Trusting Daboll

[TigerJ]

13 hours ago, LSHMEAB said:

Passable, passer, passing. I feel like there's some kind of riddle here.

How much wood would a woodchuck chuck?

It was pretty cool to see Josh Allen go out for a pass.  It didn't work, but it tells me that if the Bills had the talent, we could see some wild plays.  I know of necessity, an OC has to be more conventional on most plays, but knowing the other team could pull something out of the hat at any time that would be really wild canmake the defense feel like they have to defend more and can't overcommit to a few things.  That opens up things for the offense to be more productive overall.

Edited December 14, 2018 by TigerJ

[LSHMEAB]

14 minutes ago, TigerJ said:

How much wood would a woodchuck chuck?

It was pretty cool to see Josh Allen go out for a pass.  It didn't work, but it tells me that if the Bills had the talent, we could see some wild plays.  I know of necessity, an OC has to be more conventional on most plays, but knowing the other team could pull something out of the hat at any time that would be really wild canmake the defense feel like they have to defend more and can't overcommit to a few things.  That opens up things for the offense to be more productive overall.

That play was exciting, but I thought it was too cute for the situation.

 

It's one of those that looks genius if it works, so I get it. Just didn't like it there.

[WideNine]

12 minutes ago, TigerJ said:

How much wood would a woodchuck chuck?

 

1 hour ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

It is scary.

 

But I think McD has a better sense of Daboll's skills then we do.

 

While we only see the product on the field with all its warts, McD gets to see Daboll's "process."  He gets to watch him game plan, coach and prepare.  McD should be able to determine if Daboll's doing the right things.  We know the result is wrong but is the "process" right and just needs better players?

 

Daboll has good street cred already and has been a part of several successful programs, and has spent time as a QB coach which the Bills need at this point.

 

I don't know how Offensive-minded McD is... in regards to evaluating Daboll, he liked enough of what he saw to hire him fully knowing they were targeting a QB in the draft that would need coaching up and adaptive play calling...if nothing else, that should tell you what you need to know about their relationship.

[Buffalo716]

13 hours ago, Thriftygamer83 said:

It’s a little bit of PUNishment and humor; as even Rick Dennison has been completely demoted to of all things offensive line Coach for the Jets.  Anyone whose worked with Volderman will never recover professionally he’s like “The Ringu”.  

 

David Culley worked with him for 1.5 seasons here and his job is safe

 

Peterman couldn’t ruin his career ?

17 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

 

Daboll has good street cred already and has been a part of several successful programs, and has spent time as a QB coach which the Bills need at this point.

 

I don't know how Offensive-minded McD is... in regards to evaluating Daboll, he liked enough of what he saw to hire him fully knowing they were targeting a QB in the draft that would need coaching up and adaptive play calling...if nothing else, that should tell you what you need to know about their relationship.

Daboll played D3 football at Rochester as a free safety And never played QB... and people want him as QB coach also

 

Culley played D1 QB at Vanderbilt has coached all over , coached QBs , WRs , learned from Reid and has a great respect in the coaching community, and people thinks he is unqualified 

 

Culley is just as qualified to be a QB coach If not more so than Daboll

[WideNine]

3 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

David Culley worked with him for 1.5 seasons here and his job is safe

 

Peterman couldn’t ruin his career ?

Daboll played D3 football at Rochester as a free safety And never played QB... and people want him as QB coach also

 

Culley played D1 QB at Vanderbilt has coached all over , coached QBs , WRs , learned from Reid and has a great respect in the coaching community, and people thinks he is unqualified 

 

Culley is just as qualified to be a QB coach If not more so than Daboll

 

Culley has never been a QB coach till he was offered the position with the Bills, though he did have plenty of experience as a WR coach. That was the biggest knock on him being given that position with the Bills. Don't know much about him beyond that and don't really care as long as he does not hurt Josh's development.

 

Was a bit of a stretch taking my statement that QB coaching is what the Bills need at this point and being glad that Daboll has that experience to Culley being fired. Why would Daboll the current OC want to step down to be a position coach? Culley's job is likely safe I guess - really was not even in my scope of thoughts.

 

Daboll however has been a QB coach in the league and a WR coach and my endorsement of him in role was simply following up on Brett Favre saying he was a great QB coach that he had while with the Jets and would make a good HC candidate for GB.

 

[Buffalo716]

20 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

Culley has never been a QB coach till he was offered the position with the Bills, though he did have plenty of experience as a WR coach. That was the biggest knock on him being given that position with the Bills. Don't know much about him beyond that and don't really care as long as he does not hurt Josh's development.

 

Was a bit of a stretch taking my statement that QB coaching is what the Bills need at this point and being glad that Daboll has that experience to Culley being fired. Why would Daboll the current OC want to step down to be a position coach? Culley's job is likely safe I guess - really was not even in my scope of thoughts.

 

Daboll however has been a QB coach in the league and a WR coach and my endorsement of him in role was simply following up on Brett Favre saying he was a great QB coach that he had while with the Jets and would make a good HC candidate for GB.

 

Culley was a QB coach in college. He received better offers from schools as a WR coach and O coordinator,  It be dumb not to accept it

 

Reid is on record saying Culley would be a great QB Coach, O Coordinator and Head Coach 

 

and yes Culley would know just as much if not more about QB fundamentals and how to apply them than Daboll... something that is fundamental to a NFL QB coaches job. Fixing Allen’s footwork etc

 

You said we needed a QB coach

 

Jordan Palmer is a QB Guru and he was never a QB coach...

 

Culley has tons of experience in football . Coaching QBs, WRs and being assistant HC.. not too mention being a D1 QB

 

Allen is in good hands. Culley is a really good coach. His only knock is he is on the older side and Thay should why he doesn’t get looks for higher positions 

Edited December 14, 2018 by Buffalo716

[WideNine]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Culley was a QB coach in college. He received better offers from schools as a WR coach. It be dumb not to accept it

 

Reid is on record saying Culley would be a great QB Coach, O Coordinator and Head Coach 

 

and yes Culley would know just as much if not more about QB fundamentals and how to apply them than Daboll... something that is fundamental to a QB coaches job

 

Daboll was a QB coach for 2 years... you act like it was 15

 

Jordan Palmer is a QB Guru and he was never a QB coach...

 

Culley has tons of experience in football . Coaching QBs, WRs and being assistant HC.. not too mention being a D1 QB

 

OK..... Culley is awesome. You are trying too hard to argue - do you have a point?

 

Are you a member of the Culley family and have some kind of inferiority complex about him working for Daboll on his staff?

 

Are you saying Daboll is not a good QB coach because Culley is a good one (that is just plain crazy), or that Daboll was not a good QB coach in his past... because a HOF QB who had him as a coach would appear to disagree with you.

 

 

 

Really I have no idea where you are going with this and just don't care. If Culley is all that, it is good for the Bills -  I don't feel compelled to compare him to the guy he works for.

[Buffalo716]

46 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

OK..... Culley is awesome. You are trying too hard to argue - do you have a point?

 

Are you a member of the Culley family and have some kind of inferiority complex about him working for Daboll on his staff?

 

Are you saying Daboll is not a good QB coach because Culley is a good one (that is just plain crazy), or that Daboll was not a good QB coach in his past... because a HOF QB who had him as a coach would appear to disagree with you.

 

 

 

Really I have no idea where you are going with this and just don't care. If Culley is all that, it is good for the Bills -  I don't feel compelled to compare him to the guy he works for.

I have no relation to his family. I have friends who have played for him and they say he’s a great coach 

 

I originally quoted you because you said we need a QB coach.

 

My point is we do not 

 

i wasnt trying to start an argument 

Edited December 14, 2018 by Buffalo716

[WideNine]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

I have no relation to his family. I have friends who have played for him and they say he’s a great coach 

 

I originally quoted you because you said we need a QB coach.

 

My point is we do not 

 

i wasnt trying to start an argument 

what i originally quoted was that Daboll had spent time as a QB Coach which the Bills need right now - meaning the Bills need quarterback coaching - really had nothing to do with personnel changes, but I can understand the confusion.

 

There is no need to bash Daboll to prop up Culley though. I knew very little about Culley, but if he is a solid QB coach that is great news. When I say that, I don't feel like I need to downplay Daboll's role either. I am picturing Josh sitting between them in the film room going over what he is doing well and what he needs to learn from and having two solid QB coaches is better than having just one.

[Buffalo716]

2 minutes ago, WideNine said:

what i originally quoted was that Daboll had spent time as a QB Coach which the Bills need right now - meaning the Bills need quarterback coaching - really had nothing to do with personnel changes, but I can understand the confusion.

 

There is no need to bash Daboll to prop up Culley though. I knew very little about Culley, but if he is a solid QB coach that is great news. When I say that, I don't feel like I need to downplay Daboll's role either. I am picturing Josh sitting between them in the film room going over what he is doing well and what he needs to learn from and having two solid QB coaches is better than having just one.

I was not trying to bash Daboll who is a good coach in his own right.

 

he is a high energy guy with a complicated system that he dumbs down fairly well

 

he uses More personnel groupings than any other OC in the league 

[HOUSE]

Low talent level = low production

 

its not Daboll

[TigerJ]

7 hours ago, LSHMEAB said:

That play was exciting, but I thought it was too cute for the situation.

 

It's one of those that looks genius if it works, so I get it. Just didn't like it there.

If I remember, it was a third down and reasonable play.  I agree, in that situation, I would have prefered a higher percentage pay to gain first down yardage.  Try the wild one on first or second down in that area of the field.  But it still shows some imagination.

[LSHMEAB]

4 minutes ago, TigerJ said:

If I remember, it was a third down and reasonable play.  I agree, in that situation, I would have prefered a higher percentage pay to gain first down yardage.  Try the wild one on first or second down in that area of the field.  But it still shows some imagination.

Yep. 3rd and 3.

 

Do it on 1st or 2nd down and there's zero criticism.

[Thriftygamer83]

Have to ask what is Juan Castillo doing to groom the younger offensive lineman?  This is like Henry Winkler from Waterboy stuff here. 

[reddogblitz]

18 hours ago, HOUSE said:

Low talent level = low production

 

its not Daboll

 

True. However, could be bad talent AND a bad coach. They are not mutually exclusive.

17 hours ago, TigerJ said:

But it still shows some imagination.

 

this play is as old as the hills.  Pretty sure Jimbo ran it.  I remember seeing Danny White score on it in the late 80s. It was run twice in the last SB. Tommy alligator armed his.

 

not sure how imaginative it is.

[ColoradoBills]

I will speculate that Daboll will be back as OC next year with an even greater control over his staff/players/scheming/planning.

I think he is working well with McDermott and the HC will have to give him more room to do things his way OR he will move on.

IMO