SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 See Bill Belicheat Cleveland Browns From 1991 until 1995, Belichick was the head coach of the Cleveland Browns. During his tenure in Cleveland, he compiled a 36–44 record and only 1 winning season.
Franco_92 Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 8 hours ago, Doc Brown said: I think everybody is in agreement there. Pats made the play though. They wouldn't have even been in that position of Brady doesn't put up 328 yards and 4 touchdowns. They also dutifully prepared for that play, giving lots of reps to all of their CBs to make sure they knew what to do in that situation. Butler got burned on it in their practice earlier in the week, and then figured it out. Bill has his team prepared for everything.
dave mcbride Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 14 hours ago, K-GunJimKelly12 said: I have had this thought for years. Is there any doubt now that this is the case? Parcells HIRED Belichick and mentored him to the point where he became a head coach. Building a good staff is job #1 for a head coach. Parcells also hired Coughlin, the one guy who has beaten Belichick on the biggest stage (twice). As I've said before, Belichick may be Sauron, but Parcells is Morgoth. 1
Buffalo03 Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 15 hours ago, Not at the table Karlos said: And Belichick was there the entire time with Parcells for both. Parcells had one decent year at 10-6 as hc of NE without belichick the other two were losing seasons. The cowboys were pretty much his only nfl stop as a HC with out belichick and i wouldnt say he was very good there. He turned the Cowboys around his very first year there. The guy took Quincy Carter to the playoffs. Enough said
Not at the table Karlos Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 35 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said: He turned the Cowboys around his very first year there. The guy took Quincy Carter to the playoffs. Enough said And dick jauron went 13-3 with jim miller. How were the cowboys the other 3 years? 6-10, 9-7, 9-7. Meh.
dave mcbride Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 52 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said: He turned the Cowboys around his very first year there. The guy took Quincy Carter to the playoffs. Enough said He also took over a 2-14 Pats team and got them to the playoffs in two years and the SB in four years. He took over a 1-15 Jets team and got them to 9-7 in year one and to the AFC championship game in year 2. Finally, he took control of a 1-15 Miami team and got them to 11-5 in his first season there; it's the only season since 2002 in which the Patriots didn't win the division.
Buffalo03 Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Not at the table Karlos said: And dick jauron went 13-3 with jim miller. How were the cowboys the other 3 years? 6-10, 9-7, 9-7. Meh. Dick Jauron? You can't make that comparison. Bill Parcells is a HOF coach with a proven track record with multiple teams. The guy turned around every franchise he was a part of. Dave Campo did nothing with Quincy before he got there. How about Jimmy Johnson? You can argue he was just meh with Miami but I think Jimmy should be in the hall for what he did with the Cowboys. Parcells still had 2 playoff appearances in Dallas. I'd be willing to bet a crappy coach or even mediocre coach doesn't make the playoffs with Quincy Edited February 4, 2019 by Buffalo03
Not at the table Karlos Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 12 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said: Dick Jauron? You can't make that comparison. Bill Parcells is a HOF coach with a proven track record with multiple teams. The guy turned around every franchise he was a part of. Dave Campo did nothing with Quincy before he got there. How about Jimmy Johnson? You can argue he was just meh with Miami but I think Jimmy should be in the hall for what he did with the Cowboys. Parcells still had 2 playoff appearances in Dallas. I'd be willing to bet a crappy coach or even mediocre coach doesn't make the playoffs with Quincy And Bill Belichick was there for a very large part of Parcells success. Im not saying Parcells is a bad coach. Im saying Belichick was with him for the better years. All the superbowls and he better seasons in terms of wins. With out belichick parcells best season was 10-6. Its not some incredible feat to make the playoffs with a bad qb. It happens all the time. Did he win more games than his predecessor in Dallas? Yes. But his best year was 10-6 with no playoff wins(i didnt check just going off memory. Correct me if im wrong). Thats not great.
Prickly Pete Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 I think Parcells is a bigger douche than Belichick. At least Belichick is silent. Parcells went around telling everyone how great he is, and acting like no one else knew anything. Belichick is definitely a better coach than Parcells, too.
Buffalo03 Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 12 minutes ago, Not at the table Karlos said: And Bill Belichick was there for a very large part of Parcells success. Im not saying Parcells is a bad coach. Im saying Belichick was with him for the better years. All the superbowls and he better seasons in terms of wins. With out belichick parcells best season was 10-6. Its not some incredible feat to make the playoffs with a bad qb. It happens all the time. Did he win more games than his predecessor in Dallas? Yes. But his best year was 10-6 with no playoff wins(i didnt check just going off memory. Correct me if im wrong). Thats not great. He still took a crappy to mediocre cowboys team that I don't think made the playoffs for like 5 straight seasons before he got there and took them to the playoff his first season with them with a terrible QB. He had some bad seasons with the Giants to but still won 2 SBs with them. He got to New England without Belichick his first few years there and turned them into a contending team after they were awful for a while and that was while Belichick was in Cleveland. I understand Belichick is Belichick but the guy was nothing more than an assistant with any of those Parcells teams. A DC or assistant isn't gonna turn an entire team into a great team. It was Parcells, not as much Belichick
WideNine Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 (edited) Not sure who Belicheck is, but Belichick is certainly a really good coach. These similar threads that have cropped up crack me up because they assume success can only stem from one individual. So it was always person A or person B not a combined effort. That, and people change over time. The book on Belichick from every coach that ever coached with him in his early years was that he was a sponge, so you have to ask yourself what did he take away from his time with Parcells too that has helped him be the successful coach he is today. I don't think it was spying on other team play calls, and deflating footballs, or paying off refs, but I am sure he took some legit skills away from those relationships. The propensity to twist the rules was always there for ol' Bill as I believe he was the first coach to have his players fall to the ground and feign injury to make substitutions during our Superbowl with the Giants. I have determined there is not too much he wont do to win, and that is on top of the fact that he is not too shabby at coming up with a good game plan regardless. Edited February 5, 2019 by WideNine
Buffalo Bills Fan Posted February 4, 2019 Posted February 4, 2019 I think it was Bill. I have to say without question Bill is one of the greatest coaches or the best coach in history in the NFL.
Mat68 Posted February 5, 2019 Posted February 5, 2019 From a schematic standpoint on defense? Yes. He is a football genius. Parcells imo showed how to turn that into action. From an ability to build a Championship caliber football team? No. Parcells had an exceptional eye for talent. Especially, 3-4 front 7.
Jauronimo Posted February 5, 2019 Posted February 5, 2019 (edited) 19 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said: Parcells won with far lesser QBs. However, SuperBowl XXV and LIII may be the finest coaching we have ever seen. I have always been on the side of Brady made Belichick. But after today I have even a bit more begrudged respect for Belichick. I think its the other way around. I look at the different offenses the Patriots have had over the years (radical transformation over the last 18 years) and Belichick's success the year Brady went down in the first quarter of week 1, the year Brady sat 4 games. The Patriots didn't miss a beat with Cassel who had not started a football game since highschool. Garrapolo and even Brisset won games for them when Brady sat out for Deflate Gate. The offense evolved from screen heavy ball control game to a downfield passing juggernaut that set NFL records, to an unstoppable two TE passing game, to a quick timing pass offense, to now a dominant run based attack. They're 3 steps ahead of the rest of the league. Belichick schemes around his players strengths and puts them in a situation to succeed. Belichick is still a Super Bowl winning coach without Brady. Edited February 5, 2019 by Jauronimo 1
Not at the table Karlos Posted February 5, 2019 Posted February 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Buffalo03 said: He still took a crappy to mediocre cowboys team that I don't think made the playoffs for like 5 straight seasons before he got there and took them to the playoff his first season with them with a terrible QB. He had some bad seasons with the Giants to but still won 2 SBs with them. He got to New England without Belichick his first few years there and turned them into a contending team after they were awful for a while and that was while Belichick was in Cleveland. I understand Belichick is Belichick but the guy was nothing more than an assistant with any of those Parcells teams. A DC or assistant isn't gonna turn an entire team into a great team. It was Parcells, not as much Belichick Again meh until Belichick came back in 96.
Buffalo03 Posted February 5, 2019 Posted February 5, 2019 1 minute ago, Not at the table Karlos said: Again meh until Belichick came back in 96. Yes but you're not taking into account that he had already turned the team around before he got there. The Patriots were awful before Parcells got there and then he came right in and in his second season takes them to the playoffs. I wouldn't call that "meh"
Not at the table Karlos Posted February 5, 2019 Posted February 5, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, Buffalo03 said: Yes but you're not taking into account that he had already turned the team around before he got there. The Patriots were awful before Parcells got there and then he came right in and in his second season takes them to the playoffs. I wouldn't call that "meh" How was his 3rd season? Also 2nd season isnt "coming right in" Edited February 5, 2019 by Not at the table Karlos
Buffalo03 Posted February 5, 2019 Posted February 5, 2019 20 minutes ago, Not at the table Karlos said: How was his 3rd season? Also 2nd season isnt "coming right in" It's pretty close. It usually takes most coaches the 2nd year to turns things around. Some can do it the first year but they were still a much better team after he got there. I think you're giving Belichick too much credit for Parcells. Does he deserve some credit? Sure, but in the end it was more Parcells than Belichick. If the Bills weren't so stubborn they would have beaten Belichick's magnificent game plan in SB 25. Belichick said himself that he was hoping we weren't going to start the game running the ball because they would have been in trouble. The Bills lived and died by passing the ball and the K-Gun that got them there and they refused to change. Thurman had like 15 carries for 133 yards. If the Bills weren't so stubborn, it could have been a different story.
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