THE ROCKPILE REVIEW - “Get Aboard the Josh Allen Train”

[NewEra]

Another great write up Shaw.  Thank you.  

 

The fact that that he wasn’t sacked once is clearly impressive. 

 

His running abiltiy is almost on par with the best ever.  

 

The td to Foster was one of the best I’ve seen a Bills qb make.  To get it off in such tight quarters with that velocity and accuracy, I was stunned,

 

penalties hurt is stats.  His 3rd and long completions really got me fired up.  

 

I love his fire.  The kid gets after it,  I’m worried that his fire might get him injured.

 

While I would still take Baker over him, Allen looks to be the 2nd best qb of the class.  Still a long ways to go, but I’m happy we have the kid,

 

Jerry Hughes is a monster.  An absolute all pro performer this season.  Sucks he won’t get named all pro.  He missed that sack in the 1st qtr but bortles knew he was coming all game and made him play scared.  Kyle played very well too, but Jerry forced Bortles right to him on both sacks iirc.  I really hope he can continue this level of play for 3 more years.  For me, watching him play is the best part of watching a Bills game at the moment.  JEEEEERRRYYYYYYYYY!!

 

Our OL is terrible at run blocking.  It makes me sad.

 

I really pray that we can give Allen some talented playmakers to throw to and a new right side of the OL that doesn’t suck.  

 

Hollywood Brown might be our 1st rd pick.  Will he be able to maintain his health at his size.  Does he have the frame to add 20 LBs?  If he can, sign me up.  I usuellay hate the midgeee WRs, but he seems to be a perfect fit.  Or can Foster become that guy with the proper coaching?

 

 

 

[Albany,n.y.]

Shaw:

Great OP.  

I basically said this yesterday to one poster & I'll expand on it: Anyone who looks at Allen's stat line & questions his play yesterday either didn't see the game or doesn't know what they're watching.  

You clearly know what you're watching.  

 

I've been on the Allen train since the Vikings game when I went out the next day and bought an Allen jersey at my local mall.  I was wearing it yesterday at a sports bar in Berkeley California where even Pats fans were congratulating me after the win.   

 

[billspro]

4 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I didn't see that.   Zay had the most important reception, on the onside kick.  

 

I didn’t see it until they showed the replay on TV. It hit the finger of a dlineman which caused it to wobble. It could still be considered a bad pass. I can live with 2 or 3 bad passes in a game, especially from a rookie QB.

[NewEra]

14 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

Thanks for the writeup!

 

Seriously, I think my draft plan for next year is this:

 

1st round: Best Available WR or OL

2nd round: Rinse and repeat

3rd round: What did I just say?

(You get the picture)

I agree but I’d be shocked if we didn’t draft a CB in the first 3 rds.  Or maybe Wallace can be the #2? Needs to improve his run stopping.  Hard to say how good he is after facing McCown and Bortles in his only starts.  If we can start a very solid CB opposite Tre and outside of Taron, our defense is scary.....if we can figure out how to avoid the gashing up the middle.  Another reason why you shouldn’t expect OL or WR with each of the first 3 picks.  Free agency should fill several holes.  Whichever ones aren’t filled might be able to be filled in the draft.

[billspro]

5 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Another great write up Shaw.  Thank you.  

 

The fact that that he wasn’t sacked once is clearly impressive. 

 

His running abiltiy is almost on par with the best ever.  

 

The td to Foster was one of the best I’ve seen a Bills qb make.  To get it off in such tight quarters with that velocity and accuracy, I was stunned,

 

penalties hurt is stats.  His 3rd and long completions really got me fired up.  

 

I love his fire.  The kid gets after it,  I’m worried that his fire might get him injured.

 

While I would still take Baker over him, Allen looks to be the 2nd best qb of the class.  Still a long ways to go, but I’m happy we have the kid,

 

Jerry Hughes is a monster.  An absolute all pro performer this season.  Sucks he won’t get named all pro.  He missed that sack in the 1st qtr but bortles knew he was coming all game and made him play scared.  Kyle played very well too, but Jerry forced Bortles right to him on both sacks iirc.  I really hope he can continue this level of play for 3 more years.  For me, watching him play is the best part of watching a Bills game at the moment.  JEEEEERRRYYYYYYYYY!!

 

Our OL is terrible at run blocking.  It makes me sad.

 

I really pray that we can give Allen some talented playmakers to throw to and a new right side of the OL that doesn’t suck.  

 

Hollywood Brown might be our 1st rd pick.  Will he be able to maintain his health at his size.  Does he have the frame to add 20 LBs?  If he can, sign me up.  I usuellay hate the midgeee WRs, but he seems to be a perfect fit.  Or can Foster become that guy with the proper coaching?

 

 

 

 

I expect a first and second string WR, a new TE, and 3 new olineman next year. 

 

I like Zay as a number 3, Foster as a number 4, and McKenzie as a number  5. The sixth WR could probably be developed from someone here, or found in FA or later in the draft.

[RyanC883]

The arrival of Foster has really helped.   Glad they found a speed guy.  Looks like he can make some difficult catches also, after having issues earlier.  Add another WR in FA or the draft, and you could have a nice trifecta of Jones, Foster and new guy.   I'd add a few more for depth, but Foster has had 2 big weeks. 

[SoCal Deek]

Excellent assessment Shaw.

I agree that Allen certainly looks the part. Way more than EJ ever did. His ceiling is going to come down to coaching and whether they let him throw the ball, or inadvertently turn him into the second coming of Tyrod. The great NFL QBs are not afraid to throw the ball, even when the receivers look like they are covered.

I also agree on Edmunds. I honestly think that he's playing out of position. He looks and plays like an outside LB.  Once again, I hope that the coaches don't over think this, and let him play where he belongs at this level.

[Jerome007]

Greatest thing of all yesterday, was that the way Allen - and our rookies - played, we got HOPE back. After the losses, man did it suck or what! Who wants to only think of the 2019 season by mid October???? But now that we've settled in, with the cap space money in the next two years, the picks, and most of the current pieces remaining, the future looks VERY promising. Along with Josh's progress, the 2019 and 2020 drafts will determines the Bills next 5-10 years. The team could FINALLY be back to NFL domination. I hope Brady and Bellichik are still there to get pounded. No guarantees but at least real hope is back. Not a just making the playoffs but of getting back to domination mode.

[McBean]

The throw to Robert Foster sealed it for me.

 

He’s our franchise QB for the next decade.

 

Whenever we surround him with more weapons this off season, watch out. 

 

We will be serious contenders starting next season.

[NewEra]

9 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

I expect a first and second string WR, a new TE, and 3 new olineman next year. 

 

I like Zay as a number 3, Foster as a number 4, and McKenzie as a number  5. The sixth WR could probably be developed from someone here, or found in FA or later in the draft.

That would be ideal.  New starting C, RG, RT, WR1, WR2, TE.  I would love to get a stud LT and move Dawkins to RT or guard.  He’s an ok LT, atm imo.  Could become upper tier, emphasis on could.  That’s 6 starters in O.

 

On D, the only spot that needs to be stabilized is CB2.  

 

A stud pass rusher opposite Jerry Hughes would be great, but is a luxury when we have so many holes on O.  

 

The DL got gashed up the middle again.  We may need to replace Kyle due to retirement. Or we may not.  Did any one rewatch the game and see what seemed to be the biggest problem there?  Edmunds, Milano, the DTs?

 

Poyer only has one year left, they could look to add his eventual replacement.  I mean, it’s the Bills, you know we’re going to draft a safety.  Preferably late round.

[billsfan1959]

Good write-up OP. I have liked what I've seen from Allen since preseason in terms of potential. I saw improvement in him in all of the areas I was looking for in yesterday's game. A long way to go; however, he is headed in the right direction. While the NFL has become a passing league and the rules now facilitate better QB play, it is still difficult to come in and have a very high level of success as a rookie. Some do, most don't. There are so many variables that come into play. Probably the three top variables, for me, are supporting talent on OL and skill positions, defensive strength of opponents, and readiness to play at the NFL level.

 

Rosen and Mayfield were probably the most ready to play, followed by Darnold, Allen, and Jackson. Allen and Rosen have the least surrounding offensive talent, followed by Darnold, Jackson, and then Mayfield. Allen has played the most difficult schedule with an avg opponent defensive DVOA ranking of 9, followed by Darnold (13), Rosen (14), Mayfield (20), and Jackson (28). I'm one that thinks this rookie QB class has the potential to eventually produce some very good QBs. I don't know yet which ones will or won't. However, given Allen's "rawness" coming into the league, the lack of surrounding offensive talent, and the strength of opposing defenses he has faced, I am happy with where he stands in relation to the others and the progress I saw yesterday. I am looking forward to seeing what he can do the rest of the year.

[Shaw66]

6 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

 

I also agree on Edmunds. I honestly think that he's playing out of position. He looks and plays like an outside LB.  Once again, I hope that the coaches don't over think this, and let him play where he belongs at this level.

I think he looks like an oversized safety.

 

I really think the plan is to get his playing weight up about 15 pounds - he's so young, that he should be able to carry with no problem.  When that happens, he won't get pushed around so much, and his tackles will be more authoritative.   

3 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

However, given Allen's "rawness" coming into the league, 

Look, I'm not arguing with you, but I think that this label for Allen is bs.   That's what we heard about him all through the draft the process and since.   Allen is "raw."   What does that mean?

 

The reality is that, so far, he's shown that after training camp and preseason, he was more ready to play than all the others except Mayfield.   Mayfield is playing like pro, and Allen is right behind him.  Rosen was supposed to be the most NFL ready, he's throwing to Larry friggin FItzgerald and he's been a pick machine.  Darnold has slumped badly. 

 

The Bills evaluated Allen's football sophistication before the draft and realized that he had much better football smarts than the media coverage suggested.   We're seeing it on the field.   He has had very few rookie moments. 

[yungmack]

Insightful write up. Thanks.

[billsfan1959]

19 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I think he looks like an oversized safety.

 

I really think the plan is to get his playing weight up about 15 pounds - he's so young, that he should be able to carry with no problem.  When that happens, he won't get pushed around so much, and his tackles will be more authoritative.   

Look, I'm not arguing with you, but I think that this label for Allen is bs.   That's what we heard about him all through the draft the process and since.   Allen is "raw."   What does that mean?

 

The reality is that, so far, he's shown that after training camp and preseason, he was more ready to play than all the others except Mayfield.   Mayfield is playing like pro, and Allen is right behind him.  Rosen was supposed to be the most NFL ready, he's throwing to Larry friggin FItzgerald and he's been a pick machine.  Darnold has slumped badly. 

 

The Bills evaluated Allen's football sophistication before the draft and realized that he had much better football smarts than the media coverage suggested.   We're seeing it on the field.   He has had very few rookie moments. 

I am not referring to his ability when I refer to his "rawness," but, rather the fact that he didn't play against the level of competition the others faced, he did not have the opportunity to play with NFL caliber talent around him, and it was a bigger leap for him than the others. Outside of that, I agree that, once I saw him play at the NFL level, I thought he was everybit as capable as the others.

Edited November 26, 2018 by billsfan1959

[JESSEFEFFER]

27 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

I didn’t see it until they showed the replay on TV. It hit the finger of a dlineman which caused it to wobble. It could still be considered a bad pass. I can live with 2 or 3 bad passes in a game, especially from a rookie QB.

I will go look at the replay tonight.  These kind of plays happen way more often than we notice live.  Fitz and EJ had passes like this that we fans as a group ripped them for based mostly on their reputations.  Unless the TV guys notice it, you have to suspect that it may have happened  and then look for the evidence.  The ball is moving at over 80 ft/sec so it's just a blur of a ball before and after the tip with the ball having more wobble than usual and having been slowed down a bit.  All that is enough for a ball to miss its target badly, especially on a crossing route.

[hondo in seattle]

27 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I think he looks like an oversized safety.

 

I really think the plan is to get his playing weight up about 15 pounds - he's so young, that he should be able to carry with no problem.  When that happens, he won't get pushed around so much, and his tackles will be more authoritative.   

Look, I'm not arguing with you, but I think that this label for Allen is bs.   That's what we heard about him all through the draft the process and since.   Allen is "raw."   What does that mean?

 

The reality is that, so far, he's shown that after training camp and preseason, he was more ready to play than all the others except Mayfield.   Mayfield is playing like pro, and Allen is right behind him.  Rosen was supposed to be the most NFL ready, he's throwing to Larry friggin FItzgerald and he's been a pick machine.  Darnold has slumped badly. 

 

The Bills evaluated Allen's football sophistication before the draft and realized that he had much better football smarts than the media coverage suggested.   We're seeing it on the field.   He has had very few rookie moments. 

 

 

I know what you mean - and generally agree - but still feel a need to comment on your last few words.  I think Allen has multiple rookie moments every game.  He doesn't read coverages as effectively or get the ball out as quickly as a good veteran.  He holds onto the ball longer than a good vet because - as a rookie - he needs more time to process.  

[Alphadawg7]

Very good write up on Allen, that was spot on

[Mickey]

Brevity. Embrace it.

[IDBillzFan]

2 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

Back on the field, the Bills stuffed Hyde for a one-yard loss, the Jags took a false start penalty, a touchdown pass was negated by holding, Bortles gained a yard on a near sack and lost 8 on a sack.  Fourth and goal from the 24, the Jags missed the field goal.  Allen to McKenzie, penalty on the Jags, Allen to Foster, penalty on the Jags, Allen up the middle for the touchdown!

 

It was a classic momentum shift – the Jags took control of a close game, came within a video review of scoring a touchdown, then came away with no points and gave up a 68-yard touchdown drive on three plays.  The Bills made plays and the Jags melted down.  There was more football to play, and the Jags certainly didn’t quit, but the Bills had taken over the game. 

 

First, thanks for your excellent write-up.

 

Second, I hope those convinced that the process sucks and that the coaches suck and Allen is mediocre at best will take a moment to reflect on how many times in the past that the series of events above would send a Bills team spiraling. This was the moment, most Bills fans would agree, that the Jags would score, the Bills would stumble, and the game would be lost for lack of focus and composure.

 

These are the moments I look at to see what kind of team is being built by McBeane, and suffice it to say, if you still hate what McBeane is doing after yesterday's game, you may want to look inward for the problem.

 

That is all.

5 minutes ago, Mickey said:

Brevity. Embrace it.

 

Oh, please. It was better than most anything I'm going to read at BN or that other sports website that took all the BN people.

 

You can open the thread, look, close and move on. Give it a try.

Edited November 26, 2018 by LABillzFan

[Shaw66]

43 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

I am not referring to his ability when I refer to his "rawness," but, rather the fact that he didn't play against the level of competition the others faced, he did not have the opportunity to play with NFL caliber talent around him, and it was a bigger leap for him than the others. Outside of that, I agree that, once I saw him play at the NFL level, I thought he was everybit as capable as the others.

Got it.  That makes more sense.  Thanks