starrymessenger Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 1 hour ago, BuffaloBill said: How in the world would Cleveland’s scouting have not highlighted the issue before the 15th pick in the draft was expended on the guy? Except he was thought to be the best WR prospect in his class by many, not just Cleveland. And there is nothing unusual about a highly touted (and drafted) WR completely underwhelming his first couple of years in the league. There are so many examples, some close to home as well. And it can be for all sorts of reasons. Some eventually come around and realize their potential. Hopefully Coleman (and Zay) will wind up in that grouping. Great trade by Beane. Got something (raw talent and athleticism) for nothing.
JoPar_v2 Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 1 hour ago, BuffaloBill said: How in the world would Cleveland’s scouting have not highlighted the issue before the 15th pick in the draft was expended on the guy? Because they were using unproven analytics at the time and their owner is a known meddler who knows nothing about football.
John from Riverside Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 1 minute ago, starrymessenger said: Except he was thought to be the best WR prospect in his class by many, not just Cleveland. And there is nothing unusual about a highly touted (and drafted) WR completely underwhelming his first couple of years in the league. There are so many examples, some close to home as well. And it can be for all sorts of reasons. Some eventually come around and realize their potential. Hopefully Coleman (and Zay) will wind up in that grouping. Great trade by Beane. Got something (raw talent and athleticism) for nothing. I am seeing several who thought he was the BEST Wide Receiver of that draft.
26CornerBlitz Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 1 minute ago, John from Riverside said: I am seeing several who thought he was the BEST Wide Receiver of that draft. Thus far the entire 2016 class of 1st round WRs hasn't done much.
Bill_with_it Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 (edited) 5 hours ago, BuffaloBill said: OK, but again if you are going to expend a very valuable pick on a guy would you not dig deeper to have a better understanding of this situation? It really seems like the Browns were simply negligent in missing the information. Gms are enamored by speed and potential. Ross was the next big thing despite having a huge knee surgery. It’s almost like people overlook everything for speed. Some times it works most of the time it doesn’t. In our case we gave up very little for a player that has the potential to contribute to our team. If he doesn’t we didn’t lose anything worth mentioning. Our GM and HC are masters at risk mitigation. Edited August 7, 2018 by Bill_with_it 1
JoPar_v2 Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 So “named” in a police report as a relative of a suspect? I have no issue with this. Lots of players have criminal elements in their families. Doesn’t mean the player is a bad guy. Janoris Jenkins anyone? He wasn’t dumped after his brother allegedly killed a guy was he?
Lurker Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 12 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: Why are you here? Liberal use of the "Ignore User" feature would take care of that problem...
John from Riverside Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 5 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Thus far the entire 2016 class of 1st round WRs hasn't done much. True that In my opinion Colemen would be a lot more regarded if he wasnt getting hurt....because he obviously has talent. It is interesting that even though ppl bash our WR core we have TWO former 1st round picks in the group and 1 second rounder.
26CornerBlitz Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 Just now, John from Riverside said: True that In my opinion Colemen would be a lot more regarded if he wasnt getting hurt....because he obviously has talent. It is interesting that even though ppl bash our WR core we have TWO former 1st round picks in the group and 1 second rounder. Physical gifts alone won't make him into a good WR in the NFL. He hasn't been dedicated to his craft beyond the injury factor that's held him back. Where guys in the WR corps were drafted means little at this juncture.
John from Riverside Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 Just now, 26CornerBlitz said: Physical gifts alone won't make him into a good WR in the NFL. He hasn't been dedicated to his craft beyond the injury factor that's held him back. Where guys in the WR corps were drafted means little at this juncture. It only means that Beane is not asleep at the wheel...even in a year where we are taking the huge dead cap hit.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 4 hours ago, Foreigner said: Two paragraphs from a story by AP Sports Writer Tom Withers. But beyond Coleman's problems on the field, he had issues outside the lines that hurt his standing with Coach Hue Jackson and new General Manager John Dorsey. Coleman was named in a police report regarding an alleged felonious assault last year. He was also sent home from the Browns trip to Houston for missing curfew while he was injured. We are changing the culture. With Zay Jones and Coleman on the field as WRs (insert your own joke here) "Named in a police report". Not a suspect. Not charged. "Named". Said to be surveillance video that demonstrates he was not involved. https://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2017/01/corey_coleman_police_report_de.html 1
Foxx Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 35 minutes ago, Roch-A-Bill said: 2016 highlight reel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2adMizhNto he might be fast, but in that video I didn't see anything that said he used his speed for much of anything. he looked more like a possession receiver than anything else. i will grant that he does appear to have a feistiness about him though.
starrymessenger Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 8 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Thus far the entire 2016 class of 1st round WRs hasn't done much. Yeah. Sorta like Mike Williams and Corey Davis in 2018. And I'd love to have either of those guys. Most young wideouts take a few years at least to acclimate, unless they are in a scheme that favours them and have a proven veteran passer throwing them the ball. And even then. 1 minute ago, Foxx said: he might be fast, but in that video I didn't see anything that said he used his speed for much of anything. he looked more like a possession receiver than anything else. i will grant that he does appear to have a feistiness about him though. A scheme thing. He was used as a possession receiver to be sure - but was that the best use of his skillset?
26CornerBlitz Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 4 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: It only means that Beane is not asleep at the wheel...even in a year where we are taking the huge dead cap hit. He was smart to take the shot on a talented guy at such a low price as many including me have already posted. 2 minutes ago, starrymessenger said: Yeah. Sorta like Mike Williams and Corey Davis in 2018. And I'd love to have either of those guys. Most young wideouts take a few years at least to acclimate, unless they are in a scheme that favours them and have a proven veteran passer throwing them the ball. And even then. Neither of those two have stayed on the field enough to assess them. Big 2nd year campaigns coming up for the both of them.
Doc Brown Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 If this doesn't work out, we'll never recover from losing that 7th round pick two years from now. 2 3
SouthNYfan Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 21 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Thus far the entire 2016 class of 1st round WRs hasn't done much. Yeah I think Thomas is the only one from that entire draft who has been a difference maker, and he was the second round, oh had he has had drew Brees slinging the pigskin his way, so there's that. I don't fault Coleman though, between his injury and being in the Browns (which is probably worse than an injury) I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, especially considering we gave up nothing for him. As of now he's already our number#2 on talent alone, maybe even #1.
Fadingpain Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 1 hour ago, JMF2006 said: No we trade him back to the Browns for a 209 3rd rnd Her is hoping he can beat division DB's that bad So he has that "get away from the cops speed" Quite possibly!
26CornerBlitz Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 Just now, SouthNYfan said: Yeah I think Thomas is the only one from that entire draft who has been a difference maker, and he was the second round, oh had he has had drew Brees slinging the pigskin his way, so there's that. I don't fault Coleman though, between his injury and being in the Browns (which is probably worse than an injury) I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, especially considering we gave up nothing for him. As of now he's already our number#2 on talent alone, maybe even #1. His talent alone won't give him this status even on the Bills if he can't learn the offense and run good routes. It's nice to have him on the team nevertheless to add the deep threat they have lacked.
Shaw66 Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 37 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: The difference is NFL talent with hands, route running, knowing how to set up DBs, effective use of speed and body positioning that make Watkins the far superior and more productive player. You're making this attempt to argue in favor of a player you admittedly know nothing about and it simply doesn't add up in any rational or logical. That's exactly why the Bills paid next to nothing in compensation for him. You should stop, but somehow I know you won't just as you argued over and over again about Kirk Cousins to the Bills when it was obvious that they weren't a match. All I've said is that there isn't much difference in their NFL production. When you adjust for targets and their QBs, there isn't much difference. As someone said, let him run fly patterns all day and he will help the offense. I'm not trying to convince anyone, including myself, that Coleman is Julio Jones. Neither is Sammy. 1
26CornerBlitz Posted August 6, 2018 Posted August 6, 2018 Just now, Shaw66 said: All I've said is that there isn't much difference in their NFL production. When you adjust for targets and their QBs, there isn't much difference. As someone said, let him run fly patterns all day and he will help the offense. I'm not trying to convince anyone, including myself, that Coleman is Julio Jones. Neither is Sammy. Okay. Please stop with this silliness.
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