Which teams have the winning culture, Coach McDermott should be emulating?

[PlayoffsPlease]

Coach McDermott has said his emphasis is on building a winning culture.  Some fans have mocked this. Other fans have defended the teams current level performance as being a necessary step on the road to building the winning culture. 

 

It seems as though people struggle to define what comprises this culture.  I am not asking that question in this thread.  I am simple trying to have a discussion about which teams have the winning culture the Bills should try to emulate.   Thank you for your feedback. 

[Doc Brown]

Patriots

[The Process]

Steelers

Alabama

[26CornerBlitz]

Get more talented players and the culture will be just fine. 

[oldmanfan]

Patriots and Steelers.

[Mrbojanglezs]

How do you plan to emulate the Patriots and Steelers winning cultures when you are getting blown out by 20 or 30 points every week?

[PlayoffsPlease]

Just now, Mrbojanglezs said:

How do you plan to emulate the Patriots and Steelers winning cultures when you are getting blown out by 20 or 30 points every week?

The Steelers as an organization have had success across three head coaches, Noll, Cowher and Tomlin.    But it should be noted that prior to Bradshaw's arrival, the Steelers were bottom dwellers in the league for many years.   And that in between the Bradshaw era and the Rothlisberger eras, the Steelers struggled quite a bit.  

With only the two data points of the Steelers and the Patriots, it seems as though winning culture would be defined by having superior coaching and superior QB play.  It seems like without both, there may not be some concept of "culture" that can substitute and lead to winning.  

[Jasovon]

2 minutes ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

The Steelers as an organization have had success across three head coaches, Noll, Cowher and Tomlin.    But it should be noted that prior to Bradshaw's arrival, the Steelers were bottom dwellers in the league for many years.   And that in between the Bradshaw era and the Rothlisberger eras, the Steelers struggled quite a bit.  

With only the two data points of the Steelers and the Patriots, it seems as though winning culture would be defined by having superior coaching and superior QB play.  It seems like without both, there may not be some concept of "culture" that can substitute and lead to winning.  

 

Coaching is more important than the QB. Case in point the Rams. McVay is likely the best coach in the NFL right now and what he's doing with Goff is truly impressive.

[Big Turk]

Dont have to look far. The gold standard has been in our division with the Patriots

[row_33]

You don’t copy other teams, you build your own winning team.

 

 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

14 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

Dont have to look far. The gold standard has been in our division with the Patriots

It might be looked upon as a gold standard, but a lot of the Patriots' philosophy seems based on the phrase, "ask me no questions and I'll tell you no lies".

Edited October 26, 2018 by Ridgewaycynic2013

[Big Turk]

10 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

It might be looked upon as a gold standard, but a lot of the Patriots' philosophy seems based on the phrase, "ask me no questions and I'll tell you no lies".

 

If you are not cheating in some way, you aren't trying hard enough. The Patriots find loopholes in the rulebook or gray areas better than any team and use it to their advantage.

Edited October 26, 2018 by matter2003

[Heavy Kevi]

1 hour ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

Coach McDermott has said his emphasis is on building a winning culture.  Some fans have mocked this. Other fans have defended the teams current level performance as being a necessary step on the road to building the winning culture. 

 

It seems as though people struggle to define what comprises this culture.  I am not asking that question in this thread.  I am simple trying to have a discussion about which teams have the winning culture the Bills should try to emulate.   Thank you for your feedback. 

 

Look at the Sabres. After the two recent comebacks that's all you hear from the players. They say something to the effect of "last years team", or "before we would have went into our shells", but that this year they keep fighting and don't change their game or get dejected when they are down on the scoreboard. It's players like Eich registering 5 hits, a 300 year old Pommer with 2 goals, it's most importantly players not wanting to let down their teammates. They believe in themselves and their team, and don't give up, look for a way out, or (to use an mma reference) tap to strikes.

 

I believe this is the type of "culture" we are looking for, and it has been a factor in many a successful team across all sports. You have to be there mentally to even scratch the surface of your own skillset. The Bills need to get there, but it will take time. If we manage to build a semi-coherent team with a few young stars, they will start to believe in each other, but that can be fostered from the top (HC) as well, and that is what McD is trying to do. Instead of looking for the magic scenario when the players do it themselves (guys like Peyton and Ray Lewis come to mind), McD is attempting to make it a "Bills" thing rather than the mark of olny one particular years' squad.

 

I, for one; hope it works. We have seen glimpses of it in games like Minny. When we don't have it, we are just our collective talent (not great right now) and get smoked by the Colts, but when the attitude, the culture is right we can topple a great team like that even with this ragtag group of guys. 

[PlayoffsPlease]

I am not trying to pick any fights and don't want to complete dismiss this idea of culture  But does the Steelers culture collapse if you change out Rothlisberger for Dobbs? 

 

No one has provided an example of a team with a "winning culture" without a hall of fame QB.   The only modern example I can think of is the Joe Gibbs redskins era.  But Gibbs was a genius, and QB was not quite the dominant position it is today. 

[DrDawkinstein]

1 hour ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

The Steelers as an organization have had success across three head coaches, Noll, Cowher and Tomlin.    But it should be noted that prior to Bradshaw's arrival, the Steelers were bottom dwellers in the league for many years.   And that in between the Bradshaw era and the Rothlisberger eras, the Steelers struggled quite a bit.  

With only the two data points of the Steelers and the Patriots, it seems as though winning culture would be defined by having superior coaching and superior QB play.  It seems like without both, there may not be some concept of "culture" that can substitute and lead to winning.  

 

Then compare that to the Bills franchise, which has historically driven good coaches out of town, and has historically placed far greater value on the running game than QB.

 

?

1 minute ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

I am not trying to pick any fights and don't want to complete dismiss this idea of culture  But does the Steelers culture collapse if you change out Rothlisberger for Dobbs? 

 

No one has provided an example of a team with a "winning culture" without a hall of fame QB.   The only modern example I can think of is the Joe Gibbs redskins era.  But Gibbs was a genius, and QB was not quite the dominant position it is today. 

 

True, but the point is that those teams' cultures, which start from the Ownership, are ones that properly value the QB position in the first place.

[mjt328]

There are several different aspects of the "culture" goals Sean McDermott talks about, and I think it's easy for fans to get confused.

 

In my opinion, "Winning Culture" is just another term for confidence.  Watch a team like the Patriots.  Even if they find themselves down 2 touchdowns, they always believe they will (not can) come back and win it.  There is no doubt.  In contrast, another team may be playing well - but then someone makes a mistake, there is momentum shift and everything instantly spirals downward.  Some teams have it.   Others don't.  And it's not something that just comes with a change in coach or a change in attitude.  I think this is something that builds gradually over time, and comes with players growing to trust each other.

 

This seems to get mixed up with McDermott's belief in getting "high character" players, and building a culture of hard work.  Unlike what some Bills fans think, this isn't about filling the team with boy-scouts and born-again Christians.  It's all about finding football players who are willing to put the team first.  Guys like Marcel Dareus couldn't get on-board with this.  Not just because of his ridiculous behavior off the field, but mostly because of his selfish attitude that put himself about his teammates.  It's a delicate balance trying to determine what talent-level is worth dealing with the character concerns.

 

 

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, Jasovon said:

 

Coaching is more important than the QB. Case in point the Rams. McVay is likely the best coach in the NFL right now and what he's doing with Goff is truly impressive.

 

I think you under appreciate how good Goff is. McVay is a brilliant coach, no doubt. But Jared Goff is really good. He is playing the position as well as anyone in the league at the moment.

[dpberr]

I'd offer the Carolina Panthers under Ron Rivera. Two time COY.   

 

I think Rivera has been one of the top coaches in the game.  He's shown to be able to adapt and deviate from "the" plan.  His players always play hard.  You don't see or hear about a lot of player or coach dissention.  Outside injuries, the team is always competitive.  I think he's been a great mentor for Cam Newton.  I think Newton under a different coach would have been a hot mess as a player coming out of school.  

 

  

 

 

[Thurman#1]

2 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

Patriots

 

 

Yup.

 

2 hours ago, The Process said:

Steelers

Alabama

 

 

Yeah, them too.

 

The Ravens, the Pack. As DPBerr suggested above, I think the Panthers are there too. Falcons? Maybe even the Vikings?

 

I'm running low, but that's just it, there aren't all that many. To join them you've got improve as a whole organization and maintain some consistency.

 

1 hour ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

How do you plan to emulate the Patriots and Steelers winning cultures when you are getting blown out by 20 or 30 points every week?

 

 

By rebuilding, getting the cap in order and installing their culture. And consistently improving.

 

Of course, easier said than done. But it is possible in the long term.

 

 

Edited October 26, 2018 by Thurman#1

[All_Pro_Bills]

When you try to 'emulate' another organizations culture you usually end up just 'imitating' them rather than 'being' them.  From my experience with 'culture' changes in the business world I find the majority of culture changes to be a bunch of B.S.  The don't work.  I don't think it's much different in sports.  You can't take a bunch of unmotivated losers, put in some new rules and processes, and make them into winners.  It comes down to one thing.  Either you know what you are doing or you don't.   if you're the owner hire people that know what they are doing.  If you find you are not hiring people that know what they are doing then admit that you, as the owner, don't know what you are doing either.