Josh Rosen leads dramatic comeback win. Did we take the wrong Josh?

[LSHMEAB]

10 minutes ago, ctk232 said:

Just think about Bucs fans yesterday watching their first overall pick throw four INTs (quite Peterman-esque performance), and have Fitzy come in and continue the Fitzmagic Curse. There's a time and place for this, but it's too soon and not here. There's being critical of Allen, but the "should we have," "had we had drafted him," and "what would've been" conversations don't do much to help anyone out here looking to make it to retirement before having a coronary.

The fact remains that a huge percentage of Bills fans never wanted the Bills to draft Josh Allen because of the red flags.

 

His lack of production despite incredible talent made him one of the most polarizing QB prospects to enter the league in a long time.

 

Some people, myself included, are just waiting out his time here because we're convinced he cannot play the position. Are we supposed to not share our opinion? I'm more than willing to give Allen credit when it's due, but this 2-3 year nonsense is obnoxious.

[Bing Bong]

14 hours ago, QB Bills said:

Nobody knows definitively. But the homers here who couldn't pass a second grade spelling test and who will defend anything this joke of a franchise does will tell you no and that we drafted the greatest qb is the history of histories. 

Were we like this with EJ? We seemed to turn pretty quickly on that dude. By year 2 I believe, but I'm hearing an even longer timeline.

[LSHMEAB]

5 minutes ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said:

Were we like this with EJ? We seemed to turn pretty quickly on that dude. By year 2 I believe, but I'm hearing an even longer timeline.

"We" were definitely not patient with EJ.

 

The difference is pretty stark.

[Buddy Hix]

I didn’t see this comeback against SF, not did I see Rosen’s implosion against the Broncos. Does either mean much in year 1, not really. It’s just too bad Allen is injured again and we don’t get to see him play/learn.

 

I wanted Rosen, thought and still think Allen will bust, but we just won’t know for another year, minimum.

[ctk232]

18 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

The fact remains that a huge percentage of Bills fans never wanted the Bills to draft Josh Allen because of the red flags.

 

His lack of production despite incredible talent made him one of the most polarizing QB prospects to enter the league in a long time.

 

Some people, myself included, are just waiting out his time here because we're convinced he cannot play the position. Are we supposed to not share our opinion? I'm more than willing to give Allen credit when it's due, but this 2-3 year nonsense is obnoxious.

By no means am I intending to limit expression of critical and constructive opinion, but starting a thread asking the question did we draft the wrong Josh when it's been discussed and asked in numerous threads ad nauseam seems a bit superfluous to me is all. If there was something added like, "let's compare the tangibles of Allen and Rosen and why each office thought they might be the better fit" (also already discussed), or actual analysis of other QB play. Not just "Oh woe is us we drafted the wrong guy because Rosen led a game winning comeback." 

 

Fwiw, I also think that providing final judgment on Allen based upon his performance thus far is a bit nonsensical and obnoxious. There's a difference between being critical of his current play, and declaring that his future as our franchise is over and not going to happen. I get the red flag argument, I do, but fact is there isn't enough efficacious data there to make a decision one way or the other yet. It also, for the benefit of mental health and sanity, prolongs any potential negative outcomes. 

Edited October 29, 2018 by ctk232

[PetermansRedemption]

1 minute ago, ctk232 said:

By no means am I intending to limit expression of critical and constructive opinion, but starting a thread asking the question did we draft the wrong Josh when it's been discussed and asked in numerous threads ad nauseam seems a bit superfluous to me is all. If there was something added like, "let's compare the tangibles of Allen and Rosen and why each office thought they might be the better fit" (also already discussed), or actual analysis of other QB play. Not just "Oh woe is us we drafted the wrong guy because Rosen led a game winning comeback." 

 

Fwiw, I also think that providing final judgment on Allen based upon his performance thus far is a bit nonsensical and obnoxious. There's a difference between being critical of his current play, and declaring that his future as our franchise is over and not going to happen. I get the red flag argument, I do, but fact is there isn't enough efficacious data there to make a decision one way or the other yet. It also, for the benefit of mental health and sanity, prolongs any potential negative outcomes. 

BINGO! This guy gets it. 

[Buddy Hix]

17 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

The fact remains that a huge percentage of Bills fans never wanted the Bills to draft Josh Allen because of the red flags.

 

His lack of production despite incredible talent made him one of the most polarizing QB prospects to enter the league in a long time.

 

Some people, myself included, are just waiting out his time here because we're convinced he cannot play the position. Are we supposed to not share our opinion? I'm more than willing to give Allen credit when it's due, but this 2-3 year nonsense is obnoxious.

I don’t think 2 years of waiting is obnoxious, it’s kind of mandatory and the minimum amount of time required to see what we have.

 

Dont get me wrong, I am in a prove me wrong position too with Allen, fully expecting him and McBeane to be gone by 2020, but this has to run its course.

[LSHMEAB]

9 minutes ago, ctk232 said:

By no means am I intending to limit expression of critical and constructive opinion, but starting a thread asking the question did we draft the wrong Josh when it's been discussed and asked in numerous threads ad nauseam seems a bit superfluous to me is all. If there was something added like, "let's compare the tangibles of Allen and Rosen and why each office thought they might be the better fit" (also already discussed), or actual analysis of other QB play. Not just "Oh woe is us we drafted the wrong guy because Rosen led a game winning comeback." 

 

Fwiw, I also think that providing final judgment on Allen based upon his performance thus far is a bit nonsensical and obnoxious. There's a difference between being critical of his current play, and declaring that his future as our franchise is over and not going to happen. I get the red flag argument, I do, but fact is there isn't enough efficacious data there to make a decision one way or the other yet. It also, for the benefit of mental health and sanity, prolongs any potential negative outcomes. 

Yeah, the hot take threads are just the result of an open message board. I tend to laugh them off because I'm really just here to kill time and talk Bills football. It's not all that serious.

 

I take your point, however. 

 

9 minutes ago, Buddy Hix said:

I don’t think 2 years of waiting is obnoxious, it’s kind of mandatory and the minimum amount of time required to see what we have.

 

Dont get me wrong, I am in a prove me wrong position too with Allen, fully expecting him and McBeane to be gone by 2020, but this has to run its course.

I get it.

[Lurker]

Trolls R Us...

[Mojo44]

37 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

The fact remains that a huge percentage of Bills fans never wanted the Bills to draft Josh Allen because of the red flags.

 

His lack of production despite incredible talent made him one of the most polarizing QB prospects to enter the league in a long time.

 

Some people, myself included, are just waiting out his time here because we're convinced he cannot play the position. Are we supposed to not share our opinion? I'm more than willing to give Allen credit when it's due, but this 2-3 year nonsense is obnoxious.

Can you find all of us some actuarial data, you know, empirical research that is not debatable, that a “huge” amount of bills fans didn’t want Josh Allen?  You find it and post it and I might agree with that shoot from the hip assertion. At this point it’s only wishful thinking on your part because you didn’t want him drafted. My own anecdotal evidence regarding this issue is that the majority of bills fans, even on this board, are quite pleased with his acquisition.

[LSHMEAB]

Just now, Mojo44 said:

Can you find all of us some actuarial data, you know, empirical research that is not debatable, that a “huge” amount of bills fans didn’t want Josh Allen?  You find it and post it and I might agree with that shoot from the hip assertion. At this point it’s only wishful thinking on your part because you didn’t want him drafted. My own anecdotal evidence regarding this issue is that the majority of bills fans, even on this board, are quite pleased with his acquisition.

I have no empirical data. I don't think reliable polling exists regarding the collective opinion of Josh Allen among Bills fans pre-draft.

 

As far as wishful thinking goes, I have no idea what you're talking about. It makes no difference to me whether other Bills fans wanted him or not. I'm not of the opinion that message board consensus will lead to dramatic changes at OBD. I sure as hell hope my opinion doesn't sway Brandon Beane!

[Mojo44]

7 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

I have no empirical data. I don't think reliable polling exists regarding the collective opinion of Josh Allen among Bills fans pre-draft.

 

As far as wishful thinking goes, I have no idea what you're talking about. It makes no difference to me whether other Bills fans wanted him or not. I'm not of the opinion that message board consensus will lead to dramatic changes at OBD. I sure as hell hope my opinion doesn't sway Brandon Beane!

 First in foremost, you did admit  you made a statement that you cannot back up. I thank you for that. 

 

 You seem to be one of the minority on this board that think Josh Allen is a bust. For everyone on the board who says that at this point in time here is my take: 

 

 It is absolutely 100% impossible to make that judgment. Alan may turn out to be the best of all the quarterbacks drafted this year. Or he may not. It simply cannot be determined at this time. That is a fact, it is not debatable. Consequently, people who are already pronouncing him a bust have no credibility with me for this simple reason: 

 

 Anyone who professes to no the unknowable is suspect with me regardless of the topic. 

 

Now if I miss judged you in the sense that you don’t necessarily think at this point in time that Alan is a bust, I apologize. Your posts make you come across that way. And, for some advice to take or leave as you see fit, I wouldn’t make such assertions in terms of what the entire board or the Buffalo Bills fandom seem to think when you can’t back it up. That’s just my scientific training in me coming out regarding these kinds of issues.

 

[Captain Murica]

14 hours ago, Scorp83 said:

I would say Yes!

 

But it's over & done with...& we have to live with the stupidity of this front office! Who chooses "high Character" over talent. Who believes in the wrong QB... so why should I believe they've picked the right one?

They don't have a plan...& nobody believes in their process anymore

?

?

Why cause your used to everyone being naive? The Bill's goofed it up...plain & simple bud. Our HC has issues...the front office doesn't have a good enough plan... & the plan/process in question...looks really bad

Nope, just used to everyone continuing to repeat the same process of posting content that has been already established, and then being up in arms when multiple posters tell them to get over it because what is done, is done. The bills took Allen over Rosen. So, contininuing to cry about it won’t change it. Doing the same thing over and over but expecting a different result is insanity. 

[PrimeTime101]

15 hours ago, NoSaint said:

 

You must not be a fan of our coach and/or gm then, eh?

what in gods name does that statement have to do with anything he said.. get real.. stick to the facts

[4thandGoal]

16 hours ago, KOKO NFL said:

 

Josh Rosen, the 'other' Josh, led a dramatic Arizona comeback today to pull out a win 18-15 against SF. (I watched the 4th Quarter because I am in a football pool and the game mattered). Down 15-3 in the 4th Quarter, JR was accurate and stayed poised, under duress, in the pocket. Dare I say, unlike the Bills' strong-armed, mobile, yet skiddish and inaccurate rookie, Josh Allen. 

 

Did the Bills take the wrong Josh? From the evidence I've seen to date... regrettably, yes.

are you on crack--- time will tell if we took the wrong josh---- dont let this win fool you cuz he is not the answer!!! and by the way-- DO ALL OUR RECEIVERS SKILLS COMBINED EVEB COME CLOSE TO LARRY FITZGERALD,,,,   

 

morda w kubeł 

[LSHMEAB]

14 minutes ago, Mojo44 said:

 First in foremost, you did admit  you made a statement that you cannot back up. I thank you for that. 

 

 You seem to be one of the minority on this board that think Josh Allen is a bust. For everyone on the board who says that at this point in time here is my take: 

 

 It is absolutely 100% impossible to make that judgment. Alan may turn out to be the best of all the quarterbacks drafted this year. Or he may not. It simply cannot be determined at this time. That is a fact, it is not debatable. Consequently, people who are already pronouncing him a bust have no credibility with me for this simple reason: 

 

 Anyone who professes to no the unknowable is suspect with me regardless of the topic. 

 

Now if I miss judged you in the sense that you don’t necessarily think at this point in time that Alan is a bust, I apologize. Your posts make you come across that way. And, for some advice to take or leave as you see fit, I wouldn’t make such assertions in terms of what the entire board or the Buffalo Bills fandom seem to think when you can’t back it up. That’s just my scientific training in me coming out regarding these kinds of issues.

 

I was upset when we took Allen because I do believe he's going to be a bust. Nothing he's done on the field confirms or refutes that, although he hasn't played well.

 

What does concern me is the number of kool aid drinkers who cast aspersions on anyone who doubts Allen as non fans who'd rather have their opinion validated than to see Allen succeed. Opinions fly around like mosquitoes. Unless they belong to the decision makers, they're meaningless. Nothing would please me more (Bills wise) than for my opinion to be proven 100% wrong.

[ctk232]

1 hour ago, LSHMEAB said:

Yeah, the hot take threads are just the result of an open message board. I tend to laugh them off because I'm really just here to kill time and talk Bills football. It's not all that serious.

 

I take your point, however. 

Don't get me wrong - I'm all for being critical of Allen - there is certainly plenty to be critical of. But in regards to the future of the franchise, if nothing else the Browns are making me feel better about us. Although I'm sure many on here wouldn't mind seeing the same dismissals from the Bills FO...

Edited October 29, 2018 by ctk232

[Doc]

3 hours ago, Chicken Boo said:

So you're confident, in that exact scenario, that Allen would be accurate enough to make those throws?

 

Come on, man.  Give credit where it's due. 

 

Rosen was 23/40 (57.5%) in the game.  How accurate do you consider that to be?

[Chimp]

15 hours ago, Scorp83 said:

I would say Yes!

 

But it's over & done with...& we have to live with the stupidity of this front office! Who chooses "high Character" over talent. Who believes in the wrong QB... so why should I believe they've picked the right one?

They don't have a plan...& nobody believes in their process anymore

?

?

Why cause your used to everyone being naive? The Bill's goofed it up...plain & simple bud. Our HC has issues...the front office doesn't have a good enough plan... & the plan/process in question...looks really bad

And your credentials for being the be-all end-all decision maker are what? 

[Chicken Boo]

41 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Rosen was 23/40 (57.5%) in the game.  How accurate do you consider that to be?

 

I am talking, specifically, about Rosen's last drive.  For all the marbles, when it counted the most.

 

We can debate other QBs overall accuracy all day, but WE KNOW Josh Allen isn't accurate.  When has he ever been?