Again in 5 minutes of a game I see catches no Bills have made this year

[GunnerBill]

4 hours ago, SCBills said:

 

It doesn’t make you any less of a fan, it just makes you wrong.  

 

Bad would imply he was the issue with our offense.  Far from it...

 

 

 

He was AN issue yesterday. Not THE issue. 

[John from Riverside]

10 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Josh played badly yesterday. Other QBs play badly sometimes too. Josh played really well last week. It is possible to think all of the below:

- the offensive talent on this team is sub NFL standard;

- Josh was bad yesterday;

- Josh can be a good Quarterback. 

 

People act as though these are somehow three distinct mutually exclusive positions. 

 

Agree. He is only in the team for his skills in the bedroom. 

I think the real question is

 

If the TWO touchdown passes that should have been caught are actually caught......is Josh still bad yesterday?

 

He had the 2 picks.....but jesus....you see wr's fight for contested balls and win EVERY SUNDAY......but when will it ever happen on the bills.  I see top QBs throw balls up that have to be fought for and expect their receivers to catch them......but that expectation is nill for the bills because our pass catchers are SO BAD

 

Does his mean that Josh had a bad game?

 

Im not saing he had a GOOD game

[GunnerBill]

10 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

I think the real question is

 

If the TWO touchdown passes that should have been caught are actually caught......is Josh still bad yesterday?

 

He had the 2 picks.....but jesus....you see wr's fight for contested balls and win EVERY SUNDAY......but when will it ever happen on the bills.  I see top QBs throw balls up that have to be fought for and expect their receivers to catch them......but that expectation is nill for the bills because our pass catchers are SO BAD

 

Does his mean that Josh had a bad game?

 

Im not saing he had a GOOD game

 

So the throw to Thomas wasn't necessarily a TD but should have been caught and the ball Foster lost in the sun probably would have been a TD had he seen it all the way. But yes, even if they had been caught, I thought he made too many bad decisions and too many off target throws. It doesn't come down to one or two plays for me. It was the overall assessment of his game. 

[billsfan1959]

2 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

Only Bills receivers have this problem. Case in point, Mahomes throws with about as much velocity as Allen and his receivers catch the ball with no issues, including off target throws.

 

Enter former Bills receiver Kelvin Benjamin:

 

 

Yeah the ball has some velocity on it. But there is no question he should make that catch.

 

So no, Benjamin wasn't having trouble catching Josh Allen passes. He actually just sucks. If Zay Jones went to Kansas City he wouldn't suddenly learn to win contested catches. He just sucks. Much like all of our receivers and tight ends. Foster is the only one to show any semblance of consistent catch ability and he is far from being a reliable target at this point.

 

Yeah, when he transferred to Wisconsin. His first 3 years at NC State he was 54.5%, 59.3%, and 58.4%. He didn't magically become 15% more accurate, he transferred to a better team. That actually proves the point that completion percentage does not equal accuracy. Or are you saying that if he had stayed at NC State his senior year he wouldn't have become an accurate QB?

If that was Allen throwing that ball to Benjamin, we would have heard about how he should have put the ball out in front of the receiver so he could catch it in stride..

[dave mcbride]

18 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

I think the real question is

 

If the TWO touchdown passes that should have been caught are actually caught......is Josh still bad yesterday?

 

He had the 2 picks.....but jesus....you see wr's fight for contested balls and win EVERY SUNDAY......but when will it ever happen on the bills.  I see top QBs throw balls up that have to be fought for and expect their receivers to catch them......but that expectation is nill for the bills because our pass catchers are SO BAD

 

Does his mean that Josh had a bad game?

 

Im not saing he had a GOOD game

The ball to Foster *couldn’t* have been caught. He couldn’t see it because of the sun. If you can’t see it, you can’t catch it.

[John from Riverside]

Just now, dave mcbride said:

The ball to Foster *couldn’t* have been caught. He couldn’t see it because of the sun. If you can’t see it, you can’t catch it.

Do you realize how many other pass catcher's make that play?  How many dont make the "in the sun excuse"

 

But even if you took that play out of the equation (it is not josh allen's fault that he put a perfectly thrown ball on a wr that lost it in the sun) there were still several OTHER plays that should have been caught.

 

Get some damn receivers in here that will track a friggen ball and make a contested catch....or better yet actually get separation so Josh can throw them open.

[HappyDays]

45 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

If that was Allen throwing that ball to Benjamin, we would have heard about how he should have put the ball out in front of the receiver so he could catch it in stride..

 

Yep I think this is exactly right. We can criticize Allen without pretending he throws the ball too hard for his poor little receivers to make a catch. Some receivers just aren't good and ours happen to be the worst collection in the league. Very few QBs have perfect precision consistently. Most are putting the ball where their receivers can make a play and they're expected to come down with it. Only in Buffalo is a difficult catch expected to be an incompletion or made into an excuse.

[Putin]

11 hours ago, BillnutinHouston said:

 

What in your view made that a hard catch?

 

The only thing was hard is to watch that ball go through his hands !! 

Edited December 25, 2018 by Putin

[JohnC]

10 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Yep I think this is exactly right. We can criticize Allen without pretending he throws the ball too hard for his poor little receivers to make a catch. Some receivers just aren't good and ours happen to be the worst collection in the league. Very few QBs have perfect precision consistently. Most are putting the ball where their receivers can make a play and they're expected to come down with it. Only in Buffalo is a difficult catch expected to be an incompletion or made into an excuse.

What's maybe worse than our receivers ability to catch the ball is their ability to get open. Collectively, they have to be the worst receiving unit in the league to run routes and adjust their routes to help out the qb. I have been a supporter of Zay but this year it seems that on most plays he is blanketed. His stat sheet is sweetened with end of the game meaningless receptions where the DBs allow him to catch the underneath routes and allow the clock to run out. 

[HappyDays]

46 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I have been a supporter of Zay but this year it seems that on most plays he is blanketed. His stat sheet is sweetened with end of the game meaningless receptions where the DBs allow him to catch the underneath routes and allow the clock to run out. 

 

I've given up on Zay. His ceiling is a decent slot receiver and I'm not even sure he'll ever hit his ceiling. More likely he will bounce around the league for a few years as a #4 or #5 option. He has no ability to separate or track the ball and he has weak hands. Usually players that turn out good show something in their first couple years. Like Edmunds has struggled this year, but at least he has flashed elite potential. You can see the talent that made him a 1st round pick. Zay has never flashed anything. I can't remember a single wow play he has ever made, I can however remember a number of simple plays that he turned into incompletions. He cannot catch the ball in tight coverage but he also can't escape tight coverage, so he is basically useless. It's criminal that our top 2 receivers to start the year were Zay and Benjamin. No doubt that whole position group has been mismanaged and McDermott and Beane have to fix it next year.

Edited December 25, 2018 by HappyDays

[Alaska Darin]

When your receivers consistently drop/misplay/misadjust to very catchable balls, every QB tries to be even more perfect...that leads to what we keep seeing.

 

Get some NFL talent and lets really see what this kid can do.

[dave mcbride]

16 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

Do you realize how many other pass catcher's make that play?  How many dont make the "in the sun excuse"

 

But even if you took that play out of the equation (it is not josh allen's fault that he put a perfectly thrown ball on a wr that lost it in the sun) there were still several OTHER plays that should have been caught.

 

Get some damn receivers in here that will track a friggen ball and make a contested catch....or better yet actually get separation so Josh can throw them open.

I actually do realize how many other receivers make that play, and it is precisely zero. I have to ask: have you ever played a sport in which the ball gets lost in the sun? I ask that seriously. I suspect you have never tried to make a catch in either baseball or football in which the sun got in your eyes and blinded you. If you had, you would never say something this ignorant. I'm not saying it wasn't a great pass; it was. It is just another example of a lack of attention to detail that plagues the franchise. The route should have been saved for later, when the sun wouldn't be an issue. The announcers were even talking about the players demonstrating concerns about the sun's placement in the sky prior to the game during warmups.

Edited December 25, 2018 by dave mcbride

[Alaska Darin]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

I actually do realize how many other receivers make that play, and it is precisely zero. I have to ask: have you ever played a sport in which the ball gets lost in the sun? I ask that seriously. I suspect you have never tried to make a catch in either baseball or football in which the sun got in your eyes and blinded you. If you had, you would never say something this ignorant. I'm not saying it wasn't a great pass; it was. It is just another example of a lack of attention to detail that plagues the franchise. The route should have been saved for later, when the sun wouldn't be an issue. The announcers were even talking about the players were showing concerns about the sun's placement in the sky prior to the game during warmups.

Or they could have simply run it on the other side of the field, which was completely blanketed by shadow.  It's amazing how little attention to detail is paid by this franchise, especially after all of the chronic losing.

 

I remember watching Jack Ham's "A Football Life" and him talking about how Chuck Noll told him to change the position of his feet by a few inches and how much of a difference it made in his play.  This team is still making unforgivably dumb mistakes week in and week out, squandering winnable game after winnable game.  If you swap coaching staffs, the BILLS probably beat the Patriots by a similar score.

 

As Bill Parcells said:  "More games are lost than won."  The BILLS last 18 years give example after example of that fact.

[Big Turk]

On 12/24/2018 at 7:45 AM, CommonCents said:

Croom is barely any better. He has zero instincts. Yesterday’s fumble was like watching a train wreck in slow motion. 

He is banging the owner's daughter...he is going nowhere...talk about a smart move on his part...

[Billsfanatixs]

I think management handled it properly. They tried to get a receiver that was always open and it failed. What's the point in getting a badass receiver if you have no one to throw it to them. Now that it appears we have a real QB, it seems logical that they get some receivers. They now know they need some fast guys that can catch hard thrown balls. 

 

Brett Favre used to have trouble with finding guys that could handle his hard throws. Once they knew, it never seemed to be an issue.

 

Sports science claims Josh Allen has the strongest arm in NFL history, they probably need some specific guys to catch that kinda stuff.

 

[DuckyBoys]

31 minutes ago, Billsfanatixs said:

I think management handled it properly. They tried to get a receiver that was always open and it failed. What's the point in getting a badass receiver if you have no one to throw it to them. Now that it appears we have a real QB, it seems logical that they get some receivers. They now know they need some fast guys that can catch hard thrown balls. 

 

Brett Favre used to have trouble with finding guys that could handle his hard throws. Once they knew, it never seemed to be an issue.

 

Sports science claims Josh Allen has the strongest arm in NFL history, they probably need some specific guys to catch that kinda stuff.

 

Bills have body catchers at WR  More time on the jugs machine catching with their hands away from their body

[PUNT750]

On 12/24/2018 at 7:45 AM, CommonCents said:

Croom is barely any better. He has zero instincts. Yesterday’s fumble was like watching a train wreck in slow motion. 

 

He's dating a Pegula girl - that can explain his spot on the roster.

[Freddie's Dead]

On 12/25/2018 at 10:26 AM, dave mcbride said:

I actually do realize how many other receivers make that play, and it is precisely zero. I have to ask: have you ever played a sport in which the ball gets lost in the sun? I ask that seriously. I suspect you have never tried to make a catch in either baseball or football in which the sun got in your eyes and blinded you. If you had, you would never say something this ignorant. I'm not saying it wasn't a great pass; it was. It is just another example of a lack of attention to detail that plagues the franchise. The route should have been saved for later, when the sun wouldn't be an issue. The announcers were even talking about the players demonstrating concerns about the sun's placement in the sky prior to the game during warmups.

 

If they knew about the sun glare in warmups, even more unforgivable that they didn't put a sunvisor on his helmet.  Is it possible we did not possess the equipment to do something that simple?  Eyeblack is also an effective means of reducing glare from the sun.  As others have said, run that play in the shade.  But no, somehow all these simple means of dealing with the sun glare escaped the notice of our (on) crack coaching staff.