Alaska Darin Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Infrastructure is a Constitutional responsibility of the Federal government. Of course, it's crumbling while Nero fiddles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 The Smoking Man took a kindly shot at you because you aren't Libertarian to the hilt. Besides Richio and Debbie, who else in the world is a pure party mouthpiece? We'd all be idiots if we aligned perfectly with party platforms. I'm a Libertarian who believes in NASA funding, and that the ideals of the party must be tempered by realistic plans. I want the government out of almost everything, but practically speaking, such a goal must be acheived in steps, not all at once. 283789[/snapback] We all have issues that mean something to us, right JA? You, for whatever reason, are very hung up, if you will, on gay marriages, right? Imo, this is an issue sold to us by both parties to make us focus less on things that truly matter. In any event, good luck with YOUR cause. PS: Telling us how you are married doesn't change much now does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Other than that, I agree with your post. Very often, mid-level white collar workers want to feel that they are in some way superior to a union electrician, etc. It angers them to see a cops kid get braces because of benefits that their union fought for, when they perhaps cannot. Well, if they were of such value to their companies, they too would get these benefits and more. 283025[/snapback] You hit the nail on the head Bill! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 All taxes should be based on consumption, not production. 283099[/snapback] I totally agree! Until then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Infrastructure is a Constitutional responsibility of the Federal government. Of course, it's crumbling while Nero fiddles. 283815[/snapback] Boy you can say that again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 We all have issues that mean something to us, right JA? You, for whatever reason, are very hung up, if you will, on gay marriages, right? Imo, this is an issue sold to us by both parties to make us focus less on things that truly matter. In any event, good luck with YOUR cause. PS: Telling us how you are married doesn't change much now does it? 283818[/snapback] I'm not sure I ever said I was married. In fact, a few months ago, I think I even challenged the assertion that people think I'm a man. I can be whoever I want to be here in cyberland. Maybe I'm an agorophobic female Dolphin fan living with 20 cats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Oh, and another thing...the reason wages are lower today is because our industries could not compete because UNIONS demanded too much for the average employee. Why would any FOR-PROFIT business want to stay where labor costs are so high? 282974[/snapback] Right, Joe. All businesses should move their operations to Sri Lanka, the wages are much lower. Don't tell me you believe that crap you're spewing. The for profit business is doing fine. It's just that those at the top need 5 vacation homes, 10 cars and 2 mega yachts. They can't possibly have these things if the "grunts" are making a decent wage. I think while both of our points of view are obvious exaggerations, mine is a bit closer to the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Right, Joe. All businesses should move their operations to Sri Lanka, the wages are much lower. Don't tell me you believe that crap you're spewing. The for profit business is doing fine. It's just that those at the top need 5 vacation homes, 10 cars and 2 mega yachts. They can't possibly have these things if the "grunts" are making a decent wage. I think while both of our points of view are obvious exaggerations, mine is a bit closer to the truth. 284056[/snapback] Yeah, cause there are soooo many people that fit into that category. There is one CEO per company and at most of them, his comp wouldn't run the company for a single a day. Not a very intelligent or valid argument when whining about the pay of tens of thousands of employees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 This is a joke. CEOs don't work? I'll guaran-fricking-tee that most CEOs put in more hours a week than you do. They have huge responsibilities. Especially a CEO like GM's. These guys are in extremely high-pressure jobs where performance is the bottom line. They don't punch-in and punch out like Billy Wrenchturner every day. They get paid a lot because they do a lot. In other words, they get paid commensurate to the value they add. Billy Wrenchturner is just that: a guy turning a wrench all day, 5 days a week. He doesn't DESERVE $35 an hour and free health insurance because that's not his intrinsic value. All of those white-collar people probably put in more hours a week than the UAW folks because they were salaried. And yet THEY pay the price because some undereducated floor-sweeper wants his FREE health insurance? Right. That's fair. 282971[/snapback] sure, and EVERYONE in society is compensated "Fairly" right? Get in the real world please. And why is it OK for you to exaggerate the lack of value of workers by calling them "wrenchturners" but when I exaggerate the carefree day of the exec, you jump down my throat? The fact is all employees have value. The execs are compensated lavishly for their "value" and huge responsibilty. $35 an hour and health care is a relative pittance to the execs package. And why is everyone that does not wear a dress shirt and tie "undereducated" . I know many people with degrees working in non white collar jobs. It's a reality today. The world,FYI is not perfect. Everything doesn't always work "the way it's supposed to". That is the source of the anger against unions. They go against what everyone was always told.."Joey, do your homework so you can get a scholarship and your life will be perfect" . Then you get in the real world and realize that EVERYONE these days has a Bachelors degree. It does nothing to distinguish you from the crowd. Then when you're not getting "your share" that you are "owed" and see a Union employee making more, well that just isn't supposed to happen right? You probably have road rage as well. You can't stand to see anyone else getting "out of line". The fact is that white collar guy took that job knowing full well what it entailed. He's just as replacable as the blue collar worker. That is todays reality.I've worked as a white collar manager and a blue collar front liner. It has zero to do with the fact that I have a college education. I chose the blue collar job because it PAYS ME MORE> That's what it's all about,right? I don't feel I need to apologize for it.Our economic system contains many oddities. Athletes and rappers that dress like inmates make more in a week than you or I will in a lifetime. I'll get what I can get and not begrudge someone who's better off than me just because I don't feel they "deserve it". If you want to be a football player, go be one. And no I'm not a democrat or a republican. I hate taxes, welfare, gay marriage but I believe in abortion and the right of the guy next to me to light up a smoke even if I don't like it. All politicians are crooks. I'm also an atheist. I don't subscribe to political labels, but I agree in more freedoms (definitely not a republican trait) and less taxes (not DEM). Oh well, that's my rant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Yeah, cause there are soooo many people that fit into that category. There is one CEO per company and at most of them, his comp wouldn't run the company for a single a day. Not a very intelligent or valid argument when whining about the pay of tens of thousands of employees. 284066[/snapback] Ya there are... Snowbirds are just getting ready to make their way up from the gulf in a few weeks. Want to see extravagance? There is a lot out there. Obviously, people are doing well. What do you think the mortgage is on a 3 million dollar yacht? Most of them have professional pilots that take the vessel up anyway. Out of our 35,000 PC (pleasure craft) lockages annually. I would say about 30% are in the luxury class (over 150k). The money is out there folks... Don't let them fool you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 That is the source of the anger against unions. 284071[/snapback] Yeah, that's the reason. Keep telling yourself that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 23, 2005 Author Share Posted March 23, 2005 The Smoking Man took a kindly shot at you because you aren't Libertarian to the hilt. Besides Richio and Debbie, who else in the world is a pure party mouthpiece? We'd all be idiots if we aligned perfectly with party platforms. I'm a Libertarian who believes in NASA funding, and that the ideals of the party must be tempered by realistic plans. I want the government out of almost everything, but practically speaking, such a goal must be acheived in steps, not all at once. 283789[/snapback] See, John, we DO have things in common Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 23, 2005 Author Share Posted March 23, 2005 sure, and EVERYONE in society is compensated "Fairly" right? Get in the real world please. And why is it OK for you to exaggerate the lack of value of workers by calling them "wrenchturners" but when I exaggerate the carefree day of the exec, you jump down my throat? The fact is all employees have value. The execs are compensated lavishly for their "value" and huge responsibilty. $35 an hour and health care is a relative pittance to the execs package. And why is everyone that does not wear a dress shirt and tie "undereducated" . I know many people with degrees working in non white collar jobs. It's a reality today. The world,FYI is not perfect. Everything doesn't always work "the way it's supposed to". That is the source of the anger against unions. They go against what everyone was always told.."Joey, do your homework so you can get a scholarship and your life will be perfect" . Then you get in the real world and realize that EVERYONE these days has a Bachelors degree. It does nothing to distinguish you from the crowd. Then when you're not getting "your share" that you are "owed" and see a Union employee making more, well that just isn't supposed to happen right? You probably have road rage as well. You can't stand to see anyone else getting "out of line". The fact is that white collar guy took that job knowing full well what it entailed. He's just as replacable as the blue collar worker. That is todays reality.I've worked as a white collar manager and a blue collar front liner. It has zero to do with the fact that I have a college education. I chose the blue collar job because it PAYS ME MORE> That's what it's all about,right? I don't feel I need to apologize for it.Our economic system contains many oddities. Athletes and rappers that dress like inmates make more in a week than you or I will in a lifetime. I'll get what I can get and not begrudge someone who's better off than me just because I don't feel they "deserve it". If you want to be a football player, go be one. And no I'm not a democrat or a republican. I hate taxes, welfare, gay marriage but I believe in abortion and the right of the guy next to me to light up a smoke even if I don't like it. All politicians are crooks. I'm also an atheist. I don't subscribe to political labels, but I agree in more freedoms (definitely not a republican trait) and less taxes (not DEM). Oh well, that's my rant. 284071[/snapback] Use a paragraph break once in a while, huh? Of course white collar guys are replacable. But I can damn well tell you that if *I* was one of the white collar guys that lost his job because a broom-pusher out in the plant was making $35 an hour wuth FREE healthcare, I'd be standing outside the union hall with a baseball bat. Unions exist for one reason and ONE REASON alone. To protect the lazy man. Period. And you sound like the perfect example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 We just got $200,000,000.00 from the Fed to plan a bridge. TO PLAN a bridge. Not to build one. Scary. 283806[/snapback] Where's that bridge going? To the moon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TracyLee Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Use a paragraph break once in a while, huh? Of course white collar guys are replacable. But I can damn well tell you that if *I* was one of the white collar guys that lost his job because a broom-pusher out in the plant was making $35 an hour wuth FREE healthcare, I'd be standing outside the union hall with a baseball bat. Unions exist for one reason and ONE REASON alone. To protect the lazy man. Period. And you sound like the perfect example. 284158[/snapback] I think the broom-pusher would probably tell you to bend over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 23, 2005 Author Share Posted March 23, 2005 I think the broom-pusher would probably tell you to bend over. 284510[/snapback] he might, before I cracked him in the cranium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 Ya there are... Snowbirds are just getting ready to make their way up from the gulf in a few weeks. Want to see extravagance? There is a lot out there. Obviously, people are doing well. What do you think the mortgage is on a 3 million dollar yacht? Most of them have professional pilots that take the vessel up anyway. Out of our 35,000 PC (pleasure craft) lockages annually. I would say about 30% are in the luxury class (over 150k). The money is out there folks... Don't let them fool you. 284082[/snapback] So what's your point? That the root of all evil is the fact that some people are doing well? That people who invent and create and succeed don't deserve the rewards that come with the risk of failure? Gee, we'd all be so much better off if Thomas Edison and Albert Einstein had taken union jobs to lock in their $35/hour plus benefits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TracyLee Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 I wonder if in Freudian theory all of this union anger is really repressed desire. It would probably be known as "union envy" . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 23, 2005 Author Share Posted March 23, 2005 I wonder if in Freudian theory all of this union anger is really repressed desire. It would probably be known as "union envy" . 284560[/snapback] No, it's more like disgust with the fact that unions have decimated the American manufacturing sector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TracyLee Posted March 23, 2005 Share Posted March 23, 2005 No, it's more like disgust with the fact that unions have decimated the American manufacturing sector. 284562[/snapback] Really? So it has nothing to do with silly little things like free trade or outsourcing etc.? Tell me again how long unions have been around? Do you honestly believe that unions are the sole reason for the slow demise of our manufacturing sector? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts