't especially good. Why single out Kelsay? There is no real reason. After the first season or two they knew he wasn't going to get a lot of sacks except from persistence. 

 

The guy they brought in to get him out of the lineup was Maybin. That should not be blamed on Kelsay.

 

23 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

Ok then. That's your opinion.

 

If you don't like the use of football IQ I will just say it is dumb to dance around celebrating before a play is whistled dead.

 

Maybe even more stupid to include plays where you are doing that in your highlight video. 

 

That's my opinion.

 

 

Do you think it was Jachai Polite who made that highlight video? I would bet that is not the case.

Edited February 11, 2019 by Thurman#1

[LSHMEAB]

41 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

I don't have a problem with criticism of the GM for not bringing in better players. It makes sense.

 

I think it makes no sense to criticise a guy for playing at his absolute best, doing everything he can. And Kelsey did that, in games, in practice, and he was a team leader in the locker room. We had plenty of players who weren't especially good. Why single out Kelsay? There is no real reason. After the first season or two they knew he wasn't going to get a lot of sacks except from persistence. 

 

The guy they brought in to get him out of the lineup was Maybin. That should not be blamed on Kelsay.

Maybin was trash. Let me explain why I single out Kelsay. My primary focus has been defensive end for many, many years going back to missing out on Julius Peppers. I have this desire to see the Bills put together a dominant pass rush. It was pretty awesome to watch the defense play during the season where Mario, Hughes, and Dareus all racked up 10 plus sacks. I understand Kelsay was a hard worker. I HATED the combination of Kelsay and Denney. They're not the same player, but I tend to lump them together. I'm not a fan of defensive ends who set the edge, play the run well, etc. That is where the singling out comes in. It's certainly nothing personal against Kelsay the human being. I have a good friend who was fortunate enough to spend time at practice and said Kelsay was the nicest, most accessible guy on the team. He happened to share my view on the DE position, so it didn't change his opinion of Kelsay the player. When I think of the 2000's defensively, I think of a team that constantly got abused by good quarterbacks because they didn't get home. Constantly gave up third and 12's. Constantly failed on last minute drives. Everyone has a different opinion on why that is and perhaps it SEEMED to happen more frequently than my eyeballs told me, but that's my personal view.

Edited February 11, 2019 by LSHMEAB

[WideNine]

25 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Do you think it was Jachai Polite who made that highlight video? I would bet that is not the case.

 

I don't.

 

There's a cottage industry out there, friends and family, or friends at college who have some skills pulling together videos. Players often have the chance to look them over first.

 

Unless this was a straight up product of a rabid fan. Which is possible I guess.

 

The music comment too was funny earlier as I have talked with college coaches who laugh about how recruits sweat over having just the right tracks. He told me that he has to review so many videos that most coaches turn off the sound.

 

It works for fans of the game - I get it. I also get that players are desperate to separate and market  themselves on the field and some celebration after good plays is part of that.

 

Not being aware that there was a fumble and starting an early celebration just bugged me because "play till the whistle" is a pop warner learned thing.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 11, 2019 by WideNine

[Prickly Pete]

15 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

I don't.

 

There's a cottage industry out there, friends and family, or friends at college who have some skills pulling together videos.

 

The music comment too was funny earlier as I have talked with college coaches who laugh about how recruits sweat over having just the right tracks. He told me that he has to review so many videos that most coaches turn off the sound.

 

It works for fans of the game - I get it. I also get that players are desperate to separate and market  themselves on the field and some celebration after good plays is part of that.

 

Not being aware that there was a fumble and starting an early celebration just bugged me because "play till the whistle" is a pop warner learned thing.

 

 

 

 

 

The guy caused so many fumbles, that ONE play, where the ball has sailed 10 yard downfield, and half the guys on the field also think the play is dead... shouldn't  be enough  to condemn the guy's mentality. That's a harsh judgement, especially after seeing him hustle his ass off in the other play.

 

 

Edited February 11, 2019 by OJ Tom

[WideNine]

7 minutes ago, OJ Tom said:

The guy caused so many fumbles, that ONE play, where the ball has sailed 10 yard downfield, and half the guys on the field also think the play is dead... shouldn't  be enough  to dismiss the guy's mentality. That's a harsh judgement, especially after seeing him hustle his ass off in the other play.

 

 

 

I am pretty harsh about those things, and completely unfair when thinking about Bills draft picks.

 

Readily admit it, so don't take it personally.

 

I want the absolute best players the Bills can land. Game changers who also have great situational awareness.

 

It's a high bar.

 

 

[BringBackOrton]

On 2/9/2019 at 8:54 AM, fergie's ire said:

 

As I recall, it was mainly "quick first step" that got Maybin drafted early.  I think it was McShay, in particular, who went on and on about that quick first step.

First steps are important. Ask Shaq Lawson.

[Prickly Pete]

3 hours ago, WideNine said:

 

I am pretty harsh about those things, and completely unfair when thinking about Bills draft picks.

 

Readily admit it, so don't take it personally.

 

I want the absolute best players the Bills can land. Game changers who also have great situational awareness.

 

It's a high bar.

 

 

 

What's to take personally, you haven't attacked me? I don't even want to draft this guy (I like him, but not at 9).

 

So what player do you feel meets your requirements?

 

 

Added: I watched the play at 6:10 again, and that's a ridiculous criticism...he gets up (he doesn't "dance"), and a guy comes over to celebrate with him (blocking his view of the rest of the play). He then "reactivates" when he sees the play is still live, after the other guy gets out of the way. There are about 3 players out of the 22 on the field that didn't think the play was over (most of them looking directly at the ball, unlike Polite who is 10 yards away, with his view blocked)...cross ALL those other guys off your draft list.

 

Just admit you were wrong, and everything will be cool....?

 

 

Edited February 11, 2019 by OJ Tom