7 reasons why Josh Allen could finish his rookie season on a high note

[John from Riverside]

On 11/13/2018 at 9:35 AM, Jauronimo said:

I'm hoping that means he learned something from Belichek and puts an original game plan in place each week which is tailored to the defense he's facing.  Whether or not we have the personnel to execute is another matter.

This is why I dont want deboll fired

 

I dont think we have the horses to run the offense they want to run......and am hoping this is taken care of this offseaon

[Chris66]

23 hours ago, LSHMEAB said:

Before the Jets game, this team was on pace to be one of the worst offenses in the history of the National Football League.

 

Before this season, Daboll was a failed OC in not one, not two, but three stints.

 

Let's maybe not overreact to one game against a bad team.

A team that knows it will have a new coach come January.

 

Jets are in a better position moving forward If they are smart and hire the right person.

[formerlyofCtown]

On 11/13/2018 at 10:03 AM, Soda Popinski said:

If he does start vs the Jags they better treat Ramsey the way they treated Adams last week.  Don't put the ball anywhere near him.  Keep using Benji as a decoy and go to Zay and Foster.    Feed McCoy and get the ball out quick.  But Allen has to get more accurate on the deep ball.  That opening play to Foster took the Jets by surprise and we had them off balance pretty much all game long after that.   We have to do something like that again early vs the Jags. 

Im glad Allen is playing.  Im still hoping he runs over Ramsey.

[BigBuff423]

1 hour ago, ctk232 said:

I hope that is certainly the case for what we have seen pre-Jets, but even with a roster devoid of talent, OC's more than often scheme to simplify the playbook to maximize what skill is present. We also can't think of "complexity" in terms of quantity of lineups - you can achieve complexity in an offense while running very few lineups (i.e. Rams and Chiefs, looking at the chart from the article this seems to hold true). It's an analogous example, but one of the biggest criticisms of Rex's defensive scheme was that it was too complex for the defense and personnel we had, and once he began to simplify his scheme we saw players making plays. While I'm glad to see Daboll isn't lacking offensive knowledge, it's easy to argue that over-complicating an offense to curtail it's mostly young roster with little to no talent is not an effective strategy given the first 9 games of the season.

 

I'm all for changing up the book year to year given the right team, and of course adjustments take time. But the Pats also had a set franchise HOF QB that could handle the constantly changing scheme each year, and lead his players through the offseason changes and over the early season hump. All with the support and guidance of a HOF coach. We had a QB controversy and ultimately a rookie project not intended to start this year, with an offense that never really got to learn the book as a result, and all with an OC in his first year with the team. I think the section of the article referencing Daboll even pointed more to the fact that he should be looking to dial in his offense and start picking which packages/formations/lineups work and fit the talent level of the roster. That being said, I'm of the opinion that you first need to establish continuity and chemistry within a roster before increasing the levels of complexity in the schemes for either offense or defense, and that complexity is not effective as a workaround for a hapless offensive roster - many of whom are young rookies and some undrafted at that. 

 

In reference to the article - I'm not sure I exactly agree with the premise. While the topic at hand was to provide seven reasons why Allen could have a great end to the season, the author's argument, as I've understood it, is that because the environment around Allen has gotten progressively "better" since his injury, he could in turn progress equally so. To me that seems circumstantial correlation at best, and while having a better cast around him can certainly help Allen, there's no tangible argument to determine causality. Might be an unpopular analogy, but it's like saying that Trump might become an actual President given the appropriate advisors around him. While we showed flashes of competency for one week against a division rival with the same record, I've yet to see true progression in an offense where half/most of the roster will not still be on the team in the next year or two.

 

And we won't know for more than a season if the bold portion is accurate. But, we CAN look at three recent examples of Wentz, Goff and Trubisky. They've all had Offensive minded HCs, but they've also had GMs who've gone out and found them much improved Offensive players. O-line to WRs and TEs, and even RBs to a lesser extent, have all been added or augmented to surround the QB with a better cast of characters and the results have been promising. Does that automatically mean Allen will take a huge leap forward like those 3 have thus far? Absolutely not...but I think it adds some credence to the argument that how that new / young QB is complimented really does make quite a bit of difference. Mahomes as well. He's in his first year after having a year to learn, but getting Watkins to pair with Hill, Kelce and Hunt while investing in the Offensive line have all made a difference. 

[Commish]

Not that he knows as much as some of the TBD pundits, but Greg Cosell is on WGR, saying Barkley has a limited skill set, not starter material -  and that the Bills should absolutely start Allen - he needs game time.
.

 

[ctk232]

29 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

 

And we won't know for more than a season if the bold portion is accurate. But, we CAN look at three recent examples of Wentz, Goff and Trubisky. They've all had Offensive minded HCs, but they've also had GMs who've gone out and found them much improved Offensive players. O-line to WRs and TEs, and even RBs to a lesser extent, have all been added or augmented to surround the QB with a better cast of characters and the results have been promising. Does that automatically mean Allen will take a huge leap forward like those 3 have thus far? Absolutely not...but I think it adds some credence to the argument that how that new / young QB is complimented really does make quite a bit of difference. Mahomes as well. He's in his first year after having a year to learn, but getting Watkins to pair with Hill, Kelce and Hunt while investing in the Offensive line have all made a difference. 

I wholly agree with that position in relation to the future beyond the remainder of the season, and it certainly wouldn't hurt Allen to have a more talented roster around him. But the article's correlated arguments point specifically to improvement for these last 7 weeks as a result of an improved offense. I suppose my skepticism lies with the idea that the offense has now progressed, at all, and it's especially difficult to argue that after only one game of improved performance. There was much in that Jets game that makes little sense compared to what we've seen so far, and only leaves more questions - was it just the QB play all year long? Did Daboll change his playbook for the jets game? How did the complexity of the playbook change? Is what we saw Sunday the result of a simplified scheme? How much of it is Daboll potentially just running a very simple book and the offense responded as a whole? If it is the QB, will Allen ever fully understand and fit the scheme in place? And lastly, how much of it was a fluke, if at all?

 

A lot will happen in the offseason that makes the case for a better environment producing better results from Allen, or at least a hopeful one. But in relation to where we are now, I find it difficult to say that our offense has "progressed" at all, especially after only one solid offensive game, and expecting anything more from Allen for the rest of the season in terms of marked performance might be too much to ask for at this point. It's my core issue with the article's premise is that it favors more to the clickbait realm of all but promising we could see a very different Allen these last seven weeks as a result of what? An offense that has supposedly and entirely found itself and it's identity in one week with a journeyman backup who hasn't started in two years finally being cleared to play? 

 

I'm running on a bit here, but as awesome as Sunday's game was to watch, I'm honestly more confused than ever by what the current state of our offense is, and where the problems lie.

[bobblehead]

26 minutes ago, Roch-A-Bill said:

Not that he knows as much as some of the TBD pundits, but Greg Cosell is on WGR, saying Barkley has a limited skill set, not starter material -  and that the Bills should absolutely start Allen - he needs game time.
.

 

Yeah I think you start Allen. Barkley looks to be here long term. He even said he’s here to help in any they need him to do. It looks like Barkley is exactly what the bills were looking for in both AJ and Nate, just way later then was originally hoped.  It’s like the whole plan to have vet presence was knocked back several weeks but now it’s finally on track. 

[Rockinon]

The addition speed to the offense changes a lot. Defenders can no longer key in and know the play before it happens. Stretching the field makes them spread out.  Also, all of those option plays are wreaking havoc.  Those jet sweep plays where a guy sprints across the backfield, freezes the D because they don't know if the QB will hand it off to the jet, delay hand off to a RB or drop back and pass. 

 

Daboll did a phenomenal job against the Jets. Adding 2 speed guys also keeps the defense from crowding the line. This gives Shady some room to do his thing. It's not rocket science and it's not too complex for the players.  It's just putting them in a better position to succeed. I think they just figured a couple of things out and it paid off in a big way last Sunday.

[BigBuff423]

6 minutes ago, ctk232 said:

I wholly agree with that position in relation to the future beyond the remainder of the season, and it certainly wouldn't hurt Allen to have a more talented roster around him. But the article's correlated arguments point specifically to improvement for these last 7 weeks as a result of an improved offense. I suppose my skepticism lies with the idea that the offense has now progressed, at all, and it's especially difficult to argue that after only one game of improved performance. There was much in that Jets game that makes little sense compared to what we've seen so far, and only leaves more questions - was it just the QB play all year long? Did Daboll change his playbook for the jets game? How did the complexity of the playbook change? Is what we saw Sunday the result of a simplified scheme? How much of it is Daboll potentially just running a very simple book and the offense responded as a whole? If it is the QB, will Allen ever fully understand and fit the scheme in place? And lastly, how much of it was a fluke, if at all?

 

A lot will happen in the offseason that makes the case for a better environment producing better results from Allen, or at least a hopeful one. But in relation to where we are now, I find it difficult to say that our offense has "progressed" at all, especially after only one solid offensive game, and expecting anything more from Allen for the rest of the season in terms of marked performance might be too much to ask for at this point. It's my core issue with the article's premise is that it favors more to the clickbait realm of all but promising we could see a very different Allen these last seven weeks as a result of what? An offense that has supposedly and entirely found itself and it's identity in one week with a journeyman backup who hasn't started in two years finally being cleared to play? 

 

I'm running on a bit here, but as awesome as Sunday's game was to watch, I'm honestly more confused than ever by what the current state of our offense is, and where the problems lie.

 

Fair enough and all valid questions / concerns related to the Offense and the prognosis for the remaining schedule in 2018. 

[Luka]

Barkley entered the Jets game with the second worst career interception ratio. Only behind Peterman. It was a great win but Allen starts. I'm sure having Daboll on the sidelines now and two actual QBs in the room during the week has helped him a lot. Gotta give him a chance to go out there and show it. If he completely falters you might see Barkley again but as it stands this year is building towards the next. Barkley is not the future. 

 

I thought you guys wanted to draft a QB? I guess you also expected him to be the best QB in the league as soon as he stepped on the field.