NoHuddleKelly12 Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 10 minutes ago, TheElectricCompany said: A veteran may not be a good coach, nor is it their job. All true; however, when it does happen, and it clicks (e.g., Mahomes telling Peter King that Alex Smith's willingness to mentor/share his knowledge of what it takes to make it in the league being absolutely the foundation for Mahomes' blowing up so far this year) it absolutely gives the young pup a leg up as opposed to having to reinvent the wheel for himself through trial and error on the fly only.
Cotton Fitzsimmons Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 (edited) YE OLE was definitely against the Allen pick when it happened. Everything we heard about this guy was that he needed at least a year, if not 2 years, just to sit and learn. And even then, we were told he couldn’t hit the broad side of a barn. All of that said, for his first start in only the second game of his rookie year, he looked extremely competent. Based on what we were told about Allen before the draft, yesterday should’ve been a recipe for a real debacle from Allen. Despite all of his detractors, nobody really questioned his supreme physical talent. If he can look competent this early into his career with all of the nonsense going on with this offense, he has a chance to be very good. Edited September 17, 2018 by Cotton Fitzsimmons 3
rodneykm Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 For the kid to be in the situation he has been forced into this year, he played really well. I was very impressed and honestly think we've FINALLY got our guy.
Batman1876 Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 Having a vet to "guide" you is a myth. That is the coaching staff's Job. In some cases the vet is more detrimental to the rookie than he is helpful, because vets are often hostile towards the rookie who they are supposed to train to replace them. 1
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 13 minutes ago, PeterDude said: I will say one thing about Allen. He doesn't get that deer in headlights happy feet stuff. He doesn't even get the white faced pre-game puke face that Kelly used to get. So things are looking up I guess! Good point--Kelly himself said he could never get ready to start a game without tossing his cookies as a necessary "nerves" pregame ritual--I bet the only times he didn't do that were the last 3 of the SB's (played decent enough to have won XXV), lol.
Kwai San Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 More to the point - how about NOT letting him get sacked 5+ times a game???? 2 were on him I left, 3 were LOOK OUT JOSH! At some point the kid ain't gonna get up again.....
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 (edited) 43 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said: Ok I watched the Bills Yesterday and here is my impression on Allen: 1. Accuracy : for me this was tough to judge, because of the drops (I think like 5?) and an O line that had him running for his life most of the day, and when he did have time I didn’t see many Bills receivers running wide open. 2. Toughness: I define toughness as keep fighting no matter how bad it looks. I think Allen showed a lot of this yesterday. Dislike being down 28-3 he kept fighting and never stopped. Yes they lost but that will help him a lot when they finally have an O around him. 3. Overall Performance — Again hard judge because outside of McCoy I don’t see one player on that O that any D would be afraid to go 1 on 1 with. I saw little separation from any WR and the O line acted like Matadors most of the game. my overall opinion — I like Allen I think he will be at worse an average starting QB given the proper supporting cast and at best a top 6 or 7 QB. so in other words this year may be tough to watch, but you have IMO the most important piece at QB and now need get an Oline and maybe a defense so he doesn’t have to do it all by himself. #3 - there were a number of plays with guys wide open I'd call that separation. Josh needs to relax a bit and "not try to hard" (aka panic) to make a play. He's a rookie and that should develop with time. which also accounts for this - Josh needs to learn to throw the ball away to avoid the sack. Edited September 17, 2018 by ShadyBillsFan 1
Cugalabanza Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 Maybe the more serious problem is the backup QB situation. Josh is in a precarious position, taking lots of hits, not well protected at all and having to run for first downs more than anyone is comfortable with. And still Peterman is the only alternative. Something needs to be done about that.
BillsFan130 Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 26 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: Yea that is where I am too. I'd give him about a 6.5/10 for yesterday and I pretty much agree with Coach Tuesday's list of positives and negatives. It was up and down, very mixed, but some good grounds for encouragement. The kid makes some sensational throws. He always did in college too. There are still too many throws that to quote McDermott "he'd want to have back" but look for a first start, against a decent team, on a bad offense that was promising. Ya 100 percent agreed
MAJBobby Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 Here is my take on him after his first week. Negatives: 1. Pre Snap reads, they are not there yet, just having a horrible time seeing the blitz and adjusting from there. 2. Touch - Needs to find some, not everything needs to be that Fast Ball. A touch pass to Clay doesn't get broken up in the seam. 3. Learn to slide, though I do like the competitiveness 4. processing time - Needs to get ball out faster. 5. Mechanics / Accuracy - it seems he regressed a bit (which can be understandable) though I have more worries here with Culley stalling his progress he has made with Palmer 6. Decisions made some very poor and rookie choices, however that is also because he was trying to make a play I think Positives: 1. Competitive and Leadership Qualities his going to the defense after the Ivory TD is what you want to see here. 2. Better athlete than I though he was running the ball 3. Arm is there, can make every throw 4. Looked the part, like it wasn't too big for him ala Peterman Overall it was a good week, not great but not bad. Put it this way his play isn't going to be the bad story lines about this week. 1
TheElectricCompany Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: All true; however, when it does happen, and it clicks (e.g., Mahomes telling Peter King that Alex Smith's willingness to mentor/share his knowledge of what it takes to make it in the league being absolutely the foundation for Mahomes' blowing up so far this year) it absolutely gives the young pup a leg up as opposed to having to reinvent the wheel for himself through trial and error on the fly only. I'm sure it helped, but the KC situation is going to be damn near impossible to replicate. Mahomes got to sit an entire season behind a very competent veteran. He has a head coach with an extremely impressive resume of developing QBs and playcalling. He has top tier playmakers at WR, TE and RB. His OL is quite good. Right now, Allen has none of that. 1
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 6 minutes ago, rodneykm said: For the kid to be in the situation he has been forced into this year, he played really well. I was very impressed and honestly think we've FINALLY got our guy. And really, could he face any stiffer D competition than what he's about to walk into next week in Minnesota?? If he survives that rogues' shooting gallery upright behind the current O-line, doesn't lose his mind or throw a half dozen picks, his probability meter for future of this franchise will take off at "transwarp" speed (did I just out myself as an irredeemable Trekkie nerd?) 4 minutes ago, TheElectricCompany said: I'm sure it helped, but the KC situation is going to be damn near impossible to replicate. Mahomes got to sit an entire season behind a very competent veteran. He has a head coach with an extremely impressive resume of developing QBs and playcalling. He has top tier playmakers at WR, TE and RB. His OL is quite good. Right now, Allen has none of that. Sadly, also true 1
BillsFan130 Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 1 minute ago, ShadyBillsFan said: which also accounts for this - Josh needs to learn to throw the ball away to avoid the sack. Ya he definitely held on the ball too long on many plays. He will need to learn to throw it away so he can avoid sacks/getting his body destroyed, and potential interceptions
dave mcbride Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 17 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: I wasn’t an Allen guy. I really, really liked what I saw from him. I was OK with the pick because I figured I didn't know enough, but the accuracy issues yesterday alarmed me. He was all over the place. Some passes were on target, but you can say that about any qb -- some passes will always find the target (law of averages and all), even for the least accurate qbs. You also always hear that accuracy can't be taught, and given his college accuracy issues, that concerns me. That said, Bortles (very inaccurate early on) has clearly improved, so we should really give him a lot of time -- as in 3-4 years before determining whether he's a franchise qb or not. (Plus I couldn't help but compare him with Rivers, one of my favorite QBs of this century in terms of his game.) Allen's arm strength is breathtaking, and he's a good athlete. I'm also less worried about the obviously poor footwork because that can be taught. The thing to bear in mind is that for most QBs, even blue chip prospects, it takes time. Making snap judgments after one start is a fool's errand, although I realize I don't need to tell you that! I will continue to pay attention to the accuracy issue, though.
dlonce Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 Once he really learns to read NFL defenses,sees it all and is able to go through progressions he will be fine. Hes behind the so called eight ball because of the team that surrounds him, and the lack of consistent mentoring a veteran QB can supply. Hes not in the optimal position,unlike Mahommes. His ability to learn and apply is paramount.
TheElectricCompany Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 Just now, dlonce said: Once he really learns to read NFL defenses,sees it all and is able to go through progressions he will be fine. That is literally the hardest thing for QBs to learn.
quinnearlysghost88 Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 i love that he got a full game with lots of different situations that he can watch on film and recall, and understand what to do better the next time. this is much better than learning on the sidelines. you can tell he wanted a few of those back, and hopefully he adjusts and learns.
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 19 hours ago, Success said: I don’t care how this sounds. It reminded me a lot of Kelly’s first game. Definitely the toughness and no-quit attitude (unlike he who will not be named but decided that one half of ball should equal one whole game check) parts, and howitzer for an arm; as for the overall stats, Kelly threw 3 TD's that day, but also had the benefit of being a 26 yr old rookie who'd just left the USFL after throwing for ridiculous yardage and TD's 2 straight years--so had a ton more reps coming in. At the end of the day, we should be so lucky if JA approaches what JK gave this franchise for 10 years. But it's the most optimistic I've felt about the Bills' QB position since Flutie Flakes were on the shelf. I still have an unopened box, maybe I'll break the seal if Allen becomes the real deal. 1
RochesterRob Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 58 minutes ago, Ramza86 said: Yeah im ok with this. This offense will do him zero favors...footwork and accuracy to me are going to be problems he wont fix this year. Just because of the oline and broken pockets they consistently give him. Mental clock, presnap, stepping up..that stuff will come with experience. if he is good enough to learn it. Hopefully, this is where his willingness to learn comes in. Most prospects with those dings are noted as being non-learners in that what you see is what you are going to have. Obviously, willingness does not always translate into accomplishments but I am confident the kid can learn at this point.
PatsFanNH Posted September 17, 2018 Posted September 17, 2018 49 minutes ago, billsbackto81 said: Top 6 or 7 you say? Brady Rodgers Brees Wilson Big Ben Rivers Ryan If he falls in to a category that falls within these guys you will not find any complaints from Bills fans. Well in his prime I’d say Brady,Brees, and Big Ben def be off that list and retired.
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