Jerome007 Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 A lot of us have high hope Josh Allen might at last be that all elusive “franchise QB” that would help the Bills be a winning team for years to come. And I’m one of them. But Rivers again dismantling the Bills have me realizing this: can anyone doubt he is a franchise, elite QB? His play and stats are amazing. While Peyton, Brady and Rodgers were the top guys, Brees and Rivers were certainly close and among a lot of the Top 5 for the last DECADE. Yet the Chargers made the playoffs only 5 times in the 14 seasons Rivers was there… Sobering fact you need more than a great QB, how much awesome it is. I think Rodgers is the best, yet the Packers success pales compare to the Cheatriots, and even to Manning’s Colts and Broncos. I’d take the Packers and Saints’ records and SB win over the Bills’ drought, but the point is that a great QB is not the complete answer. And some teams did win the Superbowl with “manager type” QBs. Anyway, even if just for entertainment’s sake, let’s hope Allen becomes a star! But that maybe not be the final piece of the puzzle, just a good chunk of it. 7
MJS Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 But it is the most important piece to the puzzle. And when you have a franchise guy you always know you have a chance. 8
White Linen Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 Rivers drought of ends shows us fans how this franchise needs more bricks to build our building taller and taller.
The Wiz Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 I'm drinking so take your sober post elsewhere. 7
Jerome007 Posted September 19, 2018 Author Posted September 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, The Wiz said: I'm drinking so take your sober post elsewhere. Drinking the Bills Koolaid? Watch out! It's addictive
The Wiz Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 If only. I would have told you you're dumb and you should feel dumb and everyone who read this thread is now dumber for reading it if that were the case. You're pointing out a scenario that I'm sure most bills fans would be happy with as a bad thing. Playoffs 5 times in 14 years vs playoffs 1 time in 18 years. Hard choice. 1 1
Bing Bong Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 You need a good GM. That's all there is to it. Somebody at the Chargers built a Superbowl conternder with Gates, Tomlinson, Rivers, and a solid defense.. Somebody at the Colts had Edgerrin James, Wayne, Harrison, and a solid defense. This guy for the saints has Kamara and Brees, and a solid defense. Brees could get a Superbowl with his current team. Point is nobody is ever going to be able to replicate the Patriots. It's been a staggeringly period of dominance. When you get a transcendent quarterback, you're getting there, but tough titties ya gotta have talent. And you don't even need the quarterback. You realize how different game manager quarterbacks were when they won a Superbowl young? Big Ben was along for the ride his first SB. Wilson, Brady, Eli. Then there's nerfed Peyton, an Eagles miracle. Brett Favre's SB winning team was absolutely loaded. Ole Dirty B could have ran for 1300 yards on that team. I don't know if you're talking sustained Superbowl success but it really comes down to a game managing QB, or a stud QB, and some very opportunistic rookie contracts. I think no matter what the window for success for any given team is very short and they need great drafts to be there. I'd say it's 70% drafting and 30% quarterbacking if you're married to winning with a HOF QB which isn't always necessary. 2
White Linen Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 If we haven't GM our Qb won't matter to build a team around him. Have we saw this done even in our division. You need more than just a QB.
reddogblitz Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 Last week the Titans beat the Texans. Sunshine Gabbert had 112 yards passing. Watson had 300+ yards. Sunshine's team won. QB is very important and the most important position etc., but it's far from being all you need.
KD in CA Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 Of course it's not just the QB. You need the GM to build the team -- but sometimes the team doesn't get over the hump (like all those Chargers teams earlier in Rivers career) You need the coach -- and not just a regular season coach, but a coach who can win the critical game, unlike Reid, Levy, Shotty, that idiot who blew the SB for Atlanta, etc. And you need the QB. So yeah, you need a lot to go right and it can still be derailed in a single elimination playoff tournament. On the other hand, if you have a decent team, QB and defense, you can get hot for a month and win a championship (Giants). 3
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 1 hour ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said: You need a good GM. That's all there is to it. Somebody at the Chargers built a Superbowl conternder with Gates, Tomlinson, Rivers, and a solid defense.. Somebody at the Colts had Edgerrin James, Wayne, Harrison, and a solid defense. This guy for the saints has Kamara and Brees, and a solid defense. Brees could get a Superbowl with his current team. Point is nobody is ever going to be able to replicate the Patriots. It's been a staggeringly period of dominance. When you get a transcendent quarterback, you're getting there, but tough titties ya gotta have talent. And you don't even need the quarterback. You realize how different game manager quarterbacks were when they won a Superbowl young? Big Ben was along for the ride his first SB. Wilson, Brady, Eli. Then there's nerfed Peyton, an Eagles miracle. Brett Favre's SB winning team was absolutely loaded. Ole Dirty B could have ran for 1300 yards on that team. I don't know if you're talking sustained Superbowl success but it really comes down to a game managing QB, or a stud QB, and some very opportunistic rookie contracts. I think no matter what the window for success for any given team is very short and they need great drafts to be there. I'd say it's 70% drafting and 30% quarterbacking if you're married to winning with a HOF QB which isn't always necessary. Getting performance out of very opportunistic rookie K’s is critical under the cap for a rebuilding franchise like us—with the salary cap constraints being what they are and Beane probably having to overpay the 2019 FA’s, maybe the Seahawks model when they started their run with Wilson on his rookie deal leaving space for paying a monster D and key offensive playmakers around him is the way to emulate?
Dr.Sack Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 The process > The QB. The process > The fans. The process = McD & Beane. 3
Bing Bong Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 10 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: Getting performance out of very opportunistic rookie K’s is critical under the cap for a rebuilding franchise like us—with the salary cap constraints being what they are and Beane probably having to overpay the 2019 FA’s, maybe the Seahawks model when they started their run with Wilson on his rookie deal leaving space for paying a monster D and key offensive playmakers around him is the way to emulate? Yeah we need all the cheap talented rookie contract K's we can get.. And emulating 2 consecutive Superbowl winning drafts is a good idea sure. What the hell are you talking about haha
MAJBobby Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Jerome007 said: A lot of us have high hope Josh Allen might at last be that all elusive “franchise QB” that would help the Bills be a winning team for years to come. And I’m one of them. But Rivers again dismantling the Bills have me realizing this: can anyone doubt he is a franchise, elite QB? His play and stats are amazing. While Peyton, Brady and Rodgers were the top guys, Brees and Rivers were certainly close and among a lot of the Top 5 for the last DECADE. Yet the Chargers made the playoffs only 5 times in the 14 seasons Rivers was there… Sobering fact you need more than a great QB, how much awesome it is. I think Rodgers is the best, yet the Packers success pales compare to the Cheatriots, and even to Manning’s Colts and Broncos. I’d take the Packers and Saints’ records and SB win over the Bills’ drought, but the point is that a great QB is not the complete answer. And some teams did win the Superbowl with “manager type” QBs. Anyway, even if just for entertainment’s sake, let’s hope Allen becomes a star! But that maybe not be the final piece of the puzzle, just a good chunk of it. Absolutely. So we need to be just like the Patriots START CHEATING, They do it yearly skirt the Salary Cap with Tom Brady yearly NOT paying him market value. However Owners invest in his businesses and pay TB12 $200 per physical therapy session (2015) for thier players. Edited September 19, 2018 by MAJBobby
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 1 minute ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said: Yeah we need all the cheap talented rookie contract K's we can get.. And emulating 2 consecutive Superbowl winning drafts is a good idea sure. What the hell are you talking about haha All I’m saying is look at the Seahawks since Wilson got paid—basically downhill ever since, but they were unstoppable when they had all the cap room in the world to work with before that. Of course, Cleveland has had all the cap room in the world for all of recent history and that hasn’t gotten them a W yet either, so maybe bad analogy, IDK. Just hoping we hit some gold with our cash in 2019.
Johnny Hammersticks Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Jerome007 said: A lot of us have high hope Josh Allen might at last be that all elusive “franchise QB” that would help the Bills be a winning team for years to come. And I’m one of them. But Rivers again dismantling the Bills have me realizing this: can anyone doubt he is a franchise, elite QB? His play and stats are amazing. While Peyton, Brady and Rodgers were the top guys, Brees and Rivers were certainly close and among a lot of the Top 5 for the last DECADE. Yet the Chargers made the playoffs only 5 times in the 14 seasons Rivers was there… Sobering fact you need more than a great QB, how much awesome it is. I think Rodgers is the best, yet the Packers success pales compare to the Cheatriots, and even to Manning’s Colts and Broncos. I’d take the Packers and Saints’ records and SB win over the Bills’ drought, but the point is that a great QB is not the complete answer. And some teams did win the Superbowl with “manager type” QBs. Anyway, even if just for entertainment’s sake, let’s hope Allen becomes a star! But that maybe not be the final piece of the puzzle, just a good chunk of it. YEAH
Bing Bong Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: All I’m saying is look at the Seahawks since Wilson got paid—basically downhill ever since, but they were unstoppable when they had all the cap room in the world to work with before that. Of course, Cleveland has had all the cap room in the world for all of recent history and that hasn’t gotten them a W yet either, so maybe bad analogy, IDK. Just hoping we hit some gold with our cash in 2019. I'd be the Seahawks in a hot minute. Reload through the draft. Doesn't matter how expensive Wilson is, if they had the exact same Wagner chancellor Sherman draft last year they'd be in the Superbowl in a year or 2
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted September 19, 2018 Posted September 19, 2018 4 minutes ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said: I'd be the Seahawks in a hot minute. Reload through the draft. Doesn't matter how expensive Wilson is, if they had the exact same Wagner chancellor Sherman draft last year they'd be in the Superbowl in a year or 2 Agreed—but their margin for error was narrowed a lot by Wilson K. You have no chance if your draft classes after don’t hit and no $ to plug holes in FA. I wonder if we will ever see QB money correction in our lifetimes? Rookie signings used to be going the same way before the new CBA. Maybe a new thread topic in there somewhere
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