ddaryl Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: OK How can someone improve within their FIRST NFL start?? Can I ask did you Like Taylor? And one of your quotes "I want Great QB Play" Sorry if that is what you expected from a QBs 1st NFL start. how by getting better during the 2nd game I wasn't very fond of Taylor I do want great QB play, but would of been satisfied with some better on target thrwos in his debut. You can debate me all day long if you want but now your fishing for something out of me.. I walked away from Allen's 1st game concerned with his accuracy, his ability to scan the D pre-snap, and to find the open WR.. He struggled. So from here I hope he improves.... Just now, John from Riverside said: If what you are saying is that you dont want to crown Josh a franshise QB right now that is fair I think its a little unfair to get on a rookie QB making rookie mistakes when they are a rookie......lets keep in mind here that he isnt exactly walking into the best situation of a team around him helping HIM out......his legs saved a lot of sacks yesterday. Yes and thanks for the understanding I am not getting on him I am just calling it the way I saw it.... and yes at this junction I am concerned
Kelly the Dog Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, ddaryl said: I don't agree that our WR situation is that bad... it is not great but if your going to use WR as an excuse then I just don't agree.. WHAT?! Name one team with worse. Name one team whose #2 is Zay Jones. Name one team whose #3 is a ST guy. Name one team whose #4 is Udfa who didn’t start in college with suspect hands. Name one team without a #5 3 2
Dr. Who Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 1 minute ago, ddaryl said: not sure what context I HAVE to take. I made the observation based on professional football I don't agree that our WR situation is that bad... it is not great but if your going to use WR as an excuse then I just don't agree.. The OL looks bad that I agree.. I don't think you'll find many who agree our WR situation is not that bad. Some of the young players may develop, but right now, it's surely not good. Of course, no one can coerce anyone to form an opinion inclusive of factors they choose to leave out of their criteria. OTOH, you invite folks to discount your opinion for leaving out what appears to them important contextual elements.
MAJBobby Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, ddaryl said: how by getting better during the 2nd game I wasn't very fond of Taylor I do want great QB play, but would of been satisfied with some better on target thrwos in his debut. You can debate me all day long if you want but now your fishing for something out of me.. I walked away from Allen's 1st game concerned with his accuracy, his ability to scan the D pre-snap, and to find the open WR.. He struggled. So from here I hope he improves.... Yes and thanks for the understanding I am not getting on him I am just calling it the way I saw it.... and yes at this junction I am concerned Glad your "Concerned" after a first NFL Start, let me guess are you "Concerned" with Darnold after his game
ddaryl Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Dr. Who said: I don't think you'll find many who agree our WR situation is not that bad. Some of the young players may develop, but right now, it's surely not good. Of course, no one can coerce anyone to form an opinion inclusive of factors they choose to leave out of their criteria. OTOH, you invite folks to discount your opinion for leaving out what appears to them important contextual elements. yeah I am allowing WR's as an excuse to why many passes were inaccurate throws. If you are ok with that then fine I am not... 4 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: Glad your "Concerned" after a first NFL Start, let me guess are you "Concerned" with Darnold after his game I have no idea what Darnold did nor do I care. Why would I care ? why can't I be concerned why do you have to take my opinion so goddamn personal. I've adequately put forth my feeling and have not done anything else. Have not been rude to anybody nor have I devolved into calling people names. I simply stated my views after one game based on nothing else but my observations WHY WHY WHY is that hard for people to just accept and let it go. We all have opinions.. Edited September 17, 2018 by ddaryl
MAJBobby Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, ddaryl said: yeah I am allowing WR's as an excuse to why many passes were inaccurate throws. If you are ok with that then fine I am not... I have no idea what Darnold did nor do I care. Why would I care ? why can't I be concerned why do you have to take my opinion so goddamn personal. I've adequately put forth my feeling and have not done anything else. Have not been rude to anybody nor have I devolved into calling people names. I simply stated my views after one game based on nothing else but my observations WHY WHY WHY is that hard for people to just accept and let it go. We all have opinions.. You can have your opinion, just as those here have an opinion you are wrong and being overly critical of a Rookies first start, and think he is going to play like some 3+ year Vet
ddaryl Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 (edited) 1 minute ago, MAJBobby said: You can have your opinion, just as those here have an opinion you are wrong and being overly critical of a Rookies first start, and think he is going to play like some 3+ year Vet you have some serious forum issues you should deal with I never called out anybody else's opinion...... and I allowed others to have one.. You should try it Edited September 17, 2018 by ddaryl 1
Soda Popinski Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 I don't think Darnold/Allen is in any way a fair comparison, 2 years starting at USC vs 2 years at Wyoming. I know nobody likes excuses, he looked inaccurate and he loves to run to his right when he thinks there is trouble coming. The interior of the oline has given him happy feet and he's always looking to bail out of the pocket. He's got to learn to trust his protection and step up, not easy with Vlad and Miller in front of you. Piss poor running game doesn't help either.
Dr. Who Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 1 minute ago, ddaryl said: yeah I am allowing WR's as an excuse to why many passes were inaccurate throws. If you are ok with that then fine I am not... A false line of reasoning, imo. Porous o-line leads to duress and poor mechanics that affect accuracy. Relative lack of time working with the receiving corps means reduced chemistry, regardless of talent. Bad wrs mean tighter windows because of lack of separation. Lots of factors come into play. I don't think anyone is claiming Allen doesn't need development or that he didn't make mistakes or have inaccurate throws. However, many, taking into account the particular circumstances, have a more sanguine opinion. You're free to assert whatever you like. I am also free to think your opinion is more emotive than rational.
MAJBobby Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 1 minute ago, ddaryl said: you have some serious forum issues you should deal with I never called out anybody else's opinion...... and I allowed others to have one.. You should try it Really but you are not, People have an opinion on your opinion and you get all but hurt about it, and I am the one with issues?
ddaryl Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 1 minute ago, Dr. Who said: A false line of reasoning, imo. Porous o-line leads to duress and poor mechanics that affect accuracy. Relative lack of time working with the receiving corps means reduced chemistry, regardless of talent. Bad wrs mean tighter windows because of lack of separation. Lots of factors come into play. I don't think anyone is claiming Allen doesn't need development or that he didn't make mistakes or have inaccurate throws. However, many, taking into account the particular circumstances, have a more sanguine opinion. You're free to assert whatever you like. I am also free to think your opinion is more emotive than rational. OK Just now, MAJBobby said: Really but you are not, People have an opinion on your opinion and you get all but hurt about it, and I am the one with issues? I am not hurt I am only replying to people who have quoted me Where have I been hurt.. Just answering the quotes
Gugny Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 40 minutes ago, ddaryl said: I thought he looked real shaky throwing the ball. Very inaccurate, not leading receivers.. Hoping this gets better but I am very concerned at this junction Ok Joe you laughed at this but the video shows a QB who was exactly this. I watched it more than once.. 2 really bad INt's, not leading WRs who were clearly open.. left wide open Wr's a few times while he focused on one side of the field What, exactly, do you expect from a kid making his first NFL start?
MAJBobby Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, ddaryl said: OK I am not hurt I am only replying to people who have quoted me Where have I been hurt.. Just answering the quotes Quote yeah I am allowing WR's as an excuse to why many passes were inaccurate throws. If you are ok with that then fine I am not... I have no idea what Darnold did nor do I care. Why would I care ? why can't I be concerned why do you have to take my opinion so goddamn personal. I've adequately put forth my feeling and have not done anything else. Have not been rude to anybody nor have I devolved into calling people names. I simply stated my views after one game based on nothing else but my observations WHY WHY WHY is that hard for people to just accept and let it go. We all have opinions.. Post sure seems butt hurt
ddaryl Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 Just now, Gugny said: What, exactly, do you expect from a kid making his first NFL start? I have mentioned this but here it is again More accuracy especially to the 2 throws to wide open WR's where the ball was thrown low and behind. Of the 2 INT's one was very ill advised throw and the other was very underthrown. I can accept INT's but the 2 he threw were very bad decisions IMO, and both very preventable. He needs to identify matchups better.. This is something that can happen with experience, but he did miss a few wide open receivers while scanning only 1 side of the field. Just now, MAJBobby said: Post sure seems butt hurt Last word
John from Riverside Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, ddaryl said: I have mentioned this but here it is again More accuracy especially to the 2 throws to wide open WR's where the ball was thrown low and behind. Of the 2 INT's one was very ill advised throw and the other was very underthrown. I can accept INT's but the 2 he threw were very bad decisions IMO, and both very preventable. He needs to identify matchups better.. This is something that can happen with experience, but he did miss a few wide open receivers while scanning only 1 side of the field. There are things that come into play when identifying these things On some of those throws where he missed open receivers.....he had immediate pressure in his face.....the commentator for the bills game was driving me nuts with his over anaylztion of Josh's throws...... "He really needs to take some chances" "He really should have not thrown that ball" WTF "There was a receiver open" (totally dismissing the fact that he had free pass rusher bearing down on him on the play There were things that Josh didnt do in the game that were on him.....but you can easily contribute those things to being a rookie.....rookies dont play like vet guys most of the time.
colin Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 To me, Allen was playing sand lot football. Just holding the ball, running around and trying to find an open guy. I think being able to actually execute the offensive scheme will make him much more effective, and that's going to take time and some of his teammates winning matchups, which isn't likely next week vs Minni. I think Allen getting like 4 total days of team one reps prior to last week put him behind where he is supposed to be. If he was made starter right away he'd be miles ahead of where he is right now. He'll get there
MAJBobby Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 6 minutes ago, ddaryl said: I have mentioned this but here it is again More accuracy especially to the 2 throws to wide open WR's where the ball was thrown low and behind. Of the 2 INT's one was very ill advised throw and the other was very underthrown. I can accept INT's but the 2 he threw were very bad decisions IMO, and both very preventable. He needs to identify matchups better.. This is something that can happen with experience, but he did miss a few wide open receivers while scanning only 1 side of the field. Last word And how do we know that half field reads where NOT the design of this offense this week for the rookie QB? now the two picks. 1st Bad decision, bet he doesn't make it again, but was trying to make a play. He will learn throw it away and fight next down (Rookie Mistake) 2nd Bad trajectory, that play needed to be lofted, not rifled in there, will he learn I am sure he will he needs to learn touch. Now the accuracy - how can someone expect more accuracy from a QB that had accuracy issues in college, learning and creating new movement to muscle memory in his 1st NFL start while under siege most of the first half?
ddaryl Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 1 minute ago, John from Riverside said: There are things that come into play when identifying these things On some of those throws where he missed open receivers.....he had immediate pressure in his face.....the commentator for the bills game was driving me nuts with his over anaylztion of Josh's throws...... "He really needs to take some chances" "He really should have not thrown that ball" WTF "There was a receiver open" (totally dismissing the fact that he had free pass rusher bearing down on him on the play There were things that Josh didnt do in the game that were on him.....but you can easily contribute those things to being a rookie.....rookies dont play like vet guys most of the time. I hope he gets much better quickly. His inaccuracy was a concern, and a concern we have all had the moment he was drafted. I saw inaccuracy a little too often and it worries me at this junction .
Kelly the Dog Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 (edited) We have to look at this guy differently. To get 50 yards from a normal QB, you may get completions of 3,5, 8,10, and 24. Just a random sampling. For Josh, you are going to get maybe 3, 7, 10, and 30. It will be a lot less in completion percentage but the same number of yards. Some will argue you need those smaller ones to get first downs and keep the chains moving. But 8 yard completions on 3rd and 10 or more lead to punts, and this particular Bills team, with crappy blocking and a lot of penalties, means a lot of long down and distance plays. He made a lot of bad throws and decisions but he made a lot of very good ones, too. In his first game, and without a lot of time spent with the ones, against a very good veteran team, immediately down by 1-2-3-4 touchdowns. Edited September 17, 2018 by Kelly the Dog 1
eball Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 57 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said: If you want to not like him there is plenty here to reinforce it. If you want to like him there is just as much to think he can or will be very good. There were five really great throws. There were five really bad ones. There were not guys wide open very much at all. He got very little help. Fosters two plays were very good. That mini pass showed great awareness and speed. Then excellent diving catch. The two INTs were very bad. He’s going to learn not to throw first I assume. I love how he stands in there though. He wasn’t nervous I don’t think. He just needs game action so it slows down for him, some blocking and some WR. Daboll had some decent play design. Well said. This game won't change the opinion of anyone already firmly established in either the "Josh sucks" or "Josh will be great" camps. And yet it was still light years beyond the Peterman Principle. 1
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