Josh Allen has shown an unwillingness to lose yards

[YoloinOhio]

After a couple bad sacks with big yardage lost in preseason and Vs GB, something I’ve noticed about Allen as he progressed through the year is that he will do anything to try to make the play, keep the play alive with his mobility if it breaks down, or get rid of the ball out of bounds right before he finally goes down to avoid losing yards. He took a IG penalty yesterday ... not sure if deserved... but with the OL issues this has been apparent to me that it’s a big reason some of the drives stay alive. The past few years, TT would take too many drive killing sacks and lacked situational awareness. Its not something that shows on the stat sheet but it has jumped out to me. 

 

He also has shown a good ability to hang onto the ball when he is sacked ... something many QBs really struggle with. 

Edited December 31, 2018 by YoloinOhio

[Coach Tuesday]

He also throws past the sticks on third down - I was never sure Tyrod even knew the score, down or distance.

[CodeMonkey]

32 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

After a couple bad sacks with big yardage lost in preseason and Vs GB, something I’ve noticed about Allen as he progressed through the year is that he will do anything to try to make the play, keep the play alive with his mobility if it breaks down, or get rid of the ball out of bounds right before he finally goes down to avoid losing yards. He took a IG penalty yesterday ... not sure if deserved... but with the OL issues this has been apparent to me that it’s a big reason some of the drives stay alive. The past few years, TT would take too many drive killing sacks and lacked situational awareness. Its not something that shows on the stat sheet but it has jumped out to me. 

 

He also has shown a good ability to hang onto the ball when he is sacked ... something many QBs really struggle with. 

It didn't make it to the LOS I believe, so yeah deserved.  I like his tenacity about not losing yards, but he scared me a lot this year with the bad decisions like that IG yesterday and the jump balls in the middle of the field.  Sometimes, the wise move is to take the sack.  I attribute most if not all of his bonehead plays to being a rookie.  I expect far less boneheaded plays next season and beyond.

[RoyBatty is alive]

i dont think TT lacked situational awareness, he was very good at running just far enough for first downs when the game dictated it, he was simply afraid to make a mistakes throwing, even if it was third and thirty, J Allen is the direct opposite, 3rd and 30 he is gonna let it rip no matter what, even if is a 5% change of success. 

[CuddyDark]

These are the plays I think he needs to work on most. He needs to be smarter and not have this willingness. This is where QBs turn into Tony Romo and become known as a bonehead turnover machines. Don't be a hero. Take the short pass on 3rd and 25 and live to play another play. Don't put your team in a bad position because you're trying to play hero ball. That said, I love his competitiveness.

Edited December 31, 2018 by CuddyDark

[RoyBatty is alive]

2 minutes ago, CodeMonkey said:

It didn't make it to the LOS I believe, so yeah deserved.  I like his tenacity about not losing yards, but he scared me a lot this year with the bad decisions like that IG yesterday and the jump balls in the middle of the field.  Sometimes, the wise move is to take the sack.  I attribute most if not all of his bonehead plays to being a rookie.  I expect far less boneheaded plays next season and beyond.

 

Just like he did in college, he has a suspect groups supporting him so he thinks he has to create plays all by himself, plays hero ball far too often.  I think he is slowly grasping the art of throwing it away, i can only imagine coaching him from that standpoint has to be a continual battle and frustrating.  

[YoloinOhio]

6 minutes ago, CodeMonkey said:

It didn't make it to the LOS I believe, so yeah deserved.  I like his tenacity about not losing yards, but he scared me a lot this year with the bad decisions like that IG yesterday and the jump balls in the middle of the field.  Sometimes, the wise move is to take the sack.  I attribute most if not all of his bonehead plays to being a rookie.  I expect far less boneheaded plays next season and beyond.

Ok ... I saw him arguing it so wasn’t sure

[TroutDog]

3 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

i dont think TT lacked situational awareness, he was very good at running just far enough for first downs when the game dictated it, he was simply afraid to make a mistakes throwing, even if it was third and thirty, J Allen is the direct opposite, 3rd and 30 he is gonna let it rip no matter what, even if is a 5% change of success. 

 

I agree wholeheartedly on what you said about Josh and I love it about him. I believe that feeds into the rest of the O believing that they can get a first no matter what. 

 

Being aggressive can lead to bad things and, conversely, it can lead to great things. We need to take the chance to be great. 

[CuddyDark]

Also a lot of the reason JA has a poor QB % is because he attempts these throws. If he takes the check down on 3rd and 25 he'd probably have a 65%.

Edited December 31, 2018 by CuddyDark

[YoloinOhio]

3 minutes ago, TroutDog said:

 

I agree wholeheartedly on what you said about Josh and I love it about him. I believe that feeds into the rest of the O believing that they can get a first no matter what. 

 

Being aggressive can lead to bad things and, conversely, it can lead to great things. We need to take the chance to be great. 

It’s easier to coach a QB to be less aggressive than the alternative 

[MJS]

11 minutes ago, CodeMonkey said:

It didn't make it to the LOS I believe, so yeah deserved.  I like his tenacity about not losing yards, but he scared me a lot this year with the bad decisions like that IG yesterday and the jump balls in the middle of the field.  Sometimes, the wise move is to take the sack.  I attribute most if not all of his bonehead plays to being a rookie.  I expect far less boneheaded plays next season and beyond.

 

He had a receiver in the vicinity though. Still a dumb move, honestly.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

1 hour ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

i dont think TT lacked situational awareness, he was very good at running just far enough for first downs when the game dictated it, he was simply afraid to make a mistakes throwing, even if it was third and thirty, J Allen is the direct opposite, 3rd and 30 he is gonna let it rip no matter what, even if is a 5% change of success. 

 

Makes it easy when you have the arm to get away with it as opposed to TT who lacked an arm.

[Rochesterfan]

1 hour ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

i dont think TT lacked situational awareness, he was very good at running just far enough for first downs when the game dictated it, he was simply afraid to make a mistakes throwing, even if it was third and thirty, J Allen is the direct opposite, 3rd and 30 he is gonna let it rip no matter what, even if is a 5% change of success. 

 

 

He did that, but how many times did TT run all over in the backfield and then step out of bounds and take a 2-3 yard sack rather than throw the ball away.

 

TT also would check down on 3rd down way to much and punt to see another day rather than try to get the first down.

 

The final thing is TT was terrible at pushing the ball late in games when we needed scores.

 

All of these were lack of situational awareness to me and things a rookie picked up in 6 or 7 games and made a difference.  The rookie tried to make a play - yes even if it only had a 5% chance of success versus the check down with 0% chance (but it increased TT completion percentage and yards at a useless time).

 

 

[RoyBatty is alive]

13 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

 

He did that, but how many times did TT run all over in the backfield and then step out of bounds and take a 2-3 yard sack rather than throw the ball away.

 

TT also would check down on 3rd down way to much and punt to see another day rather than try to get the first down.

 

The final thing is TT was terrible at pushing the ball late in games when we needed scores.

 

All of these were lack of situational awareness to me and things a rookie picked up in 6 or 7 games and made a difference.  The rookie tried to make a play - yes even if it only had a 5% chance of success versus the check down with 0% chance (but it increased TT completion percentage and yards at a useless time).

 

 

 

I am not sure if tit was situational awareness or just some excessive risk aversion to making a mistake.  Conceptually i will agree with a lot what you write .   Another idiosyncratic Tyrod behavior was he played better quite often when he was way behind early, i recall esp the one New England game where he opened it up and we almost came back to win it.

[Rochesterfan]

1 minute ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

 

I am not sure if tit was situational awareness or just some excessive risk aversion to making a mistake.  Conceptually i will agree with a lot what you write .   Another idiosyncratic Tyrod behavior was he played better quite often when he was way behind early, i recall esp the one New England game where he opened it up and we almost came back to win it.

Risk Aversion is another way to look at it - I agree, but situationally there were many times he needed to do something different with the ball and his risk aversion prevented it.

 

I believe even TT’s lack of getting to the line late in games and speeding up play calls falls into this problem- he just did not seem to understand the entire situation around him - everything was that one play at that time.

 

I agree that NE game was one that he opened it up, but I believe that was also early and one of his 3 ints games that lead to the more “risk averse” TT you see later on.

[RoyBatty is alive]

1 minute ago, Rochesterfan said:

Risk Aversion is another way to look at it - I agree, but situationally there were many times he needed to do something different with the ball and his risk aversion prevented it.

 

I believe even TT’s lack of getting to the line late in games and speeding up play calls falls into this problem- he just did not seem to understand the entire situation around him - everything was that one play at that time.

 

I agree that NE game was one that he opened it up, but I believe that was also early and one of his 3 ints games that lead to the more “risk averse” TT you see later on.

 

Oh I forgot about that.  It was particularly bad under Miami's hopeful new head coach Rex Ryan.  Yeah he was one play at a time, is that calm under pressure or is it lack of situational awareness, dont know.  I could also just insert maybe he aint all that bright.

[billsfan1959]

1 hour ago, CuddyDark said:

These are the plays I think he needs to work on most. He needs to be smarter and not have this willingness. This is where QBs turn into Tony Romo and become known as a bonehead turnover machines. Don't be a hero. Take the short pass on 3rd and 25 and live to play another play. Don't put your team in a bad position because you're trying to play hero ball. That said, I love his competitiveness.

I'll take the guy that tries to make that 3rd and 25 throw. I've had enough of the QBs who take the short pass. I'm not saying there isn't a time to take that dump off or check down; however, for Allen, if it is a choice between a higher risk throw for a first down on 3rd and 25 or a short throw and punt - I'll take that first down attempt most of the time.

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

What is a real bonus with a guy like Allen, is that 3rd / 4th down and shorts are pretty much a gimme!  

[LSHMEAB]

It's subtle but it's a positive. The little ad lib flicks to avoid taking a sack. He didn't get the ball to the LOS on one of them yesterday, but the situational awareness was outstanding. Plays like this make you realize how bad Allen "wants" it. It's fair to question some things like yes, ACCURACY, but there is no denying how much the kid wants to be great.

4 minutes ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

What is a real bonus with a guy like Allen, is that 3rd / 4th down and shorts are pretty much a gimme!  

Was thinking the same when we lined up to go for it in an usual spot but ended up with a false start. Allen can plunge ahead for 2 yards pretty much every time.

[transient]

1 hour ago, CuddyDark said:

If he takes the check down on 3rd and 25 he'd probably have a 65%.

 

Are you sure about that?  Have you seen him throw short dump offs this season?  Thankfully the one to Kyle was on target yesterday.