Bangarang Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 40 minutes ago, ngbills said: Peterman is a late round draft pick that should not even be on an NFL roster. But if we are going to talk about it is impossible to judge Allen because of the number games he’s played in and the personnel he is surrounded with, shouldnt that logic also apply to a Peterman? It’s easier to disregard someone when the expectations are extremely low.
jrober38 Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 1 hour ago, billspro said: Allen and Gabbert have no similarities at all. Blaine Gabbert: ANALYSIS STRENGTHS Gabbert has prototypical size and excellent speed for the position. Shows the ability to make the right pre-snap reads. Possesses a quick release and has the arm strength to make all the throws. Well-balanced passer that rarely misses on short-to-intermediate throws. Extremely mobile to extend plays and fast enough to move the chains. Vocal leader and hard worker. WEAKNESSES Trusts his arm too much and puts the ball in harm's way too often. Does not show good touch on passes over the middle and needs to learn to take a little velocity off certain throws. Struggles to throw an accurate deep ball. Late feeling pressure at times which neutralizes his very good mobility. Will need to learn a pro style offense. That's pretty much the exact same scouting report we all read about Josh Allen. As I said, all the same pros and cons. Both are big, strong, mobile QBs with big arms who don't play the QB position well.
billspro Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, jrober38 said: Blaine Gabbert: ANALYSIS STRENGTHS Gabbert has prototypical size and excellent speed for the position. Shows the ability to make the right pre-snap reads. Possesses a quick release and has the arm strength to make all the throws. Well-balanced passer that rarely misses on short-to-intermediate throws. Extremely mobile to extend plays and fast enough to move the chains. Vocal leader and hard worker. WEAKNESSES Trusts his arm too much and puts the ball in harm's way too often. Does not show good touch on passes over the middle and needs to learn to take a little velocity off certain throws. Struggles to throw an accurate deep ball. Late feeling pressure at times which neutralizes his very good mobility. Will need to learn a pro style offense. That's pretty much the exact same scouting report we all read about Josh Allen. As I said, all the same pros and cons. Both are big, strong, mobile QBs with big arms who don't play the QB position well. Is that suppose to prove something? If you watch the games they play nothing alike. Gabbert came from a college offense that emphasized the screen game, he really struggled with consistency on deep and intermediate throws. Allen is a project QB that came from a vertical passing offense in college. He has more tools than any QB to come out of the draft in recent years. He has not learned to read defenses well yet but has shown some improvement this year. Allen still has a pretty good shot at being a good NFL starter. Allen throws much better on deep and intermediate throws but can struggle with the short game. The exact opposite of Gabbert. 48 minutes ago, Bangarang said: But if we are going to talk about it is impossible to judge Allen because of the number games he’s played in and the personnel he is surrounded with, shouldnt that logic also apply to a Peterman? It’s easier to disregard someone when the expectations are extremely low. Nope because Peterman doesn’t have an NFL skill set. If the defense takes away the middle of the field he has no chance. Edited October 15, 2018 by billspro
GoBills808 Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 'We never draft a QB with our 1st round pick! Total disregard for the position! We need to draft a QB high, maybe even trade up for one!' ... 'Not that one!'
TSOL Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 I feel like Josh Allen, under the proper gudence and development has tons of potential to become a very good quarterback. I also feel like if thrown to the wolves it could vastly affect his abilities. We will see how it plays out
ChronicAndKnuckles Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 3 hours ago, Estro said: I see more Blaine Gabbert, who like Allen, drops his eyes and stares at the pass rush when under pressure. A fatal QB'ing flaw IMO. What? Allen keeps his eyes downfield. He may suck right now, but he most certaintly doesn't play scared.
apuszczalowski Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 So if you dont have blind faith and support everything they do, you arent a true fan? There are very few here that have actually given up on Allen at this time, but there are many that are getting worried that he isnt gojng to make it as the franchise saviour everyone expected to get this offseason. The problem so far has been that they took a guy who many believed didnt have what was needed to be a starter without a lot of work and needed to sit an learn to have a chance to be successful. He had the ability to be a starter due to some of his skills/attributes, but there was no guarantee it would work out. He is forced into starting almost immediately because of incompetence in the front office, and the results were as advertised, he does not look like a starting QB in the NFL. Sure he could still develop, but the odds are against him and the Bill's dont seem to have thought bringing in people who can maximize his talent and develop him was important. How many QBs have come into the league needing to develop as much as Allen and actually make it? How many succeed just by playing more? The QB position has tons of higher ranked and thought of QBs getting drafted and failing. 1
Bangarang Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 8 minutes ago, billspro said: Is that suppose to prove something? If you watch the games they play nothing alike. Gabbert came from a college offense that emphasized the screen game, he really struggled with consistency on deep and intermediate throws. Allen is a project QB that came from a vertical passing offense in college. He has more tools than any QB to come out of the draft in recent years. He has not learned to read defenses well yet but has shown some improvement this year. Allen still has a pretty good shot at being a good NFL starter. Allen throws much better on deep and intermediate throws but can struggle with the short game. The exact opposite of Gabbert. Nope because Peterman doesn’t have an NFL skill set. If the defense takes away the middle of the field he has no chance. So the logic only applies to who you want when it fits your narrative? Gotcha
C.Biscuit97 Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 1 hour ago, billspro said: Allen and Gabbert have no similarities at all. They have a ton of similarities. They both had very average last years in college (Allen didn’t make All-MWC, Gabbert had 16 tds in a spread) and they were unquestioned top 5 picks. They are guys who get drafted him because they look the part rather than perform on the field. obviously, it doesn’t mean Allen will be Gabbert but there is a comparison to be made. 7 minutes ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said: What? Allen keeps his eyes downfield. He may suck right now, but he most certaintly doesn't play scared. He didn’t say scared. It’s just when a rush comes, you can start looking st the rush instead of downfield. Great qbs are always looking downfield and to make a pass. Allen looks to escape the pocket. It’s one of the problems of playing him this early. and while I have questions about him, I will never question his toughness. 1
billspro Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 3 minutes ago, Bangarang said: So the logic only applies to who you want when it fits your narrative? Gotcha I don’t know what to tell you. Peterman does not have NFL talent. If he did I would be willing to give him a longer look. He just doesn’t have the arm strength. Allen may not be good but he looks like an NFL QB. I am willing to give him another 13 games to see if he can put it together. I don’t think I would keep Peterman on the roster today. The experiment is over.
Bangarang Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 1 minute ago, billspro said: I don’t know what to tell you. Peterman does not have NFL talent. If he did I would be willing to give him a longer look. He just doesn’t have the arm strength. Allen may not be good but he looks like an NFL QB. I am willing to give him another 13 games to see if he can put it together. I don’t think I would keep Peterman on the roster today. The experiment is over. So we can’t judge the guy we want to be good but it’s okay to judge the guy we don’t think will be good under the same circumstances. Do you not see the double standard there?
GoBills808 Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 58 minutes ago, Bangarang said: But if we are going to talk about it is impossible to judge Allen because of the number games he’s played in and the personnel he is surrounded with, shouldnt that logic also apply to a Peterman? It’s easier to disregard someone when the expectations are extremely low. 3 minutes ago, Bangarang said: So the logic only applies to who you want when it fits your narrative? Gotcha If you think it's a 'narrative' issue that allows for different projections of Josh Allen and Nathan Peterman, as opposed to a very reasonable analysis of their respective careers and traits thus far, I have no idea what you've been watching on Sundays.
billspro Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: They have a ton of similarities. They both had very average last years in college (Allen didn’t make All-MWC, Gabbert had 16 tds in a spread) and they were unquestioned top 5 picks. They are guys who get drafted him because they look the part rather than perform on the field. obviously, it doesn’t mean Allen will be Gabbert but there is a comparison to be made. He didn’t say scared. It’s just when a rush comes, you can start looking st the rush instead of downfield. Great qbs are always looking downfield and to make a pass. Allen looks to escape the pocket. It’s one of the problems of playing him this early. and while I have questions about him, I will never question his toughness. Sorry I should have said I don’t see similarities in their play style. Allen will have to learn to step up in the pocket and keep his eyes down field if he wants to be successful. If he keeps looking at the rush he will bust. 1 minute ago, Bangarang said: So we can’t judge the guy we want to be good but it’s okay to judge the guy we don’t think will be good under the same circumstances. Do you not see the double standard there? I want Peterman to be good, I was rooting for him yesterday. The fact is first and second round picks always get longer looks. Life isn’t fair. I think we have seen enough of Peterman to know he doesn’t have an NFL arm. There is no point of trying to develop a guy if the talent isn’t there. Just how I see it.
Gordio Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 1 hour ago, Bangarang said: So we can’t judge the guy we want to be good but it’s okay to judge the guy we don’t think will be good under the same circumstances. Do you not see the double standard there? There is no double standard here. Peterman doesn't have the minimum tangible skill set to be a NFL Quarterback so why bother running him out there anymore. Does it finally make sense to you egghead?
Bangarang Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 Just now, Gordio said: There is no double standard here. Peterman doesn't have the minimum tangible skill set to be a NFL Quarterback so why bother running him out there anymore. Does it finally make sense to you egghead? The point isn’t to compare the skill sets of each. Try and keep up.
Southern Bills Fan Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 4 hours ago, jrober38 said: Goff was an elite college football player who put up enormous numbers in the Pac-12. Unless Sean McVay is coming through the door as our coach, I don't think this comparison makes any sense. Guys like EJ Manuel, Blaine Gabbert, Kyle Boller, Christian Hackenberg are better comparisons. Big, strong, mobile QBs with good intangibles who struggled to play QB. I meant more of a comparison of a QB who really struggled without weapons in his rookie year but turned it around his second year. You don't see it because you are rooting for him to fail so that you can proclaim that you were right all along. It's called confirmation bias. Every post you make is critical of Allen and you want to be shown to be correct.
TheBrownBear Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 Locker is a fair comparison right now. Question is whether Allen can develop quick enough to succeed in the league. He's got another year from me before I write him off.
par73 Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 Jake Locker is who I thought of when Allen started gaining national attention at Wyoming. I hope it works out differently, but I don't have much confidence.
dakrider Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 Completely useless to judge an NFL QB in his first year. Not many great QB's looked good as rookies. Elway didn't, Farve didn't even play but a few downs his first year. Troy Aikman, Terry Bradshaw, many others had poor rookie years and great careers. Jared Goff looked terrible 2 years ago - "in Week 11 when Goff finally made his first start: very. He was very unready."
jrober38 Posted October 15, 2018 Posted October 15, 2018 26 minutes ago, Southern Bills Fan said: I meant more of a comparison of a QB who really struggled without weapons in his rookie year but turned it around his second year. You don't see it because you are rooting for him to fail so that you can proclaim that you were right all along. It's called confirmation bias. Every post you make is critical of Allen and you want to be shown to be correct. All I want is for the Bills to have competent Quarterback play from their starter. Allen isn't giving that to them.
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