Foster Drops Another

[SoTier]

10 hours ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

We just don’t have anyone better. I think they want a speed guy for Allen’s arm. Foster is all they could get this year. 

 

ROTFLMAO!  Who's fault is that?????   Who didn't want/care that Goodwin or Woods re-signed?  Who drafted Zay Jones?  Who traded away Watkins and traded for Benjamin?  Who traded for Coleman rather than waiting for him to be cut and wasted $3.5 million in dead cap space?  Who collected the rest of the scrubs that make up the Bills WR corps?

[The Wiz]

4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m not as apt to pick on a guy who’s young and trying. He doesn’t put himself on the field! The coaches do. I’m way more focused on Benjamin and Zay Jones. Neither of those two have any excuses. 

How is Zay not young and trying?  He's only got one season over Foster.

 

And again, no one is defending KB because everyone agrees he's been disappointing.

 

All of the receivers have been mediocre so I don't see why Foster should be given a pass because he's a rookie.  Everyone complained about Zay dropping balls last year too.

[Cripple Creek]

31 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

 

I see that you want to persist in posting college related material on the Bills' forum. You do know that this isn't an appropriate place for it, right?

?I love you, you magnificent troll.

 

I tend to listen to the mods around here, no need to try to fill me in on board policy. I'm sure if I slip up in some way they will step right in.  

 

If you're politicking for a position I'd recommend you take the direct approach and PM someone of importance.

Edited September 27, 2018 by Cripple Creek

[teef]

14 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

ROTFLMAO!  Who's fault is that?????   Who didn't want/care that Goodwin or Woods re-signed?  Who drafted Zay Jones?  Who traded away Watkins and traded for Benjamin?  Who traded for Coleman rather than waiting for him to be cut and wasted $3.5 million in dead cap space?  Who collected the rest of the scrubs that make up the Bills WR corps?

anger bro.  we need you around for a while.  maybe some tea will help.  

[Teddy KGB]

2 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

 

Correct, it was a tough catch.

 

1 hour ago, Sky Diver said:

 

It would have been a highlight reel catch.

 

A routine pass that hit him in the hands ?????

 

 

You have no credibility. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

30 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

A routine pass that hit him in the hands ?????

You have no credibility. 

 

Can I vote "yes" to both routine pass and tough catch/highlight reel?

If he had caught it, no doubt it would have been on the news. 

And yes, those are tough catches compared to many of the other routes, but they're also expected to be routine for the "deep guy"

Those passes are the reason Foster is on an NFL team and not stamping expiry dates on cottage cheese and ground beef at Food Lion, so he really better haul 'em in

[Teddy KGB]

Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Can I vote "yes" to both routine pass and tough catch/highlight reel?

If he had caught it, no doubt it would have been on the news. 

And yes, those are tough catches compared to many of the other routes, but they're also expected to be routine for the "deep guy"

Those passes are the reason Foster is on an NFL team and not stamping expiry dates on cottage cheese and ground beef at Food Lion, so he really better haul 'em in

 

I expect an nfl wr to make that catch 95% of the time.   

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

49 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

Right, Foster is only WR on the Bills that consistently gets open.

 

Incorrect.  May I suggest an NFL Game Pass trial?  Have a look, you'll see that's not so

 

Quote

60 yrd bombs are low percentage passes. To expect every one to be a completion is ridiculous.

 

This is both true and false.  What makes 60 yd bombs low percentage, is the difficulty of making the throw so that it actually arrives in the same place as the WR hands at the same time, which is affected by wind, turf conditions, whether the WR gets jammed up when he tries to release, etc etc etc. - lot of factors hard for QB and WR to control.

 

Once the ball actually arrives in the same place as the WR hands at the same time, the WR is expected to catch it.

 

8 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

I expect an nfl wr to make that catch 95% of the time.  

 

I dunno about 95%, but in Foster's case - he ain't on the team for his blocking or ST play, he ain't on the team for his crisp route running, he's on it cuz he can get open deep.  So he better catch balls that hit him in the hands, at least 2/3 of the time.

[rpmfla]

10 hours ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

Kurley, Streeter and Riley were and are all better IMO. This guy can’t even catch the goddamn ball. What makes him good?

I agree...and didn't Streeter have above average speed as well? Riley may not have been a burner, but he sure had a knack for getting open and he actually caught the ball. I think his injury came at the worst time. There has been a long history of teams trying out track stars and speed guys. Speed is definitely a bonus but to me should be less valued than knowing how to get open and having great hands to catch anything in the vicinity.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

14 hours ago, GreggTX said:

Foster I get. Benjamin, I don't. The one thing that KB has done at an elite level during his NFL career is catching. Now all of a sudden, he can't catch? I'm really hoping that ghe can shake whatever is ailing him and show those soft hands again. This has been his worst season to date, by far.

 

In his best years as a rookie and when he came back from IR, KB caught 50% of his targets.

He sucked in Game 1, but in games 2 and 3 he's so far been 5/8 which is 62.5%.  That doesn't reflect "all of a sudden, he can't catch", that's actually above average for KB.

 

The excuse (which has some truth to it) was that Cam Newton has "zip code accuracy" and that he was being expected to jump for and haul in contested catches, which is a whole higher degree of difficulty than Croom's TD catch.  It seems at this point, KB wants to be used in plays that leave him "Croom open", not ugly contested catches that will cause him to take a beating.

 

The problem for KB is, catch radius and the ability to haul in balls that he can jump and get a hand on are his stock-in-trade.  He isn't fast, he doesn't get open with agile cuts, he isn't a good blocker, his calling card is "he's always open 2' over his head".   So if he hasn't "got game" there, what has he got?  He wasn't used on the play that got Croom, "Croom open", because Croom successfully sold he was gonna block on that play.  It sold because Croom can actually block and has shown this on film. 

 

No one would have bought on that from KB.

[atlbillsfan1975]

9 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

ROTFLMAO!  Who's fault is that?????   Who didn't want/care that Goodwin or Woods re-signed?  Who drafted Zay Jones?  Who traded away Watkins and traded for Benjamin?  Who traded for Coleman rather than waiting for him to be cut and wasted $3.5 million in dead cap space?  Who collected the rest of the scrubs that make up the Bills WR corps?

They want to build their team. I can understand that . Those moves where made for the future. Goodwin couldn’t stay healthy. Woods didn’t want to be in Buffalo. Watkins was never going to be worth the deal he signed. 

Benjamin is a swing and a miss. Low risk on that. Same with Coleman. 

I believe Zay will be a fine slot receiver once more talent is around him. 

it takes time to build a team. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

11 minutes ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

They want to build their team. I can understand that . Those moves where made for the future. Goodwin couldn’t stay healthy. Woods didn’t want to be in Buffalo. Watkins was never going to be worth the deal he signed. 

Benjamin is a swing and a miss. Low risk on that. Same with Coleman. 

I believe Zay will be a fine slot receiver once more talent is around him. 

it takes time to build a team. 

 

....and at that time, Woods deal with Rams seemed like a Kings Ransom.......in the absurd WR pay scale currently, it was a bargain, but how the hell to you predict mindless escalation?.....

[Hapless Bills Fan]

11 minutes ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

They want to build their team. I can understand that . Those moves where made for the future. Goodwin couldn’t stay healthy. Woods didn’t want to be in Buffalo. Watkins was never going to be worth the deal he signed. 

Benjamin is a swing and a miss. Low risk on that. Same with Coleman. 

I believe Zay will be a fine slot receiver once more talent is around him. 

it takes time to build a team. 

 

Atl, I "get" that this is the narrative being circulated.  But let's look at this a bit.

 

"Goodwin couldn't stay healthy"

In 2016 with the Bills, Goodwin played 15 games and did not otherwise show up on the injury report.

In 2017 with the 49ers, Goodwin played 16 games and showed up as questionable on the injury report 2 weeks.

 

The Bills could have negotiated to re-sign Woods before he hit FA.  They didn't.   Ditto making him a serious offer.  We chose not to.  He did indicate in interviews he was open to it.  I don't think he was 100% sold on going elsewhere, we just didn't want to pay him like a high to mid level #2.

 

Watkins had a year left on his rookie deal, plus a 5th year option we passed on, at the point where he was traded.  The question isn't why didn't we re-sign him to a mega-deal, it's with our dearth of wide receivers behind him, why not hang onto him for last season at least?  Just maybe, if we had hung onto him, Boldin might have decided another season catching passes while the #1CB works Sammy might be worthwhile.  Yes, we got a draft pick for Sammy...then we gave one up, plus a higher salary, when we traded for Benjamin.

 

I don't understand why folks are so unwilling to acknowledge that the Bills had choices.  Their choice was to let Woods and Goodwin walk, trade Sammy while he was still on his rookie deal, and instead sign Boldin, trade for Matthews, sign Holmes, Deonte Thompson, then trade for Benjamin last season; sign and release Kerley and Corey Coleman this season.

 

I don't think they thought they were gutting their receiver corps by doing that.   I mean, can you imagine it?  What GM talks to the owner and says "well yeah, none of our WR can get open or catch, our offense is struggling, and the ones we let walk are going like gangbusters for new teams but DAMN I saved cap!"  (I believe if you look at the salaries and cap hits of the players they had under contract or could have signed last year, you'll see they didn't save much money, either.  I'm not talking Sammy's big KC payday this year, I'm talking last)

 

The most logical explanation is that they thought they were signing or trading for equivalent or better WR talent.

They were mistaken.

 

All GMs hit on some moves, and whiff on others, but why can't we just look at it and say McBeane and company laid an egg here?

 

 

16 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

....and at that time, Woods deal with Rams seemed like a Kings Ransom.......in the absurd WR pay scale currently, it was a bargain, but how the hell to you predict mindless escalation?.....

 

I thought Woods Rams deal at that time seemed like what it is - paying him like a solid to upper-eschalon #2 guy

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

6 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Atl, I "get" that this is the narrative being circulated.  But let's look at this a bit.

 

"Goodwin couldn't stay healthy"

In 2016 with the Bills, Goodwin played 15 games and did not otherwise show up on the injury report.

In 2017 with the 49ers, Goodwin played 16 games and showed up as questionable on the injury report 2 weeks.

 

The Bills could have negotiated to re-sign Woods before he hit FA.  They didn't.   Ditto making him a serious offer.  We chose not to.  He did indicate in interviews he was open to it.  I don't think he was 100% sold on going elsewhere, we just didn't want to pay him like a high to mid level #2.

 

Watkins had a year left on his rookie deal, plus a 5th year option we passed on, at the point where he was traded.  The question isn't why didn't we re-sign him to a mega-deal, it's with our dearth of wide receivers behind him, why not hang onto him for last season at least?  Just maybe, if we had hung onto him, Boldin might have decided another season catching passes while the #1CB works Sammy might be worthwhile.  Yes, we got a draft pick for Sammy...then we gave one up, plus a higher salary, when we traded for Benjamin.

 

I don't understand why folks are so unwilling to acknowledge that the Bills had choices.  Their choice was to let Woods and Goodwin walk, trade Sammy while he was still on his rookie deal, and instead sign Boldin, trade for Matthews, sign Holmes, Deonte Thompson, then trade for Benjamin last season; sign and release Kerley and Corey Coleman this season.

 

I don't think they thought they were gutting their receiver corps by doing that.   I mean, can you imagine it?  What GM talks to the owner and says "well yeah, none of our WR can get open or catch, our offense is struggling, and the ones we let walk are going like gangbusters for new teams but DAMN I saved cap!"  (I believe if you look at the salaries and cap hits of the players they had under contract or could have signed last year, you'll see they didn't save much money, either.  I'm not talking Sammy's big KC payday this year, I'm talking last)

 

The most logical explanation is that they thought they were signing or trading for equivalent or better WR talent.

They were mistaken.

 

All GMs hit on some moves, and whiff on others, but why can't we just look at it and say McBeane and company laid an egg here?

 

 

 

I thought Woods Rams deal at that time seemed like what it is - paying him like a solid to upper-eschalon #2 guy

 

 

...Woods: 5 years, $34 mil with $15 mil guaranteed.....Sammy: 3 years, $48 mil with $30 mil guaranteed....which would you prefer pound for pound?........

Edited September 27, 2018 by OldTimeAFLGuy

[atlbillsfan1975]

2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Atl, I "get" that this is the narrative being circulated.  But let's look at this a bit.

 

"Goodwin couldn't stay healthy"

In 2016 with the Bills, Goodwin played 15 games and did not otherwise show up on the injury report.

In 2017 with the 49ers, Goodwin played 16 games and showed up as questionable on the injury report 2 weeks.

 

The Bills could have negotiated to re-sign Woods before he hit FA.  They didn't.   Ditto making him a serious offer.  We chose not to.  He did indicate in interviews he was open to it.  I don't think he was 100% sold on going elsewhere, we just didn't want to pay him like a high to mid level #2.

 

Watkins had a year left on his rookie deal, plus a 5th year option we passed on, at the point where he was traded.  The question isn't why didn't we re-sign him to a mega-deal, it's with our dearth of wide receivers behind him, why not hang onto him for last season at least?  Just maybe, if we had hung onto him, Boldin might have decided another season catching passes while the #1CB works Sammy might be worthwhile.  Yes, we got a draft pick for Sammy...then we gave one up, plus a higher salary, when we traded for Benjamin.

 

I don't understand why folks are so unwilling to acknowledge that the Bills had choices.  Their choice was to let Woods and Goodwin walk, trade Sammy while he was still on his rookie deal, and instead sign Boldin, trade for Matthews, sign Holmes, Deonte Thompson, then trade for Benjamin last season; sign and release Kerley and Corey Coleman this season.

 

I don't think they thought they were gutting their receiver corps by doing that.   I mean, can you imagine it?  What GM talks to the owner and says "well yeah, none of our WR can get open or catch, our offense is struggling, and the ones we let walk are going like gangbusters for new teams but DAMN I saved cap!"  (I believe if you look at the salaries and cap hits of the players they had under contract or could have signed last year, you'll see they didn't save much money, either.  I'm not talking Sammy's big KC payday this year, I'm talking last)

 

The most logical explanation is that they thought they were signing or trading for equivalent or better WR talent.

They were mistaken.

 

All GMs hit on some moves, and whiff on others, but why can't we just look at it and say McBeane and company laid an egg here?

 

 

 

I thought Woods Rams deal at that time seemed like what it is - paying him like a solid to upper-eschalon #2 guy

Agree to disagree. 

I think they knew they were taking a step back. They knew paying high dollar for wide receivers isn’t wise when you have Tyrod. They used what they had to make trades and moves to get a QB finally and a LB. 

every guy you mentioned that was on the Bills is average. None of those are exceptional. Sammy makes an occasional special play, but he isn’t a top 25 wideout.  They might be better than what is in Buffalo today, but I think in two years we will see something different at wide receiver. 

[FearLess Price]

2 hours ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

Yeah, I'm glad we didn't waste, I mean spend, the money on Cousins.  I'm happy with JA so far.

 

Facts. We got a real QB with a stronger arm, and quick legs to beat teams through the air and on the ground how Cousins never could

 

 

16 hours ago, Teddy KGB said:

 

I expect an nfl wr to make that catch 95% of the time.   

 

 

 

Well theres your mistake breh. We dont have NFL WRs anymore. We got a TE Masquerading as a #1 WR who cant even remember the playbook, Drop zone jones, Ray Ray McDoesntGetOpeninRealGames, and OCs pet Rob dropkonski

7 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

...Woods: 5 years, $34 mil with $15 mil guaranteed.....Sammy: 3 years, $48 mil with $30 mil guaranteed....which would you prefer pound for pound?........

 

Sammy has more talent but Woods attitude makes him the better player. 

 

Until Watkins proves hes not injury prone, Ill take Woods.

[Gunsgoodtime]

17 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

ROTFLMAO!  Who's fault is that?????   Who didn't want/care that Goodwin or Woods re-signed?  Who drafted Zay Jones?  Who traded away Watkins and traded for Benjamin?  Who traded for Coleman rather than waiting for him to be cut and wasted $3.5 million in dead cap space?  Who collected the rest of the scrubs that make up the Bills WR corps?

 

You are just scratching the surface of the mistakes made.  

[Bing Bong]

In case y'all haven't noticed Reminder: ALL game discussion belongs in the game day topics

[Gunsgoodtime]

You dont let every good reciever from a team just poof their gone....and nothing happen

17 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

ROTFLMAO!  Who's fault is that?????   Who didn't want/care that Goodwin or Woods re-signed?  Who drafted Zay Jones?  Who traded away Watkins and traded for Benjamin?  Who traded for Coleman rather than waiting for him to be cut and wasted $3.5 million in dead cap space?  Who collected the rest of the scrubs that make up the Bills WR corps?

Lots of questions there

Edited September 28, 2018 by Gunsgoodtime

[Bill from NYC]

On ‎9‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 11:11 PM, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Really good receivers catch the ball with the same ease 50 yards downfield as they do 15.  

 

Back in the day the Bills could run Thurman Thomas on a wheel route and he could catch a deep throw like a WR.

 

McCoy and CJ Spiller are/were more dangerous on short throws than Thurman but their hands got harder every yard further they got downfield.

 

Foster is like our new Dan Brandenburg...........

Dan Brandenburg was the best preseason linebacker of all time. There was no stopping him on his way to the qb. He was very fast and even appeared strong. I was SO excited; I thought that we stole him in the draft!!!

 

In real games he was one of the worst I ever saw.