Good Night / Bad Night - Pre-season Game 1

[GoBills808]

6 minutes ago, Misterbluesky said:

Wow..again..I don't see it. Play #2,how in the neck was he going to stop a full throttle McCaff there? 

For starters? He's lined up strong side so he's got Olsen w/ eyes in the backfield on McCaffrey and Newton presnap. He's still in stance when the ball hits Newton's hands and has to take a bad half-step forwards to compensate for Olsen already into his route...puts him way too exposed and having to just turn and run to catch up instead of being able to diagnose the TE seam vs dumpoff (this play will hurt an inexperienced LB) and stay balanced. Then once Newton hits McCaffrey and Edmunds gets turned to run him down (which he does amazingly quickly, he's an athletic freak no doubt) he over-pursues because of his earlier positioning and misses the tackle. 

[GunnerBill]

17 minutes ago, Misterbluesky said:

 

Wow..again..I don't see it. Play #2,how in the neck was he going to stop a full throttle McCaff there? 

 

McCaffrey doesn't even cut to run past Edmunds. He cuts before that and then just runs straight through a missed Edmunds tackle because Edmunds has taken a poor angle.

[Misterbluesky]

13 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

For starters? He's lined up strong side so he's got Olsen w/ eyes in the backfield on McCaffrey and Newton presnap. He's still in stance when the ball hits Newton's hands and has to take a bad half-step forwards to compensate for Olsen already into his route...puts him way too exposed and having to just turn and run to catch up instead of being able to diagnose the TE seam vs dumpoff (this play will hurt an inexperienced LB) and stay balanced. Then once Newton hits McCaffrey and Edmunds gets turned to run him down (which he does amazingly quickly, he's an athletic freak no doubt) he over-pursues because of his earlier positioning and misses the tackle. 

I respect you as a poster but I will say you are splitting hairs here.Edmunds was dropping with the TE...Newton was zero'in on him but Edmunds had a blanket on him...then Newton checks down and Edmunds still makes it back up field for a shot at him.That's a bad play? If anything,I salute his solid pass coverage!!!!!

Edited August 10, 2018 by Misterbluesky

[Freddie's Dead]

49 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I was referring to the dumpoff to McCaffrey on 2nd and 10 earlier. Someone did a video wrap of his plays here:

 

 

I'm not hating on the kid at all. I think he's going to be great. But when I said he didn't play well I wasn't lying. 

 

Did not mean to infer that you were.  I was referencing other plays.

[Augie]

1 hour ago, Misterbluesky said:

It's play number two of the game,Aug.Some folks act like the Panthers ran up the gut towards him and that was not the case. 

 

I’m sure he was still filled with jitters. All is forgiven on my end. Keep working, young man! 

[RocCityRoller]

12 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

IIiiiiiitttttt'sss back folks. Week 1 of the 2018 pre-season is in the books and so it is time for my annual Good Night / Bad Night series. Some promising signs last night despite the final score so let's wait no longer!

 

Good Night for...

 

Brian Daboll - Lots of people have understandably been anxious to see what Brain Daboll's offense looks like with the Bills.  This might only have been pre-season but it was a promising debut for the new offensive coordinator who had personnel groups and formations a plenty on display in the first half against the Panthers. It's probably fair to say there was a little more on show than is traditional for a team to flash on its pre-season bow, but there was not so much shifting and motion as to indicate to me that full parts of the scheme were out there. There was a rhythm and a flow to the plays in that first half that was encouraging.

 

The Quarterbacks - Daboll's scheme was helped to look so smooth in no small part because "co-starters" McCarron and Peterman were so efficient and effective in running the first half offense. Peterman's greatest strength has always been his quick release and he was getting the ball out on time as receivers come out of breaks but before defenders can react  as he engineered that first touch down drive. He was unfortunate with the interception, it wasn't an accurate pass but Ivory should have made the catch. McCarron then demonstrated his poise and good decision making going deep when the chance was there and dumping off to his back smartly when required. His first third down conversion to Streater over the middle was the throw of the first half. In the second half Josh Allen was clearly less comfortable running the offense, especially with a clunky 3rd string offensive line infront of him. It was all a bit more off script and ad lib for the rookie who mixed a couple of head scratchers with some absolute wow moments. The TD to McCloud, the should have been TD to Foster and best of all the completion to McCloud when he came across the middle are examples of what that elite arm talent gets you. Encouraging debut, needs to be a little more consistent as a decision maker and probably won't have jumped either of the two vets would be my summation of his night.

 

The starting Offensive Line - A good night for the first choice offensive line, all showed up and played pretty well. There were always ways in which Tyrod helped the Bills o-line in terms of slowing down rushers who were worried about losing contain and letting Taylor scamper for big yards. But there were other ways that he always hurt the line too. The line seemed able to play in a more fundamental and consistent manner knowing that Peterman was going to be where he should be 'in the pocket' and was going to get the ball out of his hands on time. Thought Ryan Groy went 1-0 up in the battle to start at center, and both guards did a nice job in pass protection too. I really think injuries allowing that the same five will start at Baltimore. The second strong line did alright too (after a Newhouse special on the first play).  I wanted to specifically applaud Ike Boettger the UDFA from Iowa who I mentioned in the week was coming up on the rails of this tackle battle. He got the 2nd team right tackle gig last night and was the best of the backup tackles on show - he has a chance to make this team.

 

Kelvin Benjamin - Everyone here knows Kelvin Benjamin can play football. Everyone here also knows that both health and application have been questions that have dogged him throughout his career. 4 targets, 4 catches, 59 yards and a Touchdown was an impressive stat line to open his pre-season account with. Whoever the Bills starting Quarterback is this year they are going to need Benjamin in this kind of form. He just looked "at it".

 

Marcus Murphy - The running back competition was seen as being Murphy and Cadet fighting for the #3 job behind McCoy and Ivory. Murphy got the highest workload of any back last night and responded with an impressive outing going for 35 yards at 5 yards a clip on the ground and bringing in 4 receptions for 30 yards while Chris Ivory made one big catch and run play but also spilled up an interception on a pass he should have held.  Cadet rushed just twice for 4 yards. If the battle truly is for the #3 job then Murphy has taken the lead there.... but he might even end up pushing to be Shady's primary backup on this form.

 

 

Bad Night for...

 

Young Wideouts (excluding Ray Ray McCloud) - One of the stories of camp this year has been the battle of the 6 young and totally unproven wideouts (Reilly, Dupre, Foster, McCloud, Phillips, Proehl) to try and snag one of the last spots on the roster.  Ray Ray McCloud showed up second half, demonstrated some chemistry with fellow rookie Josh Allen and snagged three balls and a touchdown. Cam Phillips miss the game injured but the stat line for the other 4 combined read 1 catch for 59 yards, with only Reilly even troubling the scorers. Reilly and Proehl both had drops too, and Foster should have had a touchdown that he didn't even get hands on. This competition is whittling itself down and this group, McCloud excluded, now faces an uphill battle to make the roster.

 

Conor McDermott - The Bills picked up Conor McDermott when the Patriots cut him early in 2017. They kept him on the active roster the rest of last season and they clearly saw him as a developmental guy who could become a swing tackle candidate for this year's roster. However, since camp opened he has gone from 2nd team left tackle, to 2nd team right tackle, to 3rd team left tackle and then he had a rough night last night getting blown up early and often in the 2nd half. His chances of making the roster are now slim at best.

 

Ramon Humber - One of the interesting things to notice last night was that Lorenzo Alexander only played the first series at linebacker (and he was the guy going off the field in nickel) and then they took him out, left Edmunds and Milano in, and gave Deon Lacey the next shot with the first unit.  That would mean Lacey has jumped Humber on the depth chart since the end of last season and Humber hardly made it count when he got in there by showing the same struggles in coverage and in space that were on his 2017 game tape as well. Not sure Humber is necessarily on the bubble at this stage but he might be looking at special teams as his saving grace to make the team. 

 

Keith Ford - The UDFA out of Texas A&M had a couple of nice runs on his first two touches but after that his night went downhill fast. Numerous false start and alignment penalties and a complete whiff on an attempted block that led to a sack of the team's highly prized rookie Quarterback are hardly likely to endear him to the coaching staff. He might even have played himself out of a practice squad shot. He really has to step it up to have any chance to even land there.

 

The backup secondary - We all think the Bills defensive backfield is really good. The worry many of us have is depth. That showed up last night. Lafayette Pitts, Levi Wallace and Taron Johnson all got plenty of time at corner but didn't exactly shine (though Johnson didn't do a lot wrong on the touchdown he was beaten for) and the backup safeties seemed missing in action for the most part. There are still spots to be won in the backfield rotation and I wouldn't be surprised if this was an area where the Bills add someone else's cutdowns. 

 

There we are, my reflections on pre-season game 1... I'll be back next week to look at who helped and hurt their cases in the Browns game. Let's hear your thoughts!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Outstanding post.

 

I would like to mention Humber did have a shoe string tackle that may have saved a TD on a play Carolina spring. I believe the next play he had a terrific bull rush that forced a quick throw.

 

The LBs in general played below par.

[GunnerBill]

8 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

 

Outstanding post.

 

I would like to mention Humber did have a shoe string tackle that may have saved a TD on a play Carolina spring. I believe the next play he had a terrific bull rush that forced a quick throw.

 

The LBs in general played below par.

 

The shoe string tackle was on a play where he was badly out of position in the first place. And that was basically the book on Humber last year. Often out of position but will give every ounce of effort to make up for his mistakes. I think he has value as a backup who can play teams but for a guy who was a starting linebacker week 1 last season and who started a playoff game to now not even be their next man up in the rotation at that spot is a bit of a fall from favour. 

[RocCityRoller]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

The shoe string tackle was on a play where he was badly out of position in the first place. And that was basically the book on Humber last year. Often out of position but will give every ounce of effort to make up for his mistakes. I think he has value as a backup who can play teams but for a guy who was a starting linebacker week 1 last season and who started a playoff game to now not even be their next man up in the rotation at that spot is a bit of a fall from favour. 

 

I'll have to rewatch that play, good eye.

 

I agree Humber is depth, he is a hit and miss guy, just wanted to point out it wasn't all bad.

[YoloinOhio]

2 hours ago, Formerly Allan in MD said:

Ray Ray can play play.

Was mixing in with the 1st team at practice today 

[Jpsredemption]

Edmunds played scared and tentative. Not a good start.

[Behindenemylines]

I just was able to watch the Allen throws.  Did Foster blow as bad as I'm seeing or am I missing something?  Seemed to not even try on what would be a spectacular TD pass.  

[Boatdrinks]

2 minutes ago, Behindenemylines said:

I just was able to watch the Allen throws.  Did Foster blow as bad as I'm seeing or am I missing something?  Seemed to not even try on what would be a spectacular TD pass.  

Yes, he did. Gave mediocre effort, and as we saw on the “ embedded “ clip that won’t sit well with McD. 

[TigerJ]

I think DeLacey is going to backup Lorax.  Humber backsup on t he weak side (Milano).  Keenan Robinson is pretty flexible and could be a threat to Humber as the primary backup to Humber.  He could also threaten Valleho as backup to Edmunds.  He hasn't shown too much yet, but that may be because the defense is still pretty new to him.

[Lfod]

On 8/10/2018 at 7:58 AM, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Great write-up, Gunner.

 

I think I'm not alone in feeling frustrated with our glimpse of Allen.  I would like to see him behind a more consistent OL and throwing to more consistent WR so we can get a real read out on where he's at - watching last night was like "Wyoming Part Deux"

 

I didn't find myself frustrated by it. Allen  played with and against lesser talent. Sure the Panthers depth could be better, I won't argue against it, but I still don't see it as very unfair. This was thier scrubs vs our scrubs with our draft pick QB inserted to see how he handles it. If Allen can't handle it, he won't ever be franchise. 

 

The reason we didn't pick Rosen I'm thinking is for that reason. Allen won't get a big ego and think he deserves more than he has earned. I think it was a fine way insert Allen and get his feet wet. 

 

I think all 3 QBs started the first preseason game in the order the HC had them ranked. That is just my personal opinion. They all showcased well and McDermott said it's a good thing and makes his job harder. 

 

It was frustrating and yet exhilarating to see Allen make it work. Allen did face the most pressure, but all 3 QBs did face pressure. Nate avoided his one serious pressure and AJM ate his with a sack. 

 

I think Nate Peterman was dropping back and firing. The O-Line didn't have to block as long in my honest opinion. We will see if it looks that good when the QBs are in different order next game. 

 

Right now people are overestimating the starting O-Line and underestimating Peterman. I see pressure in his series and if a lot of those passes didn't get off as fast well.... You will appreciate next game when it's more visible. 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 12, 2018 by Lfod

[3rdand12]

On 8/10/2018 at 8:58 AM, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I think he's our future starting LG.  If we can solidify the RT spot, our line would be young with promise.  Dawkins, Teller, Miller and Groy are all young.

jeebus i sure hope so. be nice to watch Dion and Teller develop alongside each other next couple years

[3rdand12]

Daboll is sowing a bit of why he was hired.

Smart guy , new team, looked decent or better, especially for a preseason workout : )
it will get tidied up,
Defense. New players plenty, and more recent Draftees being pushed.
they might need the whole preseason to get settled in. Depth is again a concern.

Like the R Bush !

[Hapless Bills Fan]

47 minutes ago, Lfod said:

I didn't find myself frustrated by it. Allen  played with and against lesser talent. Sure the Panthers depth could be better, I won't argue against it, but I still don't see it as very unfair. This was thier scrubs vs our scrubs with our draft pick QB inserted to see how he handles it. If Allen can't handle it, he won't ever be franchise. 

 

I think someone in another thread captured not just the frustration, but the paradox here correctly: we drafted Allen knowing he needed development.

But, it's unrealistic to expect him to develop his footwork and his understanding of his protections, or to easily assess his development as a passer, without giving him a competent OL and WR who can run routes and catch.

 

If we want Allen to develop as an NFL QB, we have to give him an NFL context.  That was Wyoming in B'lo, and displayed some of Allen's same traits for better and for worse.

 

47 minutes ago, Lfod said:

I think all 3 QBs started the first preseason game in the order the HC had them ranked. That is just my personal opinion. They all showcased well and McDermott said it's a good thing and makes his job harder. 

 

I do too.  I don't think McDermott is some kind of deep mind-game-playing coach either with QB or the press/fans.  I think he's WYSIWYG.

 

I do think that what Daboll and McDermott are looking for, may not be what the fans are seeing, so their evaluation will differ from ours.

[John from Riverside]

On 8/10/2018 at 2:25 PM, GoBills808 said:

For starters? He's lined up strong side so he's got Olsen w/ eyes in the backfield on McCaffrey and Newton presnap. He's still in stance when the ball hits Newton's hands and has to take a bad half-step forwards to compensate for Olsen already into his route...puts him way too exposed and having to just turn and run to catch up instead of being able to diagnose the TE seam vs dumpoff (this play will hurt an inexperienced LB) and stay balanced. Then once Newton hits McCaffrey and Edmunds gets turned to run him down (which he does amazingly quickly, he's an athletic freak no doubt) he over-pursues because of his earlier positioning and misses the tackle. 

Nice....this is exactly what I saw.....

 

McCaffery is a pretty good player  to

[RocCityRoller]

1 hour ago, John from Riverside said:

Nice....this is exactly what I saw.....

 

McCaffery is a pretty good player  to

 

And even at RB with an NFL pedigree it took him a year to settle in. McCaffery looked great, very poised. Moore is one of those rare year 1 producers. He looked terrific, but it was against 2nd and third tier guys. I see 40-500-3 from Moore this year. That is a good rookie season in an established offense.

 

All three of our QBs had moments. It was good to see. Daboll will be the best offseason addition on offense by year end. I think he will be ready to rock and roll regardless of his QB.

Edited August 12, 2018 by RocCityRoller

[RyanC883]

On 8/10/2018 at 1:30 PM, Freddie's Dead said:

Maybe Foster can show it next week, we could use the speed.  But I doubt it.

 

I hope he does.   The talent is all there.  Just needs to use it.  Hopefully Daboll can get through to him.  If not, he's a lost cause.  And he's someone I was very high on.