Eric Wood says the culture is just fine in Buffalo and guys are really bought in

[apuszczalowski]

5 minutes ago, teef said:

I get what you’re saying, but really my only point was that a guy retiring, especially Davis, doesn’t have anything to do with the “culture”. He may feel he’s too beat up to exist like this for a year, but I certainly wouldn’t chalk it up to the coaches at this point. Davis has a Davis problem. 

Possibly, but Davis didnt have a problem or issue when he signed. Could have been that after being in the lockerroom and seeing this team just accept losing as a way of getting better in the future, he decided it wasnt worth continuing to do it so he decided instead of getting beaten up for a year for a team who's goal is not to win now, it's better to hang it up? This is the 3rd veteran player to come here since last training camp and after experiencing some time in the lockerroom has decided to abruptly retire (not counting Richie cause he is certifiably nuts, and Woods who was forced into retirement). Boldin expressed a desire to come back soon after to play for another team, only time will tell if it happens to Davis and the CB who retired this year 

[Reed83HOF]

1 hour ago, Peter said:

 

We will see how good his play calling is against the Vikings when the game is still on the line in the first half . . . .

You're an optimist I see. Giving us a half to hang in there with the game still on the line...  

[Virgil]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That's true, but the fact is, the Bills played better in the 2nd half after Vontae quit.

 

I challenge why they weren’t playing that way from the beginning.  

 

I think there’s some evidence out there of this team turning it on and off at times, if not whole games. We looked rough against the Ravens and our 3 blow out wins last season.  Definitely not a team playing with high intensity. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 minutes ago, Virgil said:

I challenge why they weren’t playing that way from the beginning.  

 

I think there’s some evidence out there of this team turning it on and off at times, if not whole games. We looked rough against the Ravens and our 3 blow out wins last season.  Definitely not a team playing with high intensity. 

 

I was thinking about that just now and yeah, that would be a fair question for someone to ask Wood:

-if the culture is just fine in Buffalo and guys are really bought in, why did it take 6 quarters for the defense to "show up"?

 

He wouldn't give a straight answer, no team guy is gonna publically throw the other side of the ball under the bus while he's sitting on the sideline.

But I'd love to hear what Mr "Give Back Some of that Money You Ain't F'ing Earned!" would say if he gave it straight.

[TH3]

2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

Love Eric Wood, but he's not exactly a neutral arbiter when it comes to the Bills.

 

So what EW said is not true and not evidenced by what happened on the field last year? 

 

Living by your avatar motto....

[teef]

13 minutes ago, apuszczalowski said:

Possibly, but Davis didnt have a problem or issue when he signed. Could have been that after being in the lockerroom and seeing this team just accept losing as a way of getting better in the future, he decided it wasnt worth continuing to do it so he decided instead of getting beaten up for a year for a team who's goal is not to win now, it's better to hang it up? This is the 3rd veteran player to come here since last training camp and after experiencing some time in the lockerroom has decided to abruptly retire (not counting Richie cause he is certifiably nuts, and Woods who was forced into retirement). Boldin expressed a desire to come back soon after to play for another team, only time will tell if it happens to Davis and the CB who retired this year 

i think it's far more on those guys than it was on the culture.  i'd even put it more on the staff for not possibly doing enough "research" on who they're signing.  

 

as count said, i'm sure if the bills were playoff bound davis would have stayed, but it's not like he took a good look at this team when he signed and saw the playoffs.  most didn't, yet he still signed.  the way he retired proves who he is as a person.  if he really did hate the staff, why not retire after the game and move on?

 

boldin is more or less in the same boat.  an older vet who didn't want to put up with it, and it i mean losing. didn't he only want to play with the pats?   a guy that age wants a ring, and the bills weren't getting it for him. 

 

i guess the better question is, what do people think is going on behind the scenes that's making players retire.  

Edited September 18, 2018 by teef

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, baskin said:

 

So what EW said is not true and not evidenced by what happened on the field last year? 

 

Living by your avatar motto....

 

Did you say last year?  Sorry,  I can't hear you. 

[Peter]

10 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

You're an optimist I see. Giving us a half to hang in there with the game still on the line...  

 

Ironically, the intent of my post was to contrast that with the play calling in just one half when the game essentially already was over and the Chargers had changed their approach.

[GoBills808]

6 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I was thinking about that just now and yeah, that would be a fair question for someone to ask Wood:

-if the culture is just fine in Buffalo and guys are really bought in, why did it take 6 quarters for the defense to "show up"?

 

He wouldn't give a straight answer, no team guy is gonna publically throw the other side of the ball under the bus while he's sitting on the sideline.

But I'd love to hear what Mr "Give Back Some of that Money You Ain't F'ing Earned!" would say if he gave it straight.

I think the playcalling of McDermott v Frazier makes enough of a difference there.

[EC-Bills]

2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That's true, but the fact is, the Bills played better in the 2nd half after Vontae quit.

So what you're saying is Vontae needs to come back and quit each game so the Bills play better.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

They are at two key positions. 

 

The “keyest” 

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, GoBills808 said:

I think the playcalling of McDermott v Frazier makes enough of a difference there.

 

We'll see how much of a difference it makes with regard to sustainability against both MIN and GB. 

[GoBills808]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

We'll see how much of a difference it makes with regard to sustainability against both MIN and GB. 

With McD's background, I feel pretty confident he's a better option calling plays. NFC experience, knows Lotulelei's game inside out, and understands how to use a super athletic MLB (albeit a much more polished one in Kuechly). 

 

I haven't actually gone and watched the first 6 quarters vs the last 2 with regards to the defensive personnel and looks, but they should not have been playing that poorly strictly from a matchup standpoint. Player for player they were underperforming. I would not be surprised at all to see that the playcalling was affecting performance.

[vorpma]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

Not even.  Reportedly the revolt happened before the Bengals game.

Where the hell are you getting this from?

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

With McD's background, I feel pretty confident he's a better option calling plays. NFC experience, knows Lotulelei's game inside out, and understands how to use a super athletic MLB (albeit a much more polished one in Kuechly). 

 

I haven't actually gone and watched the first 6 quarters vs the last 2 with regards to the defensive personnel and looks, but they should not have been playing that poorly strictly from a matchup standpoint. Player for player they were underperforming. I would not be surprised at all to see that the playcalling was affecting performance.

 

Certainly seems to have been a factor based on the much improved 2nd half performance.  We shall see with two of toughest challenges in the entire league in these next two road games.

[vorpma]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

Not even.  Reportedly the revolt happened before the Bengals game.

If a revolt happened it made NFL history, the first players revolt ever, before the third pre - season game: utter BS! 

[Doc]

16 minutes ago, vorpma said:

If a revolt happened it made NFL history, the first players revolt ever, before the third pre - season game: utter BS! 

 

Yup.

[WhoTom]

1 hour ago, CountDorkula said:

Why because I question whether or not Eric Wood really knows what is going on because you know he is not on the team and not involved in day to day activities.

 

No i would not because I dont beleive Eric Wood really knows what is going on. 

 

I changed careers a few months ago but I'm still friends with many of my old colleagues, so I'm well aware of what's going on in that organization. Even though I'm not involved in the day-to-day activities, I can accurately assess the relationship between the staff and the management.

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

56 minutes ago, teef said:

i think it's far more on those guys than it was on the culture.  i'd even put it more on the staff for not possibly doing enough "research" on who they're signing.  

 

as count said, i'm sure if the bills were playoff bound davis would have stayed, but it's not like he took a good look at this team when he signed and saw the playoffs.  most didn't, yet he still signed.  the way he retired proves who he is as a person.  if he really did hate the staff, why not retire after the game and move on?

 

The bolded text above is the part that concerns me most, because no team has enough cap space or draft picks (or hits on enough draft picks) to fill the roster.  But every position needs to be capably filled.  Teams rise or fall based upon the ability to find guys who can play on other team's PS or the cut-out bin, or as second-tier free agents.  And that ability must be based upon thorough, careful research and scouting.   Like him or don't, this is an area where Whaley and his staff did very well by the Bills.   Whaley's background of course was in pro personnel scouting

 

I could be wrong, but Beane's staff appears very superficial in that regard. 

 

I imagine the following conversations

(note: I'm picking on Dir Pro Pers Malik Boyd, but different teams split roles differently, so not sure he's the right guy.  Could be Dir Player Pers Dan Morgan or one of the Pro scouts in the lead role here)

 

Beane: We need a vet CB, who ya got?

Boyd: Sign Vontae Davis

Beane: Sell me

Boyd: Vontae Davis, Man.  Pro Bowl!  Had surgery, sure he's a risk, but Davis! Pro Bowl!

Beane: What if he can't come back to his prior form after the surgery?

Boyd: Pro bowl!  How often you sign those guys cheap off the street?  No risk no reward, right?

Beane: IN!

 

Beane: We need help at WR, who ya got?

Boyd: Trade for Corey Coleman.  Browns about to cut him, they'll let him go cheap

Beane: Sell me

Boyd: 15th pick of the draft, Man.  4.37 40.  Can't coach speed!  How often you pick that up for a 2020 7th?

Beane: What about his head?  I hear he's not in the playbook.  Maybe he's not our kinda guy.

Boyd: 4.37.  Besides, getting swapped sure to rattle his bones.  He'll come in hungry.  No Guts, No Glory - see what I did there?  Hungry?  Guts?

Beane: I see.  IN!

 

Overall, it fits Beane's drafting profile of liking to take shots on high ceiling/low floor riskier guys like Allen and Edmunds vs. filling his basket with more lower ceiling/high floor surer bet guys, and one can make an argument for it as a strategy to try to get the key pieces that pull a team over the top - but that argument doesn't apply when it comes to trying to backfill the roster.

 

2 hours ago, john wawrow said:

Here's a thought.

How is it that no one on the Bills staff had any inkling Vontae Davis was considering quitting.

Was there no red flag before the start of the season, when Davis suddenly revealed he was still trying to overcome an injury.

Was there no red flag during two preseason performance in which Davis couldn't tackle or cover.

Was there no red flag from last year in how Davis got into a major dispute with Chuck Pagano which led to the Colts cutting him.

 

Hey, I know there's some kind of nutty narrative in which the national media is questioning the Bills for making some odd decisions. But heck, what do i know.

 

Boo-Yah, JW

 

Though this makes me sad

[teef]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

The bolded text above is the part that concerns me most, because no team has enough cap space or draft picks (or hits on enough draft picks) to fill the roster.  But every position needs to be capably filled.  Teams rise or fall based upon the ability to find guys who can play on the practice chart or the cut-out bin, or as second-tier free agents.  And that ability must be based upon careful research and scouting.   Like him or don't, this is an area where Whaley and his staff did very well by the Bills.   Whaley's background of course was in pro personnel scouting

 

I could be wrong, but Beane's staff appears very superficial in that regard. 

 

I imagine the following conversations (note: I'm picking on DProP Malik Boyd, but different teams split roles differently, so not sure he's the right guy.  Could be DPlayerP Dan Morgan or one of the Pro scouts in the lead role here)

 

Beane: We need a vet CB, who ya got?

Boyd: Sign Vontae Davis

Beane: Sell me

Boyd: Vontae Davis, Man.  Pro Bowl!  Had surgery, sure he's a risk, but Davis! Pro Bowl!

Beane: What if he can't come back to his prior form after the surgery?

Boyd: Pro bowl!  How often you sign those guys cheap off the street?  No risk no reward, right?

Beane: IN!

 

Beane: We need help at WR, who ya got?

Boyd: Trade for Corey Coleman.  Browns about to cut him, they'll let him go cheap

Beane: Sell me

Boyd: 15th pick of the draft, Man.  4.37 40.  Can't coach speed!  How often you pick that up for a 7th?

Beane: What about his head?  I hear he's not in the playbook.  Maybe he's not our kinda guy.

Boyd: 4.37.  Besides, getting swapped sure to rattle his bones.  He'll come in hungry.  No Guts, No Glory - see what I did there?  Hungry?  Guts?

Beane: I see.  IN!

 

Overall, it fits Beane's drafting profile of liking to take shots on high ceiling/low floor riskier guys like Allen and Edmunds vs. filling his basket with more lower ceiling/high floor surer bet guys, and one can make an argument for it as a strategy to try to get the key pieces that pull a team over the top - but that argument doesn't apply when it comes to trying to backfill the roster.

this makes sense, and agreed that it's possibly a far bigger concern.  i'm not bent out of shape yet.  i think some of the signings were just patches, and others were made for the future that sure don't look like they're worth their investment at this point.  what happens this off season will be the defining mark for me.  they have picks and cap to work with.  i don't think there's enough there to create a world beater just yet, but i'd expect significant improvement in style of play and win total. if next year looks anything like this year, we're completely screwed as fans.