Question about the plays where Allen runs for big gains

[Steptide]

I hope I don't come across as ignorant as I don't know every nfl offensive play there is. Something just strikes me with Allen's big runs. I don't see the all 22s and I rarely re watch a game. 

 

So here's what I can't figure out. It seems like Allen gets these huge run plays often times right up the middle of the field. Where are the recievers? Are they turning and blocking down field as soon as allen runs? It seems like the middle of the field is wide open on these plays, and I can't figure why there are no recievers playing the middle of the field. Why hasn't a single reciver run to this wide open space for Allen to make a completion? 

[NextYear'sTheOne]

The wr's are being chased by the db's. If it's man coverage, the db's eyes are on the wr and not the qb. So when he takes off there's green grass as the wr's run the db's out of the play. 

If the wr's went to that green grass, they'd bring the coverage, and it wouldn't be so wide open. 

Now each play call will have a slightly different route combination, which will often times (hopefully) try to exploit the center of the field as it opens up. 

[Alphadawg7]

12 minutes ago, Steptide said:

I hope I don't come across as ignorant as I don't know every nfl offensive play there is. Something just strikes me with Allen's big runs. I don't see the all 22s and I rarely re watch a game. 

 

So here's what I can't figure out. It seems like Allen gets these huge run plays often times right up the middle of the field. Where are the recievers? Are they turning and blocking down field as soon as allen runs? It seems like the middle of the field is wide open on these plays, and I can't figure why there are no recievers playing the middle of the field. Why hasn't a single reciver run to this wide open space for Allen to make a completion? 

 

Well depends on their routes.  Some of them do have someone in the middle just down field more.  One thing to consider is that Daboll may be calling plays designed to open that middle up too where Allen has two outside reads, and if not there, he has the green light to take off up the middle.  Also, defenses are using spies in the middle often too, so puts another defender sitting in their, so they could be calling routes away from the spy too.  

 

The one thing I don’t understand is why aren’t they using the TE’s and RBs underneath more in the middle for short dump offs.  Block and then release short, seems to be opportunity there a lot.  We have RBs who can catch, to not use them in the passing game seems like a missed opportunity.  I get the OL sucks and they are trying to get Allen more time by holding them in to block more, but let them crack a block and release into that same open space.  

 

Honeslty, McCoy should be more used as a receiving back and Ivory more as the lead rusher right now.  That one tweak would IMO help the offense a lot right now.

Edited December 10, 2018 by Alphadawg7

[freddyjj]

1 hour ago, Steptide said:

I hope I don't come across as ignorant as I don't know every nfl offensive play there is. Something just strikes me with Allen's big runs. I don't see the all 22s and I rarely re watch a game. 

 

So here's what I can't figure out. It seems like Allen gets these huge run plays often times right up the middle of the field. Where are the recievers? Are they turning and blocking down field as soon as allen runs? It seems like the middle of the field is wide open on these plays, and I can't figure why there are no recievers playing the middle of the field. Why hasn't a single reciver run to this wide open space for Allen to make a completion? 

In most of the long runs in MIA game, Fins were in man D with Bills in empty set with 5 wide.  WRs are running outs from inside or deep curls outside with someone down the seam.  No crossres or digs where the LBs would be in short zone.  Means the middle of field is wide open for QB to run.  

[reddogblitz]

One thing is for certain. This wide open field in front of him will go away.  Teams will watch "film" and game plan for it and figure out how to stop it.  The strategy will be, make him be a QB.  Then we'll see if he can adapt.

[billspro]

16 minutes ago, reddogblitz said:

One thing is for certain. This wide open field in front of him will go away.  Teams will watch "film" and game plan for it and figure out how to stop it.  The strategy will be, make him be a QB.  Then we'll see if he can adapt.

 

That usually happens when we play the Pats. I’m interested to see how Allen plays that game.

[Bing Bong]

4 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

That usually happens when we play the Pats. I’m interested to see how Allen plays that game.

He usually has a good chance at deking and stiff arming his first tackle lol, it's the tackles from behind that he doesn't see catching up to him.

[SCBills]

It seems like we run a lot of chunk plays, which results in deeper patterns thus opening up the field. 

 

Also remember how tall Allen is, he's not getting swallowed up or having his vision blocked so he can see the entire field at all time.  Combine that with his ability to make guys miss and long stride speed chews up yardage quickly.

[Gugny]

The middle of the field is open because teams respect his ability to throw the ball.  It's why the middle of the field was not similarly open for our starting QB for the past three years.  Allen's not a one-trick pony.

 

Once he has receivers who can actually catch the ***** ball, this offense will be formidable. 

[CincyBillsFan]

4 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

One thing is for certain. This wide open field in front of him will go away.  Teams will watch "film" and game plan for it and figure out how to stop it.  The strategy will be, make him be a QB.  Then we'll see if he can adapt.

 

But there won't be a free ride for the defenses if they try to take away Allen's run game.  Something has to give and while we probably won't see it this year as the Bills just don't have the RB (with Shady out) and TE personnel to exploit a team determined to take away Allen's running game, we should see it next year after we've updated the offense.

 

I agree with you about the NE game.  Belicheck will move heaven & earth to stop Allen from running for 100 yards.  If Allen can still make chunk plays on the ground against NE we might want to start considering that it's not easy to shut this aspect of his game down.  I mean he has done it THREE games in a row which is unusual for a QB in the NFL.  Clearly, no one has figured out how to stop Allen yet on the ground. 

1 hour ago, Gugny said:

The middle of the field is open because teams respect his ability to throw the ball.  It's why the middle of the field was not similarly open for our starting QB for the past three years.  Allen's not a one-trick pony.

 

Once he has receivers who can actually catch the ***** ball, this offense will be formidable. 

 

Bingo!  This is why we've struggled somewhat in the red zone.  Think about it:  Bills ball on their own 40 yard line with a 2nd & 5.  Allen can throw the ball on a rope 35 yards or he can stiff arm a LB and run for 20 yards.  That puts the defense in a bind because they have to cover a lot of field.  Fast forward to the red zone where the field shrinks and the Bills don't have the TE/RB talent to catch a pass in tight spaces for a TD.  Think about Gronk or KC's Kelcey or Komarra or McCaffrey.  It's hard to stop those guys in the red zone.  What do the Bills have beyond Allen running at that point?  And now in the red zone the safeties don't have to worry about anything over 25 yards. 

[ctk232]

5 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

One thing is for certain. This wide open field in front of him will go away.  Teams will watch "film" and game plan for it and figure out how to stop it.  The strategy will be, make him be a QB.  Then we'll see if he can adapt.

Speaking of which, the Jets had a pretty effective counter to the PAP schemes we typically draw up with Allen, and fooled the Jags and Kiko with last week.

 

Would like to see if all-22 covers this, but there was almost always an OLB/safety (usually Adams) up on the left edge of the defense, and would almost read blitz to the ball. As the ball was snapped, the blitzer would start for the QB with eyes on the back for the handoff, but the Jets were almost otherwise committing a whole defender for Allen on the fake handoff to disrupt the PAP timing. Worked well on some key plays in the first and second quarters to stall drives and the passing game, but after our OL continued to disintegrate the pressure started to come from everywhere. Curious to see how much of that was intentional on the Jets part, and how effective it really was in countering those plays.

[Rockinon]

7 hours ago, Steptide said:

I hope I don't come across as ignorant as I don't know every nfl offensive play there is. Something just strikes me with Allen's big runs. I don't see the all 22s and I rarely re watch a game. 

 

So here's what I can't figure out. It seems like Allen gets these huge run plays often times right up the middle of the field. Where are the recievers? Are they turning and blocking down field as soon as allen runs? It seems like the middle of the field is wide open on these plays, and I can't figure why there are no recievers playing the middle of the field. Why hasn't a single reciver run to this wide open space for Allen to make a completion? 

Usually, there is a safety in the middle of the field and usually there is a WR somewhere in the middle with him. Daball is having the WRs run to one side of the field at 3 different levels and drawing the safeties in that direction. There is usually a screen or a quick dump off available for the QB, but in many of these big runs, Allen is the safety valve. All of the defenders are chasing someone downfield. Defenses have tried putting a spy on Allen usually a LB and that guy is just to slow. The only thing that seemed to work was blitzes that kept Allen contained in the pocket but they still had to get there quick. Yea, wide open field for Allen to run to. That is no mistake.

Edited December 10, 2018 by Rockinon

[LABILLBACKER]

He's running for his life. The OL is terrible and there is no pocket. Mix in the wr dropsies and you've got a bad cocktail that will get your qb injured.