Fezmid Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 283095[/snapback] If you're saying that the husband is contradicting himself, and therefore can't be believed, how can you believe the charges against Jackson? There's been tons of contradictions in that case as well. CW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Chris, I believe in the value of life. You probably will never sway me from that. 283034[/snapback] Believe you me, I'm not trying to do that. But I do know that I would rather be dead than in a PVS, so I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think that others would feel the same. I also believe that if God forbid my Teresa were to end up in a PVS, I would do everything within my power and as long as it took to end her suffering and send her on her way home, regardless of the thoughts and opinion of chuckleheads who felt they knew her, what she wanted, or what my motivation might be, as she's told me that's what she'd want, so I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think that another man would do the same for his wife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRC Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 If you're saying that the husband is contradicting himself, and therefore can't be believed, how can you believe the charges against Jackson? There's been tons of contradictions in that case as well. CW 283097[/snapback] Ummm...no. I said that he contradicted himself so I don't know what to believe. Hence the statement, "Which do we believe?" I thought it was pretty clear, but I guess "Which do we believe?" automatically means guilty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Ummm...no. I said that he contradicted himself so I don't know what to believe. Hence the statement, "Which do we believe?" I thought it was pretty clear, but I guess "Which do we believe?" automatically means guilty. 283102[/snapback] Sorry; I've heard others in the media say that he's contradicted himself and therefore he's just trying to get the money, and made the asumption that's what you were saying. I appologize. CW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Believe you me, I'm not trying to do that. But I do know that I would rather be dead than in a PVS, so I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think that others would feel the same. I also believe that if God forbid my Teresa were to end up in a PVS, I would do everything within my power and as long as it took to end her suffering and send her on her way home, regardless of the thoughts and opinion of chuckleheads who felt they knew her, what she wanted, or what my motivation might be, as she's told me that's what she'd want, so I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think that another man would do the same for his wife. 283100[/snapback] And yet, we hear that she "won't suffer" when the feeding tube is pulled. So if she wouldn't suffer the pain of starvation, how can one say that she was suffering before the tube was removed? Doesn't that then obviate the need for pulling the plug? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 And yet, we hear that she "won't suffer" when the feeding tube is pulled. So if she wouldn't suffer the pain of starvation, how can one say that she was suffering before the tube was removed? Doesn't that then obviate the need for pulling the plug? 283111[/snapback] Being trapped in a non-functioning body and brain sounds like the worst suffering I can imagine, especially for someone who believes in an afterlife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Being trapped in a non-functioning body and brain sounds like the worst suffering I can imagine, especially for someone who believes in an afterlife. 283114[/snapback] But if she's a vegetable, does she even know she's trapped? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 And yet, we hear that she "won't suffer" when the feeding tube is pulled. So if she wouldn't suffer the pain of starvation, how can one say that she was suffering before the tube was removed? Doesn't that then obviate the need for pulling the plug? 283111[/snapback] It's the same reason I prayed for my mom to die after she was reduced to a PVS after complications from the removal of a brain tumor. Luckily, it didn't take her long to go "home." In PVS cases, the suffering may not be pain and anguish, but it involves a situation where being alive isn't living. I believe that my mother would be better off in the company of God in heaven than being kept alive here without really living. I generally don't throw my faith around because it's my personal relationship with God, but that's what I meant, not only in the hypothetical about my Teresa, but in the cases of Theresa Schiavo, my mother, and all PVS patients, provided "going home" was their wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 But if she's a vegetable, does she even know she's trapped? 283116[/snapback] Exactly. What if you're prolonging her imprisonment in this body, rather than sending her to her better reward? Again, the people closest to her know best what she would have wanted, and unfortuately, they are on opposite sides. One thing is certain: you have no idea what she wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 It's the same reason I prayed for my mom to die after she was reduced to a PVS after complications from the removal of a brain tumor. Luckily, it didn't take her long to go "home." In PVS cases, the suffering may not be pain and anguish, but it involves a situation where being alive isn't living. I believe that my mother would be better off in the company of God in heaven than being kept alive here without really living. I generally don't throw my faith around because it's my personal relationship with God, but that's what I meant, not only in the hypothetical about my Teresa, but in the cases of Theresa Schiavo, my mother, and all PVS patients, provided "going home" was their wish. 283131[/snapback] Chris, I know this doesn't apply to your situation, but if someone has a "living will" that basically forces you to be assisted in your suicide, then you would not be forgiven, and would not go see God. So what one looks forward to is not a better life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Exactly. What if you're prolonging her imprisonment in this body, rather than sending her to her better reward? Again, the people closest to her know best what she would have wanted, and unfortuately, they are on opposite sides. One thing is certain: you have no idea what she wanted. 283132[/snapback] Or she could be screaming out DON'T KILL ME!! It never hurt to err on the side of caution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Or she could be screaming out DON'T KILL ME!! It never hurt to err on the side of caution. 283139[/snapback] You don't know which is the side of caution. Tortorous imprisonment for the remainder of her heartbeats, or releasing her to death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 You don't know which is the side of caution. Tortorous imprisonment for the remainder of her heartbeats, or releasing her to death. 283165[/snapback] You phrase it like she's suffering. YOU DON'T KNOW THAT. For all we know, PVS could be blissful, peaceful. If it was, then it would be CRIMINAL to kill her. Let's just agree to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Chris, I know this doesn't apply to your situation, but if someone has a "living will" that basically forces you to be assisted in your suicide, then you would not be forgiven, and would not go see God. So what one looks forward to is not a better life. 283136[/snapback] That's a specific belief in whatever *your* faith is. I'll tell you that when my (then 79 year old) grandmother, a life-long Catholic who was married to the same man for more than 50 years, went in for the operation that sent her into a PVS, she made it very clear that we were not to let her live machine-assisted. Her husband, my grandfather, and the love of her life, had died years before, and she missed him dearly. Anyway, her operation went awry, and she was left in a PVS. I refuse to believe that when we acted according to her very specific wishes, and turned off the machines, that we sent her to hell. But that's what you believe. Faith is strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Chris, I know this doesn't apply to your situation, but if someone has a "living will" that basically forces you to be assisted in your suicide, then you would not be forgiven, and would not go see God. So what one looks forward to is not a better life. 283136[/snapback] What if a Priest gave absolution prior to death? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 What if a Priest gave absolution prior to death? 283179[/snapback] You have to ask for absolution, and it is difficult to ask for forgiveness from suicide. Terri is a Catholic and therefore suicide in the Catholic faith is a one way ticket to hell. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Chris, I know this doesn't apply to your situation, but if someone has a "living will" that basically forces you to be assisted in your suicide, then you would not be forgiven, and would not go see God. So what one looks forward to is not a better life. 283136[/snapback] I won't argue issues of faith because it's deeply personal and strictly between that individual and God. That being said, I can't say I maintain that belief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsNYC Posted March 22, 2005 Author Share Posted March 22, 2005 Thank god...they're going to let her die! Even Bill O'Reilly is for letter her die! http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,151122,00.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 You have to ask for absolution, and it is difficult to ask for forgiveness from suicide. Terri is a Catholic and therefore suicide in the Catholic faith is a one way ticket to hell. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. 283186[/snapback] http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article....RTICLE_ID=35156 Looks like Terry wont get to collect $200, because of the Gov. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsNYC Posted March 22, 2005 Author Share Posted March 22, 2005 You have to ask for absolution, and it is difficult to ask for forgiveness from suicide. Terri is a Catholic and therefore suicide in the Catholic faith is a one way ticket to hell. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. 283186[/snapback] Suicide is taking one's OWN life. God is not keeping her alive, a machine is. Leave the machine off and see if God wants her to live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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