Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said: Me? My judgement doesn't matter. But Allen is on pace to set an NFL record for sacks in a season, and if he is IR'd or suffers the sort of injuries that tend to curtain a QB's career (multiple concussions, back or shoulder) I would say that's the judgement right there. Tell me what you mean by "chance to come to fruition" though? I mean that the general consensus is that this coming offseason is the part of the plan where they spend coin and picks on offense. So, if you can these guys now, you've effectively fired them before they even had a chance to execute.
teef Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 4 minutes ago, COTC said: We went from playoff potential to worse team in the league... We were supposed to build on last years success. Josh McDanials is to Tim Tebow as McDermott is to Josh Allen. i don't think there was anyone that though this year was going to be a continuation of last year. most realized there would be a step back. 1
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, Dablitzkrieg said: I think the majority of people are really overreacting juuuuuuuust a bit here. We all knew (at least the smart fans) that the team was going to suck. Enjoy the ride people This thread is evidence of what happens when feelings overtake logic. 1
COTC Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, teef said: i don't think there was anyone that though this year was going to be a continuation of last year. most realized there would be a step back. I expected us to be in a similar situation as the Titans. Not worse the the league.
teef Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, COTC said: I expected us to be in a similar situation as the Titans. Not worse the the league. i actually responded to your post in another thread. i don't think it's an apples to apples comparison to the titans at all.
Dablitzkrieg Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, COTC said: I expected us to be in a similar situation as the Titans. Not worse the the league. Arizona is the worst team in the league right now..by a mile
plenzmd1 Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 2 minutes ago, joesixpack said: I mean that the general consensus is that this coming offseason is the part of the plan where they spend coin and picks on offense. So, if you can these guys now, you've effectively fired them before they even had a chance to execute. I want no part of that...they got this and at least two more..unless Allen is a 100% total bust.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, plenzmd1 said: I want no part of that...they got this and at least two more..unless Allen is a 100% total bust. Well, that's good. There are people here who could conceive of them being fired THIS year.
stony Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 2 minutes ago, joesixpack said: I mean that the general consensus is that this coming offseason is the part of the plan where they spend coin and picks on offense. So, if you can these guys now, you've effectively fired them before they even had a chance to execute. I have no desire to can these guys now. That would be stupid. But its fair to criticize their decision to strip the offense and delay laying any foundation of talent on that side of the ball while throwing Allen into the furnace. They've effectively burnt a year of his rookie deal and possibly stunted a year of his development. 2
Gugny Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 5 minutes ago, COTC said: We went from playoff potential to worse team in the league... We were supposed to build on last years success. Josh McDanials is to Tim Tebow as McDermott is to Josh Allen. I think most people realize that last year's Bills team was a bad team that somehow backed into the playoffs. McDermott and Beane also got rid of the best players on both sides of the ball and went with a rookie QB and Nate Peterman. I think building is accurate with regard to what to expect this season; but being anywhere close to "successful" (wins/playoffs) as last year's team? Good God, no. And I've tried, but I can't make sense of your McDaniels/Tebow to McDermott/Allen connection. An offense-minded coach with arguably the worst QB in the history of the NFL being compared to a defense-minded coach with a rookie QB who's made 3 (three) (tres) career starts. You got me stumped.
plenzmd1 Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, joesixpack said: Well, that's good. There are people here who could conceive of them being fired THIS year. doesn't mean can't B word when he says something stupid in his coach speak?!!!!
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 22 minutes ago, joesixpack said: Considering I liked Chan, I doubt it. I think his statement is one of "we want guys with talent AND effort." That's what he means by culture, but people here have their preconceived ideas about what he means. ...why not?.....aren't those key components of a culture so you can build you winning strategy?.....what did I miss?......
Coach Tuesday Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, ScottLaw said: I think it's more about having no choice but to play Allen because of their gigantic mismanagement of the QBs considering the state on of the offensive line and receivers. Keeping Tyrod or McCarron while allowing Allen to ride the bench and not get his ass kicked would've been ideal. Instead they went with the worst starting QB in the history of the game because of process and effort and of course he was !@#$ing terrible giving them no choice but to go with Allen. The trades of Tyrod and McCarron while getting us draft picks are looking like awful decisions at the moment. But that's what I'm saying - if this is going to be the New Normal for 2018, you're better off signing a street QB and letting him take the pounding.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 17 minutes ago, jkeerie said: The jury is out on our offensive coaching. I don't understand what Daboll is trying to do from week to week. Running the football does not appear to be part of his overall plan. Yes...this is a passing league, but you can't have a good passing game without talent...and without a respected run game. Good post. I've been discussing the bolded point with some folks in PM. Daboll's play calling often simply does not make situationally appropriate sense to me. Example: in the all-22 thread, some tweets by Sal dissect our second offensive series. On 1 and 10 from our 6, Sal critiques Allen for hesitating on a 2 yd slant to Benjamin. We are in max-protect 22 personnel and Allen has plenty of time. When I first looked at the play, I thought Sal was mistaken and the actual 1st read was Zay Jones, open downfield. When I went back and looked at Allen's eyes though, he never looks at Zay. So maybe Sal is right and the 2 yd slant is it. Max protect on first down on the goal line for a 2 yd slant, WTF? Then on 3rd and 10, Daboll dials up a 4 WR play. Yet all but one of the 4 WR run routes well short of the marker such that a completion would likely force a punt. WTF, on 3rd and 10 at the 6, 3 of 4 WR running routes short of the marker? That would be a great play for 1st or 2nd down, if you win you move the chains, if you lose you get 4-5 yds. I think running the football is part of what Daboll wants to do but our run blocking is so bad at times he usually can't achieve it. Which of course, begs the question - why? We had many of the same guys and weren't quite as "Keystone Cops" last year. It's not just we're beaten or we can't get a push (though that happens), it's ineffective cutting and assignment confusion. I guess my jury is still open to evidence, but their butts are kind of squirming on those hard oak seats.
Warcodered Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 So at around 13:40 he starts talking about talent and how he feels about it.
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 ...so if McDermott is a one trick pony as far as defensive background and the offense continues to sputter, how long do you think McBeane sticks around as the dog being wagged by the tail as far as personnel decisions?....Andy wields a heavy hand on the GM side in KC but he's proven.......Chip Kelly tried and failed.....is this what McDermott sees his role as with McBeane the order taker?.....should be REAL successful...............
DaBillsFanSince1973 Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 funny how so many have turned on the guy in such a short time, even the petty nicknames thrown at him. seems he was the HC when the drought was broke but instead of crediting him, just excuse that fact and call it luck or if it wasn't for this or wasn't for that they'd be in year 18 of the drought. one season, 4 games in to the second and the torches and pitchforks are waving mercilessly for his head. shame, just shows that most of the know it alls around here are not willing to give him time, no patience with that crowd for sure. 1 1
jkeerie Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 11 minutes ago, Warcodered said: So at around 13:40 he starts talking about talent and how he feels about it. Talent and habits...you've got something. Talent without habits, he wants no part of. Case in point, Vontaze Burfict, Bengals LB. Very talented...but the only habit he has is hot-tempered stupidity. He cost his team a playoff victory against the Steelers. 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 17 minutes ago, joesixpack said: I mean that the general consensus is that this coming offseason is the part of the plan where they spend coin and picks on offense. So, if you can these guys now, you've effectively fired them before they even had a chance to execute. Ah, OK, thanks for clarifying. I think I get you now. For me, I would say it's a potential example of the "sunk costs fallacy". McBeane had a plan involving clearing cap, pruning dead wood off the roster, and building around the key pieces of a LT, QB, MLB, and shutdown corner. They made playoffs by a fluke last year with a talent-depleted roster, and this year's plan was to stick it out through some growing pains with the new pieces and add talent next year. I think we all agree that was the plan? Your argument is, let them finish their plan, add talent next year in draft and FA, see where that goes, and then judge. We have sunk a lot of investment in these guys and their plan, right? My point (and this isn't what I'm arguing for, just my guess at what might happen) is that the above is predicated on the display of an appropriate level of football competence given the talent we have. The coaches need to be able to protect the investment in their key-piece QB one way or the other. They need to craft play designs that work with the talent we have and make situationally appropriate playcalls. And they need to show the ability to get the most out of the team on a consistent basis. If they do, fine, stay the course, steady as she goes or as you say, give them a "chance to execute" If they don't, it's just like any business investment where businessmen evaluate the performance of an asset and say "yeah, we will lose our sunk costs, but we don't see evidence that this investment is in the right hands to be turned around" It's saying "you don't get a chance to execute 'cuz we don't see enough evidence that you can execute." 1
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted October 3, 2018 Posted October 3, 2018 ......just not sure an Owner hiring his HC who then goes out and finds a GM to his liking regardless of prior affiliations is the right way.......seems a bit azz backwards and if it's implied your HC has that much power, where does the GM realistically stand in the grand scheme of things?.....just a thought....... 1
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