John Kryk: Bills' Defense First Model is Backward in Today's NFL

[RochesterRob]

1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

The Carolina connection was there with Norwell just as it was for the $50M Star they signed at DT.   I

  A connection does not mean you want to reunite.  Weather, attractions in terms of arts and entertainment are among reasons somebody might bypass Buffalo.  Maybe Beane did not see a good fit in terms of skills to scheme.  Maybe Beane had a number in mind and Norwell got more than what Beane wanted to pay.  Star obviously was a fit in Beane's mind in terms of role versus salary.  I'm hating auto-correct in terms of anytime I have to mention Beane.  Not Beans, Berne's. LOL.

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, RochesterRob said:

  A connection does not mean you want to reunite.  Weather, attractions in terms of arts and entertainment are among reasons somebody might bypass Buffalo.  Maybe Beane did not see a good fit in terms of skills to scheme.  Maybe Beane had a number in mind and Norwell got more than what Beane wanted to pay.  Star obviously was a fit in Beane's mind in terms of role versus salary.  I'm hating auto-correct in terms of anytime I have to mention Beane.  Not Beans, Berne's. LOL.

 

All of this is exactly what is called into question by Kryk's article.  They made their priorities well known by signing Star and Trent Murphy in UFA and using three of the first four draft picks on defensive players. 

[John from Riverside]

I think there needs to be balance.....but I understand why a defense coach would biuld his defense first

 

To me it its about whether you think the rebiuld is done and this is the offense he wants to put on the field.....I believe we are in the middle of it and this is NOT the final look offense.

[PeterDude]

Totally correct. The Mahomes blunder will haunt this team for decades, it it will follow McClappity wherever he goes.

 

He ruined his NFL coaching career with his first ever draft move.

[RochesterRob]

4 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

All of this is exactly what is called into question by Kryk's article.  They made their priorities well known by signing Star and Trent Murphy in UFA and using three of the first four draft picks on defensive players. 

  I don't see Kryk's article as an indictment.  It seems to me that Tremaine Edmunds as well as filling a need had a grade higher than nearly every offensive player when the Bills picked him.  Cutting to the chase who is to say that Beane is wrong and everybody else is right at this point.  It's going to take nearly a year from now barring injuries and suspensions to know if this plan was the right one for Buffalo.  Further, any one of us here would love to get a chance to show our plan was valid if we were in the business world versus being cut to shreds in the meeting world because we were bypassing the convention of the industry before said plan had been in place any amount of time.  

3 minutes ago, PeterDude said:

Totally correct. The Mahomes blunder will haunt this team for decades, it it will follow McClappity wherever he goes.

 

He ruined his NFL coaching career with his first ever draft move.

  Mahomes is on fire because he is under the tutelage of Reid and they are running a Reid oriented offense.  We don't have Reid here and I recall few clammering for Reid when he was there to be had.  Most of the talk was he was the Schottenheimer of his time in that great regular season record but does nothing in the playoffs.  Most Eagles fans were happy to see him go and would say "what has he really accomplished" to this point?  But keep riding Mahomes' jock strap if it makes you happy.

[Watkins90]

1 hour ago, jrober38 said:

 

To see where the NFL is going people should watch the Saints-Rams game from Sunday afternoon.

 

Those teams are playing a different sport than the Bills. 

 

They value possessions, and try to score every time they get the football. 

 

Our coach has nothing in common philosophically with Sean Payton or Sean McVay, and that's a major problem in my eyes. 

1

You don't think McDermott wants to score on every possession?

[26CornerBlitz]

9 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  I don't see Kryk's article as an indictment.  It seems to me that Tremaine Edmunds as well as filling a need had a grade higher than nearly every offensive player when the Bills picked him.  Cutting to the chase who is to say that Beane is wrong and everybody else is right at this point.  It's going to take nearly a year from now barring injuries and suspensions to know if this plan was the right one for Buffalo.  Further, any one of us here would love to get a chance to show our plan was valid if we were in the business world versus being cut to shreds in the meeting world because we were bypassing the convention of the industry before said plan had been in place any amount of time.  

  Mahomes is on fire because he is under the tutelage of Reid and they are running a Reid oriented offense.  We don't have Reid here and I recall few clammering for Reid when he was there to be had.  Most of the talk was he was the Schottenheimer of his time in that great regular season record but does nothing in the playoffs.  Most Eagles fans were happy to see him go and would say "what has he really accomplished" to this point?  But keep riding Mahomes' jock strap if it makes you happy.

 

Bottom line. Offense wins in the modern day NFL.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

1 hour ago, jrober38 said:

Sean McDermott has nothing in common philosophically with any of the top coaches in the NFL.

 

He's conservative, and believes in running the ball, playing defense, establishing the line of scrimmage and playing field position.

 

He constantly ignores basic probabilities by always punting on 4th and short when we're in opposition territory.

 

In a league that's becoming more and more innovative and aggressive on the offensive side of the ball, our coach is holding on to the way things used to be 10 years ago, and accordingly isn't cut out to be an NFL HC right now. 

Today on WGR Jeremy White (who was feeling bad for his rant a day earlier) was trying to spin McDermott's comments with Mike Schopp as a positive. McDermott said that the Quarterback has to consistently play at a high level in order to win. Jeremy was trying to present this as the light going off in McDermott's head.

 

I thought the complete opposite. McDermott only relents on the QB/Passing is important statements when he is directed by others on that logic path. It was Schopp who brought up the QB position. When left to explain the offense's problems on his own, McDermott goes right into: respect the ball, penalties, run the football to establish the line of scrimmage, protect the QB, and about as dangerous as he gets is "play action". Nothing in McDermott or Beane's personnel moves shows they value fast, down the field, vertical playmakers. 

 

I think at his core, McDermott wants a game that is always in front of him. Get a field goal, and play defense, always staying ahead of the sticks on 1st and 2nd down. Punt and pin them deep, winning with defense. There is a reason they signed a Fullback, Mike Tolbert and Chris Ivory. He believes in a physical run game. 

 

Shaw pointed this out in his writeup - the Bills are still throwing the classic fade route in the endzone. This was a route that became popular during Calvin Johnson's run, but has long since been defended. Same thing with Wildcat. The Bills use this as an "exotic" formation. This is them really throwing a curveball. Sean McDermott and Brian Daboll are not innovators. Picture them in a room trying to scheme up offense. McDermott talks about falling asleep trying to think of new ways to innovate ways to break the offense open. We haven't seen that. We don't run bubble screens, or slants, or drags, or crosses. We don't move McCoy to the slot. We still are running out of the Shotgun and losing 2, 3 yards every single time. Trying to "get McCoy established" by sweeping to the edges with subpar OTs that can't move. 

 

And root is always the same here. We don't have a Quarterback. We don't have a guy who sees it. We have the same QBs who run the play that is called, throw the ball where the Coaches say the read should go. Don't audible, just run the play that is called. 

[RochesterRob]

2 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Bottom line. Offense wins in the modern day NFL.

  Since the name of the game is out score the other guy that much is obvious.  But you can win by keeping the other guy from scoring more points than you.  By your opinion Pittsburgh should have beat Jacksonville in last year's playoffs as they clearly had more offensive weapons.  The Eagles won the SB because they departed from conventional wisdom on a few plays confusing Belichick versus being a pure offensive machine.

[Mr. WEO]

52 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  That would improve if our offense was out there on sustained drives keeping the other team's offense on the bench longer.

 

 

The Bills D was on the field for 26 minutes and gave up 27 points.  That was hardly the Rams/Saints/Chiefs they were facing. 

 

The safeties are becoming a liability.  Poyer is the softest tackler in the NFL.  He is frequently getting stiff armed to the ground or just blown up.

[26CornerBlitz]

6 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  Since the name of the game is out score the other guy that much is obvious.  But you can win by keeping the other guy from scoring more points than you.  By your opinion Pittsburgh should have beat Jacksonville in last year's playoffs as they clearly had more offensive weapons.  The Eagles won the SB because they departed from conventional wisdom on a few plays confusing Belichick versus being a pure offensive machine.

 

  Outscoring the opponents does not mean making offense a priority over defense in player acquisition and overall philosophy.  Jacskonville had to outscore Pittsburgh in a shootout to make it to the AFC Championship and look at their vaunted defense this year. Their so called elite defense has been torched this season.  Defense 1st is not a sustainable model.

Edited November 6, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[RochesterRob]

3 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

The Bills D was on the field for 26 minutes and gave up 27 points.  That was hardly the Rams/Saints/Chiefs they were facing. 

 

The safeties are becoming a liability.  Poyer is the softest tackler in the NFL.  He is frequently getting stiff armed to the ground or just blown up.

  The ranking you are mentioning is based on the results of all nine games played versus one game.  Are you denying that less three and outs by our offense would help our defense?  More sustained drives even if they had to punt after 6 plays should give the opponent less favorable starting field position which would affect their scoring.

[jrober38]

14 minutes ago, Watkins90 said:

You don't think McDermott wants to score on every possession?

 

Let me rephrase. 

 

I think they intend to score points, but as soon as something detrimental happens to a drive, like a penalty, or loss of yards on 1st or 2nd down that puts them behind the chains, that he immediately starts playing defense with his offense. 

 

It's like we no longer try to keep the chains moving, and revert to trying to limit the damage our offense could do by figuring out how to conservatively try to come close to getting a first down by not putting the ball in danger and being totally fine with punting and playing field position.

 

When the Bills get into 3rd and long they almost always throw short of the sticks. Just avoid the sack, check it down, and hope your receiver can break a couple tackles and convert the 1st down. We never put the ball in danger by forcing it down the field into coverage in a spot where a catch will move the chains. 

 

It's the same type of offense we saw from Dick Jauron when he had Trent Edwards. Play super conservative, and take the check down whenever possible. Play field position and let your defense try to force a turnover to give your offense a short field.

 

We saw the same thing from this offense even when Allen was on the field. His YPA is pathetic, and most of his throws a dink and dunk check downs. Despite having a howitzer for an arm, we haven't thrown the ball down the field at all this season and I think that's a product of how the coach over values protecting the football. 

[RochesterRob]

4 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

  Outscoring the opponents does not mean making offense a priority over defense in player acquisition and overall philosophy.  Jacskonville had to outscore Pittsburgh in a shootout to make it to the AFC Championship and look at their vaunted defense this year. Their so called elite defense has been torched this season.  Defense 1st is not a sustainable model.

  Your ignoring the point which is on paper Pittsburgh had done far more in acquiring offensive talent than Jacksonville prior to that game.  Shootout or otherwise.  As far as Jacksonville's defense a lot of last season's ranking was the AFC South laying in ashes with Watson and Luck out most of that season.  It would have been statistically worse if those two among others were available.

[dorquemada]

2 hours ago, jrober38 said:

Sean McDermott has nothing in common philosophically with any of the top coaches in the NFL.

 

He's conservative, and believes in running the ball, playing defense, establishing the line of scrimmage and playing field position.

 

He constantly ignores basic probabilities by always punting on 4th and short when we're in opposition territory.

 

In a league that's becoming more and more innovative and aggressive on the offensive side of the ball, our coach is holding on to the way things used to be 10 years ago, and accordingly isn't cut out to be an NFL HC right now. 

 

agreed!  also, i am just generally sick and tired of the Bills having a terrible O.  When is the last time the Bills O struck fear into anyone?  What, Bledsoe's first 5 games?  Kids born that year are getting their drivers licenses this year.  Why can't the Bills field a competent O?

 

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, RochesterRob said:

  Your ignoring the point which is on paper Pittsburgh had done far more in acquiring offensive talent than Jacksonville prior to that game.  Shootout or otherwise.  As far as Jacksonville's defense a lot of last season's ranking was the AFC South laying in ashes with Watson and Luck out most of that season.  It would have been statistically worse if those two among others were available.

 

Anything can happen in a game between two opponents see Bills vs. Vikings in week 3.  That does not refute the point. 

[Greybeard]

32 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

 

  Mahomes is on fire because he is under the tutelage of Reid and they are running a Reid oriented offense.  We don't have Reid here and I recall few clammering for Reid when he was there to be had.  Most of the talk was he was the Schottenheimer of his time in that great regular season record but does nothing in the playoffs.  Most Eagles fans were happy to see him go and would say "what has he really accomplished" to this point?  But keep riding Mahomes' jock strap if it makes you happy.

            Good post.  If Mahomes was drafted here,  the odds of Mahomes having any where near the success he is having with the Chiefs, is very slim.  Very few seem to be able to comprehend that.    The search for a savior is how we ended up with Allen, and we are a long way from finding out how that will work out.

[Soda Popinski]

Jacksonville's defense started to flounder when Marrone doubled down on Bortles and himself.   They made no play to upgrade the QB position when it's what they were lacking.  

[26CornerBlitz]

2 minutes ago, Greybeard said:

            Good post.  If Mahomes was drafted here,  the odds of Mahomes having any where near the success he is having with the Chiefs, is very slim.  Very few seem to be able to comprehend that.    The search for a savior is how we ended up with Allen, and we are a long way from finding out how that will work out.

 

That's a tired old excuse to not get with the modern NFL. 

 

2 minutes ago, Soda Popinski said:

Jacksonville's defense started to flounder when Marrone doubled down on Bortles and himself.   They made no play to upgrade the QB position when it's what they were lacking.  

 

People act as if the days of the Steel Curtain or the 2000 Ravens D are still possible.

Edited November 6, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[blitzboy54]

2 hours ago, BigBuff423 said:

I completely disagree. Mainly because you can't take a generalized approach and apply it in blanket terms. The Defense was on the uptick and is the specialty of McD and so you build on your strengths. He didn't get the Offensive Coordinator he wanted - who ironically has now been fired mid-season in his second year - and then waited for his GM to help construct the Offense. The first order of business was to get rid of guys who didn't hold a team first mentality and the second was to clear dead Cap to allow for 2019 full on rebuild.

 

Moreover, Mahomes or Watson in this Offense would NOT be having the same success they've found with their respective teams....for so many reasons. Additionally, taking Defense now helps to cradle a young and developing Offense because they don't feel the pressure to have to do it all right. The blow outs this year have been far more on the Offense, just like this past Sunday, 14 points came directly on TOs and another came with a poor TO in Buffalo's own end. The Defense did a decent job, not great against the Run but pretty darn good against the pass so meh job...but in other weeks they've been outstanding. 

 

Point being, building on the strength of the coach, while allowing a new GM to define the Offense and taking a year to get financially healthy so you CAN build your Offense takes time and patience, but it doesn't mean it's wrong. It just means we all need to see the vision for the future and not focus on the present, which we knew this year wasn't about. 

Ha!

 

On pace as the WORST offense in NFL history but you disagree.  

 

Great is great. Mahomes may not have put up video game numbers but he is still great. No way you can justify passing on him.  Almost every prognosticator on the planet said to stay away from Allen but we traded up for him. No part of this article is wrong. Complete train wreck.

 

Every offensive player we shipped out is having a carrier year outside of Taylor. But you disagree.  

 

 

 

Edited November 6, 2018 by blitzboy54