Josh Allen’s Adjusted Completion Percentage = 72.7%

[Bing Bong]

21 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I didn’t go through this whole thread but does anyone have the list for all qbs in this category?

 

also, as a former receiver, if the ball hits your hands, you’re so supposed to catch it.  However, some qbs throw more catchable passes than others.  You don’t need to throw a fastball every time.  Great QBs have the ability to throw the fastball and touch passes.

 

You need to pay for PFF edge

I checked in old PFF list and he's in Chiefs Matt Cassell territory.. cool

 

Not a fan of this metric at all.

 

Just look up a PFF list and it's quarterbacks that have a good completion % regardless and random names sprinkled in.

 

2012:

1 Alex Smith

2 Aaron Rodgers

3 Russell Wilson

4 Peyton Manning

5 RGIII

6 Kaep

7 Brees

8 Big Ben

9 Matt Ryan

10 Matt Cassell

 

2013 had Cam up there.

Edited December 18, 2018 by BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P

[Kelly the Dog]

8 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I didn’t go through this whole thread but does anyone have the list for all qbs in this category?

 

also, as a former receiver, if the ball hits your hands, you’re so supposed to catch it.  However, some qbs throw more catchable passes than others.  You don’t need to throw a fastball every time.  Great QBs have the ability to throw the fastball and touch passes.

So you didn't watch the game? I know you know this, but Josh threw numerous passes with touch, including his very best ones (the TD, the game-clinching Croom throw, etc), and didn't throw fastballs the whole game.

[C.Biscuit97]

8 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

So you didn't watch the game? I know you know this, but Josh threw numerous passes with touch, including his very best ones (the TD, the game-clinching Croom throw, etc), and didn't throw fastballs the whole game.

Oh I did.  And that was more of a passing comment.  

 

But it I am getting a little tired about hearing how terrible our receivers are.  Who is Nick Mullens throwing to?  The Pats don’t have one receiver picked in the first round on their roster.  The Saints have a bunch of nobodies next to Rhomas, who was picked after Zay.  At some point, the qb needs to elevate the receivers. 

 

That said, Allen seems to have done that with Foster and that’s great to see.  But he is far from the only qb playing with questionable talent.

[Vicarious_Fan16]

38 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

 

Welcome to the board, and thanks for sharing your thoughts...

 

...now go get your shine box!

  

I'd gladly shine billy batts' shoes if it would help fix the o-line

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Oh I did.  And that was more of a passing comment.  

 

But it I am getting a little tired about hearing how terrible our receivers are.  Who is Nick Mullens throwing to?  The Pats don’t have one receiver picked in the first round on their roster.  The Saints have a bunch of nobodies next to Rhomas, who was picked after Zay.  At some point, the qb needs to elevate the receivers. 

 

That said, Allen seems to have done that with Foster and that’s great to see.  But he is far from the only qb playing with questionable talent.

Mullens is throwing to arguably the best pass catching TE in the game.

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

1 hour ago, BillsSB2020 said:

A ground ball is worse than a strikeout if there's a force play to be made, but I digress.

 

Nothing wrong with watching games AND analyzing data.

If you hit a ball on the ground with a guy on first you have a chance of a guy making a bad throw or losing it on the transfer or beating it out. If you stoke out nothing happens

[Bing Bong]

4 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Mullens is throwing to arguably the best pass catching TE in the game.

And Saints have Michael Thomas.. you obviously need good WRs. I just think this metric has to get subjective on what's catchable and not. Cam is in a lot of old lists I see available. It's a combination of having good completion %, a lot of drops, and probably a healthy amount of just-inaccurate-passes regularly thrown that average Joe #3s and 4s aren't gonna come down with all the time with circus catches

 

Tom Brady never makes it, because he throws it away and to the dirt so much basically.

Edited December 18, 2018 by BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P

[BillsSB2020]

1 minute ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

If you hit a ball on the ground with a guy on first you have a chance of a guy making a bad throw or losing it on the transfer or beating it out. If you stoke out nothing happens

There's a better chance of a DP than a throwaway. Just sayin.

[Bing Bong]

7 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Oh I did.  And that was more of a passing comment.  

 

But it I am getting a little tired about hearing how terrible our receivers are.  Who is Nick Mullens throwing to?  The Pats don’t have one receiver picked in the first round on their roster.  The Saints have a bunch of nobodies next to Rhomas, who was picked after Zay.  At some point, the qb needs to elevate the receivers. 

 

That said, Allen seems to have done that with Foster and that’s great to see.  But he is far from the only qb playing with questionable talent.

Saints have Michael Thomas. Allen clearly needs better WRs, but I don't think this is the metric to prove it.

[WideNine]

7 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Oh I did.  And that was more of a passing comment.  

 

But it I am getting a little tired about hearing how terrible our receivers are.  Who is Nick Mullens throwing to?  The Pats don’t have one receiver picked in the first round on their roster.  The Saints have a bunch of nobodies next to Rhomas, who was picked after Zay.  At some point, the qb needs to elevate the receivers. 

 

That said, Allen seems to have done that with Foster and that’s great to see.  But he is far from the only qb playing with questionable talent.

 

One could just as easily say that the rest of our scrub receiving core need to elevate their game to Foster's level... and I don't include McKenzie in that list because I think that kid does the most with what he has.

 

What has Foster done differently? Reports a few weeks ago indicated that Foster was going out of his way to put in extra reps with Allen to get their timing down, when KB was asked by Allen to practice routes and timing he so much as said "meh". The success these two are having is not an accident.. the receivers need to put in the work and elevate their own play.

 

McD indicated as much when asked about Foster, basically said that he hoped the other receivers were watching what Foster has done, the lessons he learned by work he puts in behind the scenes to find success.

 

“Sometimes, people need a wake-up call that this life in the NFL, as we onboard these young players, life in the NFL, you’re not on scholarship and some guys need to understand that,” McDermott said. “Some players, unfortunately, never get it.”

 

Foster agreed with his coach.

“I needed it, I needed it,” Foster told reporters. “At the end of the day it helped me grow more into a student of the game. Player of the game. It made me work on things I needed to work on. It made me just do a lot more things that I could do to benefit the team.”

[Kelly the Dog]

15 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Oh I did.  And that was more of a passing comment.  

 

But it I am getting a little tired about hearing how terrible our receivers are.  Who is Nick Mullens throwing to?  The Pats don’t have one receiver picked in the first round on their roster.  The Saints have a bunch of nobodies next to Rhomas, who was picked after Zay.  At some point, the qb needs to elevate the receivers. 

 

That said, Allen seems to have done that with Foster and that’s great to see.  But he is far from the only qb playing with questionable talent.

The Pats and Saints have excellent WR, especially compared to the Bills. Draft position has nothing to do with it. Not to mention that Josh is playing with a #2 who was the worst WR in the entire league last year, plus a #5 who was cut twice this year, a #6 and two UDFA, both of whom were cut twice this year.

 

And the Pats have two first rounders (Dorsett and Patterson, and a two in Gordon, who is one of the best WR in the league. And Edelman. And Hogan.

[WideNine]

17 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

The Pats and Saints have excellent WR, especially compared to the Bills. Draft position has nothing to do with it. Not to mention that Josh is playing with a #2 who was the worst WR in the entire league last year, plus a #5 who was cut twice this year, a #6 and two UDFA, both of whom were cut twice this year.

 

This.

 

The Bills need to do better homework on their receivers, and I agree with KTD where they are drafted means squat if they do not have the right skills, attitude, or fit into the kind of offense you want to run.

Edited December 18, 2018 by WideNine

[Doc]

1 hour ago, Kelly the Dog said:

There was a stat I saw yesterday that seemed to say in passes over ten yards in the air this season, Allen has the second highest completion percentage in the league. That is a good indication of accuracy, too.

 

He was very accurate with the short and intermediate stuff against the Lions.  But at WhyteDwarf pointed out, he had (at least) 4 drops which would have put his completion percentage at 65.4% with another 50 or so yards.  That was very astute of him.

[C.Biscuit97]

44 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Mullens is throwing to arguably the best pass catching TE in the game.

Who was a 5th round pick who had 700 yards in 4 years in college.  

[thebandit27]

2 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Who was a 5th round pick who had 700 yards in 4 years in college.  

 

So it's Nick Mullens that is responsible for George Kittle's performance?  Is that really where you're intending to take this point?

[C.Biscuit97]

27 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

The Pats and Saints have excellent WR, especially compared to the Bills. Draft position has nothing to do with it. Not to mention that Josh is playing with a #2 who was the worst WR in the entire league last year, plus a #5 who was cut twice this year, a #6 and two UDFA, both of whom were cut twice this year.

 

And the Pats have two first rounders (Dorsett and Patterson, and a two in Gordon, who is one of the best WR in the league. And Edelman. And Hogan.

Come on KTD.  Gordon was a 2nd round pick in the supplemental draft and Dorsett doesn’t even play after being a total bust for Indy.  Edelman was an UDFA college qb and hogan played lacrosse.  Again, Michael Thomas was picked later than Zay. These guys are elevated because of their qbs.  

 

Like i said, Allen has done a great job with Foster.  I do think Allen is progressing but I think we just look to blame all the problems on the receivers and it’s a bit unfair.  

1 minute ago, thebandit27 said:

 

So it's Nick Mullens that is responsible for George Kittle's performance?  Is that really where you're intending to take this point?

Sorry, I haven’t become a full member of the Allen cult yet.  I looking at brochures though.   

 

its not all mullens but they found a way to get a lot of production out of an after thought in the draft.  Also, Mullens (UDFA) had a very good game beating Seattle where Kittle was their 3rd leading receiver.  Honest question, are the 49ers weapons that much better than the Bills?  Or are they better at getting more out of their talent?

[WideNine]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

Come on KTD.  Gordon was a 2nd round pick in the supplemental draft and Dorsett doesn’t even play after being a total bust for Indy.  Edelman was an UDFA college qb and hogan played lacrosse.  Again, Michael Thomas was picked later than Zay. These guys are elevated because of their qbs.  

 

Like i said, Allen has done a great job with Foster.  I do think Allen is progressing but I think we just look to blame all the problems on the receivers and it’s a bit unfair.  

 

For the sake of peace between two solid posters - let's just say the truth is in the middle.

 

Our receivers needed to elevate their game, some have and some have not, AND Josh needed to get better with ball placement - which anyone watching the games knows he has done.

 

As for pulling in better weapons, for the kind of offense Josh could run, we need receivers with great hands that can stretch the field. Not all QBs can throw it on a rope 40+ yards, but ours can. You look for ways to use that to our advantage... not that a great possession type, blocking TE that can find soft spots in the shallow zones would be unwelcome.

 

 

 

[thebandit27]

2 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Come on KTD.  Gordon was a 2nd round pick in the supplemental draft and Dorsett doesn’t even play after being a total bust for Indy.  Edelman was an UDFA college qb and hogan played lacrosse.  Again, Michael Thomas was picked later than Zay. These guys are elevated because of their qbs.  

 

Like i said, Allen has done a great job with Foster.  I do think Allen is progressing but I think we just look to blame all the problems on the receivers and it’s a bit unfair.  

 

Michael Thomas was an absolute beast at Ohio State (despite catching passes from JT Barrett most of the time), and Josh Gordon had over 1,600 receiving yards in a single season catching passes from Jason Campbell, Brandon Weeden, and Brian Hoyer.

5 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

 

 

Sorry, I haven’t become a full member of the Allen cult yet.  I looking at brochures though.   

 

its not all mullens but they found a way to get a lot of production out of an after thought in the draft.  Also, Mullens (UDFA) had a very good game beating Seattle where Kittle was their 3rd leading receiver.  Honest question, are the 49ers weapons that much better than the Bills?  Or are they better at getting more out of their talent?

 

Like I said, it's too early to say anything definitive about any of these guys.  Buffalo's WRs are largely awful though.

 

I think it's a bit of both on the latter.  Kittle was darn good in college, just under-utilized.  Dante Pettis and Trent Taylor were both draft sleepers of mine as well.  But, Kyle Shanahan does a really good job of only asking his players to do what they're good at, which is something that Daboll looks like he's starting to figure out.

[C.Biscuit97]

4 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

For the sake of peace between two solid posters - let's just say the truth is in the middle.

 

Our receivers needed to elevate their game, some have and some have not, AND Josh needed to get better with ball placement - which anyone watching the games knows he has done.

 

As for pulling in better weapons, for the kind of offense Josh could run, we need receivers with great hands that can stretch the field. Not all QBs can throw it on a rope 40+ yards, but ours can. You look for ways to use that to our advantage... not that a great possession type, blocking TE that can find soft spots in the shallow zones would be unwelcome.

 

 

 

Good post and I agree.  I definitely agree we need to get Allen better weapons.  At the same time, I’ve seen great qbs make average talents into elite players.  In theory, I want Allen to do that and he’s done great with Foster.

 

but I’m all for the Trent Edwards’ treatment of having TO and Lee Evans for Allen.

[Kelly the Dog]

3 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Come on KTD.  Gordon was a 2nd round pick in the supplemental draft and Dorsett doesn’t even play after being a total bust for Indy.  Edelman was an UDFA college qb and hogan played lacrosse.  Again, Michael Thomas was picked later than Zay. These guys are elevated because of their qbs.  

 

Like i said, Allen has done a great job with Foster.  I do think Allen is progressing but I think we just look to blame all the problems on the receivers and it’s a bit unfair.  

You said they didn't have a number one on their roster so I responded to that. And a #2 pick in the supplemental is the same as a regular draft because you lose your #2 in the next draft. Dorsett has 27 catches and a couple TDs as a last resort, so he does play. Now you're saying Zay freakin' Jones is as good as Michael Thomas?! Thomas just gets elevated by his QB? Zay Jones is AWFUL. Thomas makes spectacular catches all the time.