National Josh Allen buzz after 1 preseason half

[Boatdrinks]

Why is there a “ narrative”? This is a thread about Allen buzz on a national perspective, with the decidedly partisan view of Bills fan lenses. That’s what it is, and why not ? This isn’t politics. We’re Bills fans and want Allen to be the franchise QB we’ve been waiting for. We all know that the odds are against just about any pick being that guy. We’re going to latch onto any glimmer of hope, any flash of big time ability that makes us believe he might be the one. And all the numbers in the role don’t mean squat right now because he’s played all of two NFL preseason quarters. All college stuff goes out the window once a player is in the NFL. It doesn’t mean a thing. So we’ll pull for Allen to be that QB , and the team’s investment dictates that he’ll be given every opportunity to prove he can be. Until he proves that he can’t , in which case they’ll go get another guy. Thank goodness for the rookie cap. Hopefully for Bills fans everywhere Allen IS the franchise player they’ve been seeking since Kelly. 

[ganesh]

51 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

Why is there a “ narrative”? This is a thread about Allen buzz on a national perspective, with the decidedly partisan view of Bills fan lenses. That’s what it is, and why not ? This isn’t politics. We’re Bills fans and want Allen to be the franchise QB we’ve been waiting for. We all know that the odds are against just about any pick being that guy. We’re going to latch onto any glimmer of hope, any flash of big time ability that makes us believe he might be the one. And all the numbers in the role don’t mean squat right now because he’s played all of two NFL preseason quarters. All college stuff goes out the window once a player is in the NFL. It doesn’t mean a thing. So we’ll pull for Allen to be that QB , and the team’s investment dictates that he’ll be given every opportunity to prove he can be. Until he proves that he can’t , in which case they’ll go get another guy. Thank goodness for the rookie cap. Hopefully for Bills fans everywhere Allen IS the franchise player they’ve been seeking since Kelly. 

well said.  But...but...but...we are bills fans!!!

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On 8/13/2018 at 5:55 PM, Nihilarian said:

It's not just me. Both Beane and McD placed their faith, future in the hands of Josh Allen so I think there is a real reason for all Bills fans to be excited. 

 

Read this, It might help. https://wgr550.radio.com/articles/news/step-step-how-bills-knew-allen-was-right-them

 

I wasn't reffering to your posts, I was referring to a post made by someone else. Chill out dude, were all fans here, and you can still be a fan of the team and have concerns over his accuracy issues.

Edited August 14, 2018 by MURPHD6

[Nihilarian]

1 hour ago, MURPHD6 said:

I wasn't referring* to your posts, I was referring to a post made by someone else. Chill out dude, we're* all fans here, and you can still be a fan of the team and have concerns over his accuracy issues.

 

If you weren't referring to my posts then why did you directly quote me? Then referred to the stats I posted as "cherry picking"?

 

The reason for my lengthy post was brought on by perceived condescending lecturing stated from a "research perspective". 

 

Since we are both Bills fans I will attempt to refrain from pointing out a sequacious nature. Still, if you had read the post I linked I would tend to think that any concerns most Bills fans had with Allen's so-called accuracy issues would have been eased. 

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

If you weren't referring to my posts then why did you directly quote me? Then referred to the stats I posted as "cherry picking"?

 

The reason for my lengthy post was brought on by perceived condescending lecturing stated from a "research perspective". 

 

Since we are both Bills fans I will attempt to refrain from pointing out a sequacious nature. Still, if you had read the post I linked I would tend to think that any concerns most Bills fans had with Allen's so-called accuracy issues would have been eased. 

 

 

 

 If you think I'm being condescening by pointing out cherry picking, a lack of research, and concern over a sub 60 per cent completion percentage please google "average completion percentage needed to start in the NFL" 

 

The baseline 60% completion percentage for a starting QB is a pretty common agreed upon stat amongst people who follow these things. 

 

In 2016 24/30 starting qbs had completion percentages over 60 and only one qb was below 55.

 

In 2017 25/32 qbs were above 60.

Only 2 players were below 55 - C.J Beathhard and DeShone Kizer.

 

If you follow statistical trends, nothing that I said should come off as condescending, unless your adverse to research (which is a hobby that fans who are interested in stats enjoy).

 

Teams aren't making the playoffs with QB's who are below 60%, minus a few exceptions, which includes Cam Newton (59.1) who makes up for it with his running ability.

 

And if you think I'm being sequacious, consensus is what stats are all about, and the reason why they are useful. 

 

 

Edited August 15, 2018 by MURPHD6

[Domdab99]

13 minutes ago, MURPHD6 said:

 If you think I'm being condescening by pointing out cherry picking, a lack of research, and concern over a sub 60 per cent completion percentage please google "average completion percentage needed to start in the NFL" 

 

The baseline 60% completion percentage for a starting QB is a pretty common agreed upon stat amongst people who follow these things. 

 

In 2016 24/30 starting qbs had completion percentages over 60 and only one qb was below 55.

 

In 2017 25/32 qbs were above 60.

Only 2 players were below 55 - C.J Beathhard and DeShone Kizer.

 

If you follow statistical trends, nothing that I said should come off as condescending, unless your adverse to research (which is a hobby that fans who are interested in stats enjoy).

 

 

 

 

 

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54 minutes ago, Domdab99 said:

 

 

Adjusted completion percentage.That ones tricky. Its not a recognized stat across the board, and really hard to compare.

Man, you Allen fan boys really need to calm down, because you're all getting silly, and trying to pick fights with people who aren't saying things that are unreasonable.

 

DeShone Kizer was 11/18 for a TD and 184 yards in his preseason debut, and alot of fools who were insisting that he was the next big thing were screaming for his head not soon after. If you want to be one of those fools, thats your perogative, or you could chill out. Give him time. Stop ganging up on people who disagree with you. And resist the temptation to preassure an organization to start a rookie QB with a leaky Oline.

 

Edited August 15, 2018 by MURPHD6

[Bills Pimpin']

52 minutes ago, MURPHD6 said:

 If you think I'm being condescening by pointing out cherry picking, a lack of research, and concern over a sub 60 per cent completion percentage please google "average completion percentage needed to start in the NFL" 

 

The baseline 60% completion percentage for a starting QB is a pretty common agreed upon stat amongst people who follow these things. 

 

In 2016 24/30 starting qbs had completion percentages over 60 and only one qb was below 55.

 

In 2017 25/32 qbs were above 60.

Only 2 players were below 55 - C.J Beathhard and DeShone Kizer.

 

If you follow statistical trends, nothing that I said should come off as condescending, unless your adverse to research (which is a hobby that fans who are interested in stats enjoy).

 

Teams aren't making the playoffs with QB's who are below 60%, minus a few exceptions, which includes Cam Newton (59.1) who makes up for it with his running ability.

 

And if you think I'm being sequacious, consensus is what stats are all about, and the reason why they are useful. 

 

 

You should probably wait until you have some Josh Allen NFL completion percentage stats before you start using NFL completion percentage stats as a reason why Josh Allen won't be a successful QB in the NFL. 

[transplantbillsfan]

52 minutes ago, Domdab99 said:

 

 

 

BOOM!!!

 

Well... there's that

[xxxxxxxx]

2 hours ago, Bills Pimpin' said:

You should probably wait until you have some Josh Allen NFL completion percentage stats before you start using NFL completion percentage stats as a reason why Josh Allen won't be a successful QB in the NFL. 

I never said that he wasn't going to be succesful, just that his percentage should be over 60 before you start him. I could take 55, maybe, but the fanboys don't want to hear that. Pro football focus gave him an adjusted percentage of over 60, so BOOM! I'm wrong, they are right, he's jesus and I'm a heritec.

 

And in case you didn't read anything that I said before, my ENTIRE POINT was that you shouldn't be taking his stats out context.

 

So now, you, who I have yet to talk to or disagree with are telling me that I am taking his performance out of context when that was my entire point to begin with. 

 

Welcome to the Josh Allen echo chamber, where your an ass for asking people to consider stats in a comparative context, an ass for not considering stats that he has yet to put up, and an ass for being skeptical of third string preseason performance.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 15, 2018 by MURPHD6

[transplantbillsfan]

50 minutes ago, MURPHD6 said:

Adjusted completion percentage.That ones tricky. Its not a recognized stat across the board, and really hard to compare.

Man, you Allen fan boys really need to calm down, because your all getting silly, and trying to pick fights with people who aren't saying things that are unreasonable.

 

DeShone Kizer was 11/18 for a TD and 184 yards in his preseason debut, and the same fools who were insisting that he was the next big thing were screaming for his head not soon after. If you want to be one of those fools, thats your perogative, or you could chill out. Give him time. Stop ganging up on people who disagree with you. And resist the temptation to preassure an organization to start a rookie QB with a leaky Oline.

 

 

2 blatant drops are caught and Foster runs full speed rather than looking backwards for 30+ yards while running OR flat out just stopping in the middle of a route for just 1 of the 2 bombs Allen threw him and that's 64% completion %.

 

Not a recognized stats across the board, but any normal person's eyes should be able to pretty easily see that culpability for 1/3rd of the Incompletions in that game lies pretty much solely on the hands of sub-par WRs who can't catch or don't understand the concept of finishing a route.

[xxxxxxxx]

2 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

2 blatant drops are caught and Foster runs full speed rather than looking backwards for 30+ yards while running OR flat out just stopping in the middle of a route for just 1 of the 2 bombs Allen threw him and that's 64% completion %.

 

Not a recognized stats across the board, but any normal person's eyes should be able to pretty easily see that culpability for 1/3rd of the Incompletions in that game lies pretty much solely on the hands of sub-par WRs who can't catch or don't understand the concept of finishing a route.

He had a couple balls that recievers made great catches on as well, but pro football focus doesn't adjust for those. 

 

Preseason 3rd team adjusted stats are not a good indicator of anything.

 

You can't go by your eyes to assume that a deep ball would have been caught when a reciever slows down because the same reciever could have overrun the pass as well. Its a subjective interpretation, not an objective stat.

 

 

Edited August 15, 2018 by MURPHD6

[transplantbillsfan]

2 hours ago, MURPHD6 said:

He had a couple balls that recievers made great catches on as well, but pro football focus doesn't adjust for those. 

Preseason 3rd team adjusted stats are not a good indicator of anything.

You can't go by your eyes to assume that a deep ball would have been caught when a reciever slows down because the same reciever could have overrun the pass as well. Its a subjective interpretation, not an objective stat.

 

 

Ummm... which passes from Allen did WRs have to make great catches on?

 

I named every single one I claimed were on WRs as Incompletions... so which ones did the WRs bail Allen out on with "great catches?"

[Bills Pimpin']

6 hours ago, MURPHD6 said:

I never said that he wasn't going to be succesful, just that his percentage should be over 60 before you start him. I could take 55, maybe, but the fanboys don't want to hear that. Pro football focus gave him an adjusted percentage of over 60, so BOOM! I'm wrong, they are right, he's jesus and I'm a heritec.

 

And in case you didn't read anything that I said before, my ENTIRE POINT was that you shouldn't be taking his stats out context.

 

So now, you, who I have yet to talk to or disagree with are telling me that I am taking his performance out of context when that was my entire point to begin with. 

 

Welcome to the Josh Allen echo chamber, where your an ass for asking people to consider stats in a comparative context, an ass for not considering stats that he has yet to put up, and an ass for being skeptical of third string preseason performance.

 

 

 

 

I'm not calling you an ass for anything. My point you shouldn't consider stats in regards to Josh Allen that don't exist. One of them being his NFL completion percentage. Also bringing up the NFL CP of Deshaun Kizer and CJ Beathard is ludicris. It reeks of looking for excuses not to give the kid the  opportunities he obviously deserves. If he plays with the 1's and 2's and is 55% CP and looks like a rookie then back up and punt. But FFS don't make excuses that don't exist. 

[xxxxxxxx]

1 hour ago, Bills Pimpin' said:

I'm not calling you an ass for anything. My point you shouldn't consider stats in regards to Josh Allen that don't exist. One of them being his NFL completion percentage. Also bringing up the NFL CP of Deshaun Kizer and CJ Beathard is ludicris. It reeks of looking for excuses not to give the kid the  opportunities he obviously deserves. If he plays with the 1's and 2's and is 55% CP and looks like a rookie then back up and punt. But FFS don't make excuses that don't exist. 

Your paranoid. I'm not making up stats that don't exist and I'm not looking for excuses. They are going to start him eventually, he's a top 10 pick, so they have to. I'm just calling attention to the fact that his completion percentage in his first NFL preseason game is still below 2/3 3rds of the QB's in the league, so we might want to see that number improve before we throw him in there, or else he might suck, get benched, and his development will be ruined.

 

This is a thread on The National Media Buzz about Allen, and since the memory of alot of folk seems to be short its worth reminding everyone that there was a similar buzz about Kizer last year, and he was put in too quick as a result, and now no longer with the team.

 

Bringing up Kizers preseason stats are RELEVANT in this case, as well, because he was in a similar situation with similar college and preseason stats, National media buzz, playing against a 3rd team D, etc.

 

 You remind me of a dad who thinks that his kid is the best player on the team and that any questioning of his special ability, despite overall evidence to the contrary, is a slight against your family.

 

I can picture you yelling at a pop warner coach and embarassing yourself in front of the rest of the parents.

 

 

Edited August 15, 2018 by MURPHD6

[BB@Shooter]

On 8/11/2018 at 2:40 AM, Fadingpain said:

The high points showcased above are examples of the things Allen can do, as have long been acknowledged by even his fiercest critics.  Tremendous arm, great velocity, at times can deliver big time home run type throws.  

 

The problem is the other stuff.  The first pass of the game: big arm, big throw....3 yards out of bounds.

 

47% completion percentage for a half of football.

 

The Panthers game did not reveal new insight into Allen's potential, it showcased exactly who he is and who he has been.

 

Here's hoping he can morph into a substantially more consistent, accurate passer. 

 

 

 

Don't bring up that the people around him didn't hold up their end. Keep hating. Keep throwing out the negative.

On 8/11/2018 at 5:22 AM, maryland-bills-fan said:

Let me add something that hasn't been directly mentioned.    Being able to throw an accurate 50+yard pass makes everything else so much more effective.  The deep square-in now becomes an easy pass because the CB has to respect being beat REALLY deep.  Every fake by the WR is now better because the DB has to delay a split second to guard against being  beat deep.   The free safety is now a deep safety and his job becomes being around to bail out other DB's who might be beat.    The Bills can get a "Bob Hayes" type WR and the defenses have to think about double covering him- giving everybody else more room. (Bullet Bob Hayes was a 100 yard dash track star who converted to football.  Originally, he had few moves but he could outrun anybody by 5 -10 yards.   https://video.search.yahoo.com/search/video?fr=mcafee&p=bob+hayes#id=1&vid=2bf9866750ef31fc10fc0bc1fb92b0e3&action=click )    A nice thing about this type of player is that most teams can't use them and also most teams don't have DB's who can match them 1 on 1.   A cheap draft pick can get you a home run guy that the other teams have to game plan against.

 

WHOOOT !!

Do you remember Reynaldo Nehemia (sp) track star turned 49er?

[Jay_Fixit]

8 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Ummm... which passes from Allen did WRs have to make great catches on?

 

I named every single one I claimed were on WRs as Incompletions... so which ones did the WRs bail Allen out on with "great catches?"

The Khari Lee catch. That’s all I know.

[transplantbillsfan]

2 hours ago, Jay_Fixit said:

The Khari Lee catch. That’s all I know.

 

The sideline one?  Was that a great play/catch by the receiver making up for a bad throw by the QB or a great play/catch by the receiver combined with a great throw by the QB?

 

I don't even know that Lee's catch was anything more than great awareness and a good NFL catch.

[Bills Pimpin']

9 hours ago, MURPHD6 said:

Your paranoid. I'm not making up stats that don't exist and I'm not looking for excuses. They are going to start him eventually, he's a top 10 pick, so they have to. I'm just calling attention to the fact that his completion percentage in his first NFL preseason game is still below 2/3 3rds of the QB's in the league, so we might want to see that number improve before we throw him in there, or else he might suck, get benched, and his development will be ruined.

 

This is a thread on The National Media Buzz about Allen, and since the memory of alot of folk seems to be short its worth reminding everyone that there was a similar buzz about Kizer last year, and he was put in too quick as a result, and now no longer with the team.

 

Bringing up Kizers preseason stats are RELEVANT in this case, as well, because he was in a similar situation with similar college and preseason stats, National media buzz, playing against a 3rd team D, etc.

 

 You remind me of a dad who thinks that his kid is the best player on the team and that any questioning of his special ability, despite overall evidence to the contrary, is a slight against your family.

 

I can picture you yelling at a pop warner coach and embarassing yourself in front of the rest of the parents.

 

 

OK brah. Hold onto your completion percentage stat to decide how to handle the playing time of Allen since you are obviously too simple minded to account for anything else. The rest of us, which I guarantee includes the coaches, will look at the the entire body of work and make a proper evaluation. I hope your magic number of 60% shows up soon so you can feel good about playing the kid without "destroying him". 

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

On 8/13/2018 at 7:04 PM, 26CornerBlitz said:

Reviewing Buffalo Bills rookie quarterback Josh Allen's preseason debut | Baldy's Breakdown (4:44)

 

Just as a note Baldy is very well regarded in the Philly area. His review of Allen is overall positive with enough critique to not be Pollyanna