What areas of the team has Beane actually improved?

[Gordio]

30 minutes ago, Peter said:

 

I actually think it was the opposite.

 

I think Whaley worked behind the scenes to undermine Rex.

 

Karma is a B word. That ended up blowing up in his face. 

 

 

Possibly but keep in mind Whaley never wanted to hire RR in the first place so he was undermine first.  A GM should never be force to hire a HC he does not want.  That is not how it is suppose to work.  

[C.Biscuit97]

Whaley was a much better GM than many fans want to give him credit for.  Never got to pick his coaches and we had some real talent on this team.  I think him and McDermott would have been a great combo.  Now, McDermott just has a puppet GM.  

 

It it all comes down to Allen.  But offensive, this is a very uninspiring unit and it has been for two years.  Going to be some Jauron specials this year.

[Formerly Allan in MD]

On 8/26/2018 at 11:18 PM, Hapless Bills Fan said:

It is yet to be determined if Beane will be as successful in bringing in talent.... Vlad Ducasse, Russ Bodine, Mike Tolbert, Jordan Matthews, and Vonte Davis leave me underwhelmed so far. 

Trent Murphy

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

11 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

So the heroes of last couple of weeks...Allen, McD, and Beane...are now the scapegoats after a pitiful OL performance this week?

 

Got it.  Board still as over reacting as always and in full mid season form I see.  

 

Beane is a witch, get on bored before he trades you to a different message board.

 

This is almost miraculous, I'm on the same page as A-Dawg and domdab99 this year.

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Mango said:

 

Pitiful OL performance all pre season. After a season of varied results, mostly bolstered by the performance of the left side of the line. 

 

I think the larger gripe is that the FO has literally been preaching for us to trust them. Now 15 months into the job, we are seeing the results of their trust. They lost 2 pro bowl lineman, with a terrible right side, and traded away another talented (albeit injured) LT, and made no real attempt to fortify those positions, we should “trust” them. 

 

Since Beane took over, virtually EVERY SINGLE position on this roster is worse than the day he started. In 15 months it’s not crazy for us to expect some position to be better. Allen might be the guy. MIGHT. Which is fine, swing for your QB, but you can get better elsewear. Same with Edmunds. He might be better than Preston Brown, but he’s leading a LB corps that is under performaing last years group. 

 

QB- Worse (today)

RB- Same. Although Murphy looks good.

FB- Same

WR1- Same (not good enough)

WR2- Same (Zay- not good enough)

TE- Same 

LT- Same

LG- Worse

C- Worse

RG- Same (bad)

RT- Same (bad)

 

LDE- Same 

DT- Same

DT- Worse (sorry Dareus is better) 

RDE- Same (until Trent proves otherwise/healthy and currently not good enough)

 

OLB-Same (not god enough)

MLB-Same (that’s being generous)

OLB- Same (not good enough)

 

CB1- Same

CB2- Worse

Safeties- Same

CB3- Worse

 

I was going to respond to this, but honestly its just a terrible assessment of each position and would take too long.  So we will just have to agree to disagree.  

[Mango]

8 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I was going to respond to this, but honestly its just a terrible assessment of each position and would take too long.  So we will just have to agree to disagree.  

 

How about a simple, where am I wrong?  I can’t find a single position, that as of today, is going to be better in 2018 than it was in 2017. 

 

Edmunds might. Maybe Allen turns it on. Hence I marked today. I also just looked at the starters, not total depth, which it seems might apply to WR3+ or RB2+. But starters for this year? As of August 28, I don’t see it. 

[reddogblitz]

6 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

Agreed.  Let's see what happens.  The sky was falling this time last year as well.

 

Sky was also falling in 2014 after the 3rd pre season game debacle at home at the hands of the Josh McCown led Clowns.  We went on to go 9-7 notching our first winning season in 10 years.

 

Earth to TBD - Pre season means nothing.

[Alphadawg7]

28 minutes ago, reddogblitz said:

 

Sky was also falling in 2014 after the 3rd pre season game debacle at home at the hands of the Josh McCown led Clowns.  We went on to go 9-7 notching our first winning season in 10 years.

 

Earth to TBD - Pre season means nothing.

 

Would also add that the Winless Detroit Lions were 4-0 that preseason.  

[Keukasmallies]

On 8/27/2018 at 9:58 AM, MJS said:

 

They literally played their way in. They won 9 games.

 

Yes they did.  If the Bengals had lost, would the Bills have been in the playoffs with those nine wins?

[BuffaloHokie13]

6 minutes ago, Keukasmallies said:

 

Yes they did.  If the Bengals had lost, would the Bills have been in the playoffs with those nine wins?

If the NFL did a 10 team playoff instead of a 12 team playoff would the Falcons have made the playoffs?

[reddogblitz]

13 minutes ago, Keukasmallies said:

 

Yes they did.  If the Bengals had lost, would the Bills have been in the playoffs with those nine wins?

 

If my Aunt had balls she'd be my Uncle.

 

Bills made the playoffs. Deal with it.

[dubs]

It really amazes me how shortsighted fans on this board are. I guess it makes some sense because if the Bills fail those fans can pull an I told you so, and if they succeed they can enjoy the run. It’s the classic difference between being a critic from afar or being in the circumstance and actually having your career dependent on your success. 

 

This regime, rightly in my opinion, made an assessment that the best case scenario for the Bills when they came on board was a wild card team that would get bounced in the playoffs. They also made an assessment, again, rightly in my opinion, that to increase the potential they needed to make some pretty big changes. Things that involved salary cap, draft picks, and paying the right players to be cornerstone pieces to the franchise. They also needed a legit QB. It seems pretty obvious to me their assessment has been right, that they have a vision, and are working toward that vision. This is entirely different and refreshing from previous FOs. 

 

Ultimately, they may come up short, and that will deserve criticism. But until that point I don’t see how anyone can truly be unhappy with the direction of this franchise. 

26 minutes ago, Keukasmallies said:

 

Yes they did.  If the Bengals had lost, would the Bills have been in the playoffs with those nine wins?

 

You should realize that just because the Bengals beating the Ravens happened on the last play of the regular season doesn’t mean any more than the other 6 losses the Ravens has that year or the other 9 wins the Bills had that year. It was more dramatic and fun that way, but if that game happened in September instead you wouldn’t be bringing it up. 

 

Bottom line: Bills made the playoff because they had one of the 6 best records including tiebreakers, in the AFC. What so complicated about that. 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

1 hour ago, Mango said:

 

How about a simple, where am I wrong?  I can’t find a single position, that as of today, is going to be better in 2018 than it was in 2017. 

 

Edmunds might. Maybe Allen turns it on. Hence I marked today. I also just looked at the starters, not total depth, which it seems might apply to WR3+ or RB2+. But starters for this year? As of August 28, I don’t see it. 

 

Mango, 

 

I agree with this assessment. To me, its not a indictment of Beane's team building ability just yet, it's too early. 

 

Beane purged the roster of most Whaley staples - Dareus (1st Round), Watkins (1st Round), Ragland (2nd Round), Darby (2nd Round), Glenn (2nd Round), Tyrod (3 year starter). Regular football attrition has led to other loses - Preston Brown (3rd Round), Incognito (Pro Bowl with Bills), Wood (1st Round). That's a lot of talent to leave your organization, with their replacements being mostly spent to move up in the Draft to acquire Allen and Edmunds.

 

Ultimately, Beane and McDermott made the Playoffs in 2017, and that buys them goodwill for 2018. But by 2019, Allen needs to be starting and the football team needs to be built around him. Better WRs are required, more options at Tight End, a real backup RB, a new LG, RG, RT, maybe LT? Kyle Williams is near the end, and though Harrison Phillips was drafted, there is nothing behind him as Washington is a fringe NFLer, and Lawson is a "guy" out there.  

 

2017 - Pass for making Playoffs

2018 - Took their shot at QB

2019 - Team overall talent has to increase as Allen takes over

 

 

 

 

 

[teef]

2 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

 

Mango, 

 

I agree with this assessment. To me, its not a indictment of Beane's team building ability just yet, it's too early. 

 

Beane purged the roster of most Whaley staples - Dareus (1st Round), Watkins (1st Round), Ragland (2nd Round), Darby (2nd Round), Glenn (2nd Round), Tyrod (3 year starter). Regular football attrition has led to other loses - Preston Brown (3rd Round), Incognito (Pro Bowl with Bills), Wood (1st Round). That's a lot of talent to leave your organization, with their replacements being mostly spent to move up in the Draft to acquire Allen and Edmunds.

 

Ultimately, Beane and McDermott made the Playoffs in 2017, and that buys them goodwill for 2018. But by 2019, Allen needs to be starting and the football team needs to be built around him. Better WRs are required, more options at Tight End, a real backup RB, a new LG, RG, RT, maybe LT? Kyle Williams is near the end, and though Harrison Phillips was drafted, there is nothing behind him as Washington is a fringe NFLer, and Lawson is a "guy" out there.  

 

2017 - Pass for making Playoffs

2018 - Took their shot at QB

2019 - Team overall talent has to increase as Allen takes over

 

 

 

 

 

i think this is a pretty solid assessment.  

[mjt328]

3 hours ago, Mango said:

 

Pitiful OL performance all pre season. After a season of varied results, mostly bolstered by the performance of the left side of the line. 

 

I think the larger gripe is that the FO has literally been preaching for us to trust them. Now 15 months into the job, we are seeing the results of their trust. They lost 2 pro bowl lineman, with a terrible right side, and traded away another talented (albeit injured) LT, and made no real attempt to fortify those positions, we should “trust” them. 

 

Since Beane took over, virtually EVERY SINGLE position on this roster is worse than the day he started. In 15 months it’s not crazy for us to expect some position to be better. Allen might be the guy. MIGHT. Which is fine, swing for your QB, but you can get better elsewear. Same with Edmunds. He might be better than Preston Brown, but he’s leading a LB corps that is under performaing last years group. 

 

QB- Worse (today)

RB- Same. Although Murphy looks good.

FB- Same

WR1- Same (not good enough)

WR2- Same (Zay- not good enough)

TE- Same 

LT- Same

LG- Worse

C- Worse

RG- Same (bad)

RT- Same (bad)

 

LDE- Same 

DT- Same

DT- Worse (sorry Dareus is better) 

RDE- Same (until Trent proves otherwise/healthy and currently not good enough)

 

OLB-Same (not god enough)

MLB-Same (that’s being generous)

OLB- Same (not good enough)

 

CB1- Same

CB2- Worse

Safeties- Same

CB3- Worse

 

What a terrible assessment.  I don't even know where to start with this utter nonsense.

 

First of all, the 15 months that Brandon Beane has been on the job has included exactly ONE period of Free Agency and exactly ONE draft class. 

And NONE of the acquisitions made this offseason have played even a single snap for the Buffalo Bills yet.

 

Every smart team (especially those rebuilding) are built through the Draft.  But apparently you don't agree, because all of the places we got rid of an average veteran (Tyrod Taylor, Preston Brown) and replaced them with a top prospect (Josh Allen, Tremaine Edmunds), you considered that a downgrade or a wash.

 

So basically, your assessment of this roster comes down COMPLETELY to what we did in Free Agency...

Of course, completely ignoring that Beane's hands were totally tied because of cap space and high-priced contracts handed out by the previous front office.

You have also determined that Pro-Bowler Vontae Davis is a downgrade to the always-injured EJ Gaines - I'm assuming based on one bad preseason game.

You have also determined that Star Lotulelei is a downgrade to Marcel Dareus, who is currently a backup in Jacksonville and hasn't played well in 3 seasons now.

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

10 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

 

What a terrible assessment.  I don't even know where to start with this utter nonsense.

 

First of all, the 15 months that Brandon Beane has been on the job has included exactly ONE period of Free Agency and exactly ONE draft class. 

And NONE of the acquisitions made this offseason have played even a single snap for the Buffalo Bills yet.

 

Every smart team (especially those rebuilding) are built through the Draft.  But apparently you don't agree, because all of the places we got rid of an average veteran (Tyrod Taylor, Preston Brown) and replaced them with a top prospect (Josh Allen, Tremaine Edmunds), you considered that a downgrade or a wash.

 

So basically, your assessment of this roster comes down COMPLETELY to what we did in Free Agency...

Of course, completely ignoring that Beane's hands were totally tied because of cap space and high-priced contracts handed out by the previous front office.

You have also determined that Pro-Bowler Vontae Davis is a downgrade to the always-injured EJ Gaines - I'm assuming based on one bad preseason game.

You have also determined that Star Lotulelei is a downgrade to Marcel Dareus, who is currently a backup in Jacksonville and hasn't played well in 3 seasons now.

 

 

 

THANK YOU!  I was going to write this and more earlier and threw in the towel before even doing so because the analysis was so bad it was going to take too long to address LMFAO.

 

SPOT ON response.

[C.Biscuit97]

14 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

 

What a terrible assessment.  I don't even know where to start with this utter nonsense.

 

First of all, the 15 months that Brandon Beane has been on the job has included exactly ONE period of Free Agency and exactly ONE draft class. 

And NONE of the acquisitions made this offseason have played even a single snap for the Buffalo Bills yet.

 

Every smart team (especially those rebuilding) are built through the Draft.  But apparently you don't agree, because all of the places we got rid of an average veteran (Tyrod Taylor, Preston Brown) and replaced them with a top prospect (Josh Allen, Tremaine Edmunds), you considered that a downgrade or a wash.

 

So basically, your assessment of this roster comes down COMPLETELY to what we did in Free Agency...

Of course, completely ignoring that Beane's hands were totally tied because of cap space and high-priced contracts handed out by the previous front office.

You have also determined that Pro-Bowler Vontae Davis is a downgrade to the always-injured EJ Gaines - I'm assuming based on one bad preseason game.

You have also determined that Star Lotulelei is a downgrade to Marcel Dareus, who is currently a backup in Jacksonville and hasn't played well in 3 seasons now.

 

 

I don’t fully disagree with this.  But I hate double standards. Seems like there are a lot going on here.

 

1). I generally think Whaley was a better GM than most fans give him credit for.  That 2014 Bills team would have killed last year’s.  But because of a crap AFC, we backed into the playoffs.

 

i did hate Whaley’s trade up.  Well guess what the new regime is doing??? Trading up!  Why are some people giving them a pass on them.  I do really like Edmunds but he needs to be a MLB in the mood of Kuechly to justify it.

 

2) I love that you point out being stuck with high price contracts and the new regime just gave out big money contracts to Star, Murphy, and Ivory.  In what world is giving 3 million dollars to a backup rb a good deal?  How about a guy coming off a major injury and a PED suspension?

 

this new regime is making some of the same mistakes and we have less talent to show for it. Josh Allen And Edmunds need to be very good.

[Mango]

4 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

 

What a terrible assessment.  I don't even know where to start with this utter nonsense.

 

First of all, the 15 months that Brandon Beane has been on the job has included exactly ONE period of Free Agency and exactly ONE draft class. 

And NONE of the acquisitions made this offseason have played even a single snap for the Buffalo Bills yet.

 

Every smart team (especially those rebuilding) are built through the Draft.  But apparently you don't agree, because all of the places we got rid of an average veteran (Tyrod Taylor, Preston Brown) and replaced them with a top prospect (Josh Allen, Tremaine Edmunds), you considered that a downgrade or a wash.

 

So basically, your assessment of this roster comes down COMPLETELY to what we did in Free Agency...

Of course, completely ignoring that Beane's hands were totally tied because of cap space and high-priced contracts handed out by the previous front office.

You have also determined that Pro-Bowler Vontae Davis is a downgrade to the always-injured EJ Gaines - I'm assuming based on one bad preseason game.

You have also determined that Star Lotulelei is a downgrade to Marcel Dareus, who is currently a backup in Jacksonville and hasn't played well in 3 seasons now.

 

 

 

Dareus is better than Starr. Sorry, it’s true. We had an out after this season in his contract that would have dropped dead cap space to around 3 mil. Instead we are paying Starr 10 and 13 in dead space for Dareus, to DOWNGRADE the position.

 

Darby is better than Vontae and probable EJ Gaines. And he was incredibly cheap. We took on dead cap and created a hole for a few games of Jordan Matthews? 

 

Preston Brown signed a 4 year deal and led the league in tackles. While not great, he’s average or slightly better than average. Currently he’s a better LB than Edmunds. We could have both considering Preston’s contract is a whopping 4 million dollars. 

 

Our line one is better with Glenn than without. Dawkins was drafted to play RT. Glenn counts 9.6 million in dead cap space. 

 

Most of our cap issues re:dead cap space is self created. 

 

As of today, if the season started tomorrow, we are worse or the same at virtually every single position on the roster. If Edmunds and Allen pan out, ok, but that’s where we are today. It’s an incredibly dangerous move from the FO. 

 

I fully agree, build through the draft, but you don’t just go create problems for yourself just because. We aren’t cutting/trading anybody nearly as bad vs. highly paid as Dockery or Walker. These are dudes playing on good teams.

 

The topic is, “what areas of the roster did Beane improve?” I’m still waiting for your answer. There were good football players on this team, that are currently still hampering our cap. We spent our draft on a QB and MLB, neither of which have made an immediate impact. (Which is OK, but doesn’t make it any less true).  Where on the roster are we better than we were 365 years ago, today? Not 3 years from now, today.

 

We can heavily invest in these two guys and still get better SOMEWHERE. But we didn’t. It’s a valid criticism, and worthy of concern moving forward, especially in terms of trusting the talent evaluation of the FO. They traded a bunch of decent to good NFL players for two maybes, and brought nobody else in. If it works out they win, and I openly put my tail between my legs. 

 

[GunnerBill]

18 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

 

What a terrible assessment.  I don't even know where to start with this utter nonsense.

 

First of all, the 15 months that Brandon Beane has been on the job has included exactly ONE period of Free Agency and exactly ONE draft class. 

And NONE of the acquisitions made this offseason have played even a single snap for the Buffalo Bills yet.

 

Every smart team (especially those rebuilding) are built through the Draft.  But apparently you don't agree, because all of the places we got rid of an average veteran (Tyrod Taylor, Preston Brown) and replaced them with a top prospect (Josh Allen, Tremaine Edmunds), you considered that a downgrade or a wash.

 

So basically, your assessment of this roster comes down COMPLETELY to what we did in Free Agency...

Of course, completely ignoring that Beane's hands were totally tied because of cap space and high-priced contracts handed out by the previous front office.

You have also determined that Pro-Bowler Vontae Davis is a downgrade to the always-injured EJ Gaines - I'm assuming based on one bad preseason game.

You have also determined that Star Lotulelei is a downgrade to Marcel Dareus, who is currently a backup in Jacksonville and hasn't played well in 3 seasons now.

 

 

 

Agree with most of this but I do think the Gaines - Davis assumption is a fair assumption. Taking a guy at the tail end of his career, off an injury, who has been mainly a man corner in his NFL career and asking him to replace a guy in our mainly zone scheme who while brittle is a very capable zone corner was always a risk. At the moment I don't see it panning out. We are not getting the Pro Bowl Vontae Davis. Don't think that guy is there anymore. 

[mjd1001]

Whats better now?

 

Salary cap going forward

 

I like the QB 'situation' better

 

Secondary

 

TEs