Ed Oliver won't be a Buffalo Bill

[Jpsredemption]

17 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

It's called turnovers which is why are losses and wins have been big. 

 

Don't you worry you will be saying McBeane are the greatest soon.

 

 

No I won't.

[JohnC]

7 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

HC sees what everyone else saw.  He has to stand there as this whole charade goes on and Oliver keeps himself fresh for the draft while the rest of the team goes out there and grinds it out. 

 

So he says, in essence....put down the coat.  The coat is for players.

 

This isn't very mysterious.

Stupid rules for small-minded autocrat. Having a rule for coats is moronic. If he had something to say to the player he could have addressed the issue in private in the locker room. As you stated the coats are for players. He is a member of the team who is hurt. How hurt? I can't say for sure and neither can you. 

 

I agree with you this issue isn't very mysterious. An assses is an assse especially when acting in public.

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, JohnC said:

Stupid rules for small-minded autocrat. Having a rule for coats is moronic. If he had something to say to the player he could have addressed the issue in private in the locker room. As you stated the coats are for players. He is a member of the team who is hurt. How hurt? I can't say for sure and neither can you. 

 

I agree with you this issue isn't very mysterious. An assses is an assse especially when acting in public.

 

 

I agree a young HC should have been more discrete than yanking off the coat.  But this meathead's over the top "hold me back! hold me back!!" response tells you what this kid is about.  He showed everyone he's not seriously injured with all of that in your face jumping around, catching passes before the game.  Then he heads to the sidelines to protect his future net worth.  He should just man up and either play with his teammates (almost none of whom will be joining him in the NFL) or he should end the charade and tell the coach he's leaving the team to focus on getting ready for the draft.

[JAMIEBUF12]

I thought the Bills already drafted Kyle Williams replacement this season when the Bills drafted Harrison Phillips out of Stanford? I’d like the Bills to draft that cornerback out of LSU.

[Putin]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

I agree a young HC should have been more discrete than yanking off the coat.  But this meathead's over the top "hold me back! hold me back!!" response tells you what this kid is about.  He showed everyone he's not seriously injured with all of that in your face jumping around, catching passes before the game.  Then he heads to the sidelines to protect his future net worth.  He should just man up and either play with his teammates (almost none of whom will be joining him in the NFL) or he should end the charade and tell the coach he's leaving the team to focus on getting ready for the draft.

Thank you for that !!

Well said ? !!!

[Kmart128]

We seem pretty solid at DT anyway... Sure Kyle is retiring soon but we have 4 good ones right. Now. Could easily plus either of the Philips into a starting position and draft a guy for depth. Our draft picks have to revolve around offense. I mean we have the best defense in league despite all the turnovers and opposing teams getting the ball in good field position from 3 and outs

Edited November 18, 2018 by Kmart128

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

I agree a young HC should have been more discrete than yanking off the coat.  But this meathead's over the top "hold me back! hold me back!!" response tells you what this kid is about.  He showed everyone he's not seriously injured with all of that in your face jumping around, catching passes before the game.  Then he heads to the sidelines to protect his future net worth.  He should just man up and either play with his teammates (almost none of whom will be joining him in the NFL) or he should end the charade and tell the coach he's leaving the team to focus on getting ready for the draft.

You are making the assumption that his knee isn't sore and not completely healed. This is not a made up injury. He was hurt in a game. 

 

Should the player be concerned of his future earning power at the next level?  Unless he is an unmitigated moron of course he should consider it if he is placing his future in the pros in jeopardy. He and the two bit dictator coach certainly know that the player is considered a top of the draft prospect with life altering earning implications. 

 

As I stated in a prior post there is an overriding issue that goes beyond this particular incident. It deals with the issue of ostracizing injured players with rules that are deliberately created to separate injured players from the rest of the team. That purpose is to put pressure on an injured player to return to the active lineup sooner than that player might actually feel is appropriate. This is a pernicious and mean-spirit rule that is fraught with danger, especially with concussion type injuries where only the injured party knows how he actually feels. 

 

My recommendation for this player is to quit the program and get away from this fool coach who is more concerned with his interest at the expense of the player's interest. On that point I can agree with you. 

[Mr. WEO]

34 minutes ago, JohnC said:

You are making the assumption that his knee isn't sore and not completely healed. This is not a made up injury. He was hurt in a game. 

 

Should the player be concerned of his future earning power at the next level?  Unless he is an unmitigated moron of course he should consider it if he is placing his future in the pros in jeopardy. He and the two bit dictator coach certainly know that the player is considered a top of the draft prospect with life altering earning implications. 

 

As I stated in a prior post there is an overriding issue that goes beyond this particular incident. It deals with the issue of ostracizing injured players with rules that are deliberately created to separate injured players from the rest of the team. That purpose is to put pressure on an injured player to return to the active lineup sooner than that player might actually feel is appropriate. This is a pernicious and mean-spirit rule that is fraught with danger, especially with concussion type injuries where only the injured party knows how he actually feels. 

 

My recommendation for this player is to quit the program and get away from this fool coach who is more concerned with his interest at the expense of the player's interest. On that point I can agree with you. 

 

 

Nowhere did I say he was never injured.  That's clearly not the point here.  It's whether he can't play now.  Only he can decide whether he is ok to play.  If he says he's not, there's no team doctor that will say he can.  It's completely subjective exam at this point.

 

Yes, he should quit.  Then he doesn't have to embarrass himself with this nonsense anymore.  He can watch his teammates play hard from his agent's office.

 

I bet if Saban or Sweeney was his coach, he would not have acted like such a fool when they took the coat off him---in fact, I bet he would not have even put it on, knowing he's not supposed to.  He figured the rule doesn't apply to the best player on the team and he doesn't respect his young HC.

 

 

[CircleTheWagons99]

If I read this right, Oliver is “faking” his injury to not ruin his draft status and get hurt in a meaningless game(s).  What happens when his contract is up, the season is lost, or things arnt going right for him?  Will he pull this crap then?  I dont know if its true or not but according to the report and the comments by some here thats how I see it. 

[JohnC]

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Nowhere did I say he was never injured.  That's clearly not the point here.  It's whether he can't play now.  Only he can decide whether he is ok to play.  If he says he's not, there's no team doctor that will say he can.  It's completely subjective exam at this point.

 

Yes, he should quit.  Then he doesn't have to embarrass himself with this nonsense anymore.  He can watch his teammates play hard from his agent's office.

 

I bet if Saban or Sweeney was his coach, he would not have acted like such a fool when they took the coat off him---in fact, I bet he would not have even put it on, knowing he's not supposed to.  He figured the rule doesn't apply to the best player on the team and he doesn't respect his young HC.

 

 

That's the point! The player decides whether he is healthy enough or not to play. You are assuming that he is faking it. I am not. If the exam is subjective then it is subjective. The player makes the determination to play. How else are you going to do it from a medical decision? The player felt that he couldn't play and the fraudulent soldier coach felt otherwise. So he made a public spectacle because he wanted to embarrass the player.

 

I don't care if Saban or Sweeney or Vince Lombardi or Belichick or Parcells or Harbaugh or Urban Meyer had a no coat rule for injured players. It is a stupid and pernicious rule made to ostracize injured players in order to pressure them to return to action. That's wrong!

 

The coach came off looking like a fool because he is a fool. 

Edited November 19, 2018 by JohnC

[Mr. WEO]

38 minutes ago, JohnC said:

That's the point! The player decides whether he is healthy enough or not to play. You are assuming that he is faking it. I am not. If the exam is subjective then it is subjective. The player makes the determination to play. How else are you going to do it from a medical decision? The player felt that he couldn't play and the fraudulent soldier coach felt otherwise. So he made a public spectacle because he wanted to embarrass the player.

 

I don't care if Saban or Sweeney or Vince Lombardi or Belichick or Parcells or Harbaugh or Urban Meyer had a no coat rule for injured players. It is a stupid and pernicious rule made to ostracize injured players in order to pressure them to return to action. That's wrong!

 

The coach came off looking like a fool because he is a fool. 

 

 

It's a simple rule that the player understood and decided to break as he took another day off pretending to still be a team mate to the other guys out there.  The coach had enough of that.  No big deal.. If this kid was a man, he would have left by now, instead of acting like a tool  (go back and watch that video of his off the wall reaction).

 

 

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

It's a simple rule that the player understood and decided to break as he took another day off pretending to still be a team mate to the other guys out there.  The coach had enough of that.  No big deal.. If this kid was a man, he would have left by now, instead of acting like a tool  (go back and watch that video of his off the wall reaction).

 

 

We are not going to agree on this issue. I would recommend to the player to leave the program and protect himself from this stupid coach. Not allowing players to wear jackets or whatever clothing to separate /ostracize them from the active players is a dumb and pernicious rule. 

 

On the one hand you agree that the player should make the final determination as to whether he should play or not. Then when he makes a determination you disagree with you then say he is not being honest with his assessment about his condition to play.  

[Rochesterfan]

On 11/17/2018 at 4:47 AM, Buffalo Barbarian said:

Throws a tantrum at his coach when he has to follow the rules like his teammates.

 

 

Spoiled princesses don't fit the Process

 

 

 

 

Totally disagree with this take. The tantrum and the actions are not the issue why they would not choose Oliver.  They have picked up several guys that have conflicts like that including Phillips just a couple of weeks ago.

 

McDermott is not afraid to teach and coach a player like that - he has stated many times they are looking for passionate players with talent and he falls into that category.

 

What I think would keep him from being high on the Bills board would be if the staff and trainers in talking with the Houston staff and trainers decide his injury should not have kept him out of the line-up, but he was only thinking of himself.  The Bills staff want guys that are passionate and want to play not for themselves, but for their teammates and the love of the game.  They are building a family and team environment and have steadily gotten rid of me first type players (Dareus/Watkins).  

[Rochesterfan]

22 hours ago, JohnC said:

Stupid rules for small-minded autocrat. Having a rule for coats is moronic. If he had something to say to the player he could have addressed the issue in private in the locker room. As you stated the coats are for players. He is a member of the team who is hurt. How hurt? I can't say for sure and neither can you. 

 

I agree with you this issue isn't very mysterious. An assses is an assse especially when acting in public.

 

 

Whether it is a stupid rule or not - it is a rule.  The fact that he and several others wore the jackets, but when told they were not supposed to all of the other players removed them - that tells me the team did try to address it quietly.  

 

Everyone else seemed to be to be ok with it - when the star player did not listen to others - it fell to the head coach to handle it.  The fact that it had to go to the head coach level is part of the issue.  

 

I do not know how many of these special jackets they have - I do not know why they made up the specific rule, but it is a rule and their are reasons beyond what we can see why they make them.  Belichick does not allow big celebrations- he had to talk with Gronk about that and Gronk acknowledged being disciplined for his actions - that seems stupid for the NFL, but that is their rule.

 

We have all kinds of rules in society that have been in place because of reasons that are long outdated and it takes discussion to change these rules - both sides dig in if you have open conflict - even if it seems stupid.  The coach needed to do a better job, but Oliver needed to respect the rules when asked originally to remove it and if he wanted to wear it - have the discussion with the coach.

 

This smacks of other issues on the team with underlying disagreements between the coach and player that a small incident becomes this blown up.

Edited November 19, 2018 by Rochesterfan

[CLTbills]

On 11/17/2018 at 8:16 AM, DCOrange said:

 

That would just lead me to question why they can't afford a few more jackets lol. These programs are making boatloads of money every year and they supply players with all sorts of other types of apparel; seems weird that they'd skimp out on just one item.

I didn't say anything about them being able to afford more. 

 

By the way, I think you answered your own question....

[Rochesterfan]

On 11/17/2018 at 8:16 AM, DCOrange said:

 

That would just lead me to question why they can't afford a few more jackets lol. These programs are making boatloads of money every year and they supply players with all sorts of other types of apparel; seems weird that they'd skimp out on just one item.

 

 

Not sure where this comes from - most NCAA football programs not at the very top (power 5 conference) make almost no money after costs are associated with everything.  There was a nice article from 2017 in the Houston Business Journal about all of the Texas colleges and what their revenue and associated costs were.  Colleges like Houston essentially break even or lose money on football due to the associated costs.  

 

There were like 4 or 5 Texas colleges that were profitable (mostly UT, Texas A&M, TCU, Texas Tech, and Baylor).  

 

The difference between the top programs and these mid level schools is huge. 

 

Additionally being in Houston - how often do they need these jackets.  My guess is less than 1 time a year - so they probably do not have a bunch of the Jackets because they do not need them.

[Kirby Jackson]

13 hours ago, CircleTheWagons99 said:

If I read this right, Oliver is “faking” his injury to not ruin his draft status and get hurt in a meaningless game(s).  What happens when his contract is up, the season is lost, or things arnt going right for him?  Will he pull this crap then?  I dont know if its true or not but according to the report and the comments by some here thats how I see it. 

College players that are surefire first rounders sit out all of the time. Nick Bosa left school earlier this year to prepare for the draft instead of rehabbing his injury to get back. Christian McCaffrey and Leonard Fournette did the exact same thing. That isn’t rare at all.

[DCOrange]

2 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

 

Not sure where this comes from - most NCAA football programs not at the very top (power 5 conference) make almost no money after costs are associated with everything.  There was a nice article from 2017 in the Houston Business Journal about all of the Texas colleges and what their revenue and associated costs were.  Colleges like Houston essentially break even or lose money on football due to the associated costs.  

 

There were like 4 or 5 Texas colleges that were profitable (mostly UT, Texas A&M, TCU, Texas Tech, and Baylor).  

 

The difference between the top programs and these mid level schools is huge. 

 

Additionally being in Houston - how often do they need these jackets.  My guess is less than 1 time a year - so they probably do not have a bunch of the Jackets because they do not need them.

 

I imagine this is probably similar to the NBA, where basically no NBA team outside of the Lakers is "profitable" but if they ever wanted to be, all of them could be. Certainly college programs could scrub their budgets to find a couple more hundred dollars to get a few more jackets.

Edited November 19, 2018 by DCOrange

[Bill from NYC]

12 hours ago, JohnC said:

 

The coach came off looking like a fool because he is a fool. 

Maybe the player isn't so bright either to run, jump, and catch passes before his teammates go out and put themselves at risk.

 

Whether or not you happen to like it, the team has rules that this kid placed himself above.

 

If I had millions waiting for me would I want to play? I can't speculate in all honesty having never been faced with circumstances like these. That doesn't mean that this kid is not a pampered, spoiled twit.

[Mr. WEO]

12 hours ago, JohnC said:

We are not going to agree on this issue. I would recommend to the player to leave the program and protect himself from this stupid coach. Not allowing players to wear jackets or whatever clothing to separate /ostracize them from the active players is a dumb and pernicious rule. 

 

On the one hand you agree that the player should make the final determination as to whether he should play or not. Then when he makes a determination you disagree with you then say he is not being honest with his assessment about his condition to play.  

 

Yes.

 

If an injured player says "Coach, I'm not ready to go on Saturday", no one will say he is ready to go.  But when he then makes sure everyone on the sidelines, in the stands, and on TV sees him frolicking on the filed before the game running around catching passes...it is clear what's going on. 

 

His "stupid coach" is no threat requiring "protection".  His coach is recognizing the disrespect this kid is showing the team by pretending he's not just passing the days until the draft while everyone else is working hard to finish the season and win games.  That's what set the coach off.  Did he have to rip the coat off?  Maybe not.  But he had to show that Oliver's charade is disrespectful.

 

He should be released from the team and he should have his scholarship terminated after this Fall term.    Then he can leave school early and work on his combine numbers.  Everyone wins.

Edited November 19, 2018 by Mr. WEO