Better Call Saul: Season 4

[shrader]

10 hours ago, apuszczalowski said:

 

The scene with Mike in the meeting, that also seemed more like rage then sadness coming over him. He was emotional because his daughter in law is saying that she is starting to let go of his son and isn't constantly thinking of him. That hurts him because he probably thinks about his son all the time and she seems like she is starting to move on from him. Then the group leader tells her that thats progress, and then the other guy starts telling a story that he believes is made up to help her which pushes him over the edge. I wonder if Mikes turning point is going to come by his Daughter in law continuing to move on from his son? The end seen was also important as he stood up to Gus and sets up next episode that will most likely have him doing some personal work for him.

 

The opener ended with him saying something along the lines of "you wanted me to talk more" and then he also said it right after he rips into the lying guy.  It came off to me like those two scenes were the same moment.  So he's thinking about his son at the same time that his daughter-in-law is telling her story.

 

15 hours ago, Fadingpain said:

Not sure.  It was definitely short and it definitely ended abruptly.  Kind of made me laugh when I saw it.

 

 

 

It was very jarring, but design I'm sure.  That fits goes along well with what I just posted above.

[Fadingpain]

4 hours ago, shrader said:

 

The opener ended with him saying something along the lines of "you wanted me to talk more" and then he also said it right after he rips into the lying guy.  It came off to me like those two scenes were the same moment.  So he's thinking about his son at the same time that his daughter-in-law is telling her story.

 

 

It was very jarring, but design I'm sure.  That fits goes along well with what I just posted above.

Yes, the opening short scene was the same scene we later saw.  The later scene explains the intro, which was confusing and weird at the time.  I had forgotten about "group" and was like "why is Mike talking to a bunch of people at an AA meeting or something similar?

 

Of course, we later find out.

 

 

[meazza]

10 hours ago, /dev/null said:

 

Also recall the episode where Mike returns from Mexico after the bombing.  He was livid and ready to kill Walt

If anyone threatened Mike's grand daughter, the thing he loves most, do you think he would have been that upset after his death?

 

How about this theory: somebody threatens Mike's grand daughter and Gus's intervention is what saves her?  Thus cementing Mike's respect and loyalty.

Of course knowing Gus it could have been him pulling the strings all along

 

 

Maybe. Lol

 

that being said, mike up until now has a sense of morality in his actions. The deeper he gets involved with gus, the higher chance that mike will begin to simply follow orders regardless of morals.

[Fadingpain]

23 minutes ago, meazza said:

 

Maybe. Lol

 

that being said, mike up until now has a sense of morality in his actions. The deeper he gets involved with gus, the higher chance that mike will begin to simply follow orders regardless of morals.

The scene where Jimmy asks Mike if he wants in on the Hummel burglary is interesting.  Mike refuses to take part in it, even though he probably would have pulled it off quite easily. 

 

Was that based on a sense of morality, or a simple, cold calculation that the risk was not worth the reward?  

 

 

[meazza]

10 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

The scene where Jimmy asks Mike if he wants in on the Hummel burglary is interesting.  Mike refuses to take part in it, even though he probably would have pulled it off quite easily. 

 

Was that based on a sense of morality, or a simple, cold calculation that the risk was not worth the reward?  

 

 

 

Morality in my opinion.  He asked him what the guy did to get ripped off. 

[apuszczalowski]

2 hours ago, meazza said:

 

Morality in my opinion.  He asked him what the guy did to get ripped off. 

Yeah, Mike seems to be the kind of guy right now with Morals who wont do anything unless the other deserves it. He isnt in it to get rich or just to do it, like Jimmy, he has to believe that he is doing something to right a wrong

[Fadingpain]

If you haven't seen Episode 5 "Quite a Ride" yet, stop reading now!

 

I loved the opening sequence with all hell breaking loose in Saul's legal office.

 

The stuff with Mike taking in architectural consultants for the meth lab was also cool.  Why was the first candidate rejected?  I think it was a combination of him being overconfident and b/c he blabbered about the "tunnel" project he previously did.  Loose lips sink ships and Gus would not have liked that.

 

The bit with Jimmy selling cell phones on the street was interesting too...I suspect we haven't seen the last of the 3 kids who beat him up and stole the money.  Jimmy will get even with them at some point.

 

Kim was trying to get herself fired with the hang up, even if she doesn't realize it and it was her passive aggressive subconscious doing it for her.  She does not want to be doing corporate formation/regulatory work for a regional bank!

 

And what about Howard in the bathroom!  He is a mess!  Didn't even do up his tie before he left!  He is always perfectly fastidious, but Chuck's death is eating him up.  Note the juxtaposition between Howard trying to confront it head-on vs. Jimmy's total denial.

 

Another good episode with lots of stuff building under the surface.

 

 

[mrags]

17 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

If you haven't seen Episode 5 "Quite a Ride" yet, stop reading now!

 

I loved the opening sequence with all hell breaking loose in Saul's legal office.

 

The stuff with Mike taking in architectural consultants for the meth lab was also cool.  Why was the first candidate rejected?  I think it was a combination of him being overconfident and b/c he blabbered about the "tunnel" project he previously did.  Loose lips sink ships and Gus would not have liked that.

 

The bit with Jimmy selling cell phones on the street was interesting too...I suspect we haven't seen the last of the 3 kids who beat him up and stole the money.  Jimmy will get even with them at some point.

 

Kim was trying to get herself fired with the hang up, even if she doesn't realize it and it was her passive aggressive subconscious doing it for her.  She does not want to be doing corporate formation/regulatory work for a regional bank!

 

And what about Howard in the bathroom!  He is a mess!  Didn't even do up his tie before he left!  He is always perfectly fastidious, but Chuck's death is eating him up.  Note the juxtaposition between Howard trying to confront it head-on vs. Jimmy's total denial.

 

Another good episode with lots of stuff building under the surface.

 

 

Might have been the best episode yet. I thought it was incredible. And next week looks even better. I’m loving how everything is falling into place now. Soon we will see what brings Jimmy to become Saul for good. And soon we will see what brings down Saul to become a manager of a Cinnabon in some no name Mid west Mall. 

[row_33]

Great scenes with Howard and Jimmy’s earlier return to street life.

 

 

 

[apuszczalowski]

9 hours ago, Fadingpain said:

If you haven't seen Episode 5 "Quite a Ride" yet, stop reading now!

 

I loved the opening sequence with all hell breaking loose in Saul's legal office.

 

The stuff with Mike taking in architectural consultants for the meth lab was also cool.  Why was the first candidate rejected?  I think it was a combination of him being overconfident and b/c he blabbered about the "tunnel" project he previously did.  Loose lips sink ships and Gus would not have liked that.

 

The bit with Jimmy selling cell phones on the street was interesting too...I suspect we haven't seen the last of the 3 kids who beat him up and stole the money.  Jimmy will get even with them at some point.

 

Kim was trying to get herself fired with the hang up, even if she doesn't realize it and it was her passive aggressive subconscious doing it for her.  She does not want to be doing corporate formation/regulatory work for a regional bank!

 

And what about Howard in the bathroom!  He is a mess!  Didn't even do up his tie before he left!  He is always perfectly fastidious, but Chuck's death is eating him up.  Note the juxtaposition between Howard trying to confront it head-on vs. Jimmy's total denial.

 

Another good episode with lots of stuff building under the surface.

 

 

I think the reason for Mike not going with the 1st Engineer he had in was because he seemed too confident in what they were proposing and so sure it could be done earlier then expected. Mike knew it was a huge job and would be riskier and tougher then this guy believed. And this is just something I also thought could have been a reason, he came in using laser distance measurers and a laptop. Mike is oldschool and could also see the lasers as not being as accurate, and computers as not being as secure for a job this secret. The second guy took out an actual tape measure and other testing tools, and calculated things out on paper in his book. He then told him all the risks and issues he would be dealing with to do a job on that scale. He told him and Gus it can be done, but it's going to be dangerous, risky and very difficult instead of being confident that he could have the job done quicker then expected.

 

That's a big thing with contractors and when your getting estimates, it's not always best to go with the quickest or cheapest, it's best to go with the one who demonstrates that they understand the job the best and know what they are doing. I can already picture the first guy coming in and running into a whole bunch of problems that he never anticipated from the start.

 

I thought the same thing with Kim that she subconsciously hung up and did it because she is looking to get out of working for the bank. It's not what she wants to do and she knows she is in way over her head doing it by herself. A bigger firm is needed. She may also feel torn about getting out of it because of how she got the deal away fro. HHM and what that did to Chuck. She could have always given it back to HHM or gotten help from them if it wasnt for what Jimmy did and what happened to Chuck.

 

The scene in the bathroom was also good showing how the 2 of them are dealing with Chucks death. Howard is a mess because he believes it was him trying to push Chuck out that caused Chuck to start the fire, and yet Jimmy is feeling great knowing what he has done to Chuck and that he can push the blame off to someone else in his own mind. I also feel that recently we have seen Jimmy subtly going back and forth between wanting to be good (Jimmy) and going back to bad (Saul). I think that the beat down by the teens was pushing him to think that maybe he was getting too old to be a con like he was before and was wanting to try and stay Jimmy. But after seeing Howard and how much of a mess he was even with help from a therapist, it pushed him to think therapy isnt going to help and he decides to keep doing what he has been doing.

 

From the previews (and reading the guide preview for next weeks episode) I'm thinking what may push him over the edge is that he believes when his suspension is over, he is teaming back up with Kim and they will start what will become a great law firm, but Kim will end up squashing those dreams and not want to team up with him. She could decided to go back to being a public defender and try to help others and could also say something like she cant risk her career being tied to someone who has been suspended for unethical behaviour.

[row_33]

1 hour ago, apuszczalowski said:

I think the reason for Mike not going with the 1st Engineer he had in was because he seemed too confident in what they were proposing and so sure it could be done earlier then expected. Mike knew it was a huge job and would be riskier and tougher then this guy believed. And this is just something I also thought could have been a reason, he came in using laser distance measurers and a laptop. Mike is oldschool and could also see the lasers as not being as accurate, and computers as not being as secure for a job this secret. The second guy took out an actual tape measure and other testing tools, and calculated things out on paper in his book. He then told him all the risks and issues he would be dealing with to do a job on that scale. He told him and Gus it can be done, but it's going to be dangerous, risky and very difficult instead of being confident that he could have the job done quicker then expected.

 

That's a big thing with contractors and when your getting estimates, it's not always best to go with the quickest or cheapest, it's best to go with the one who demonstrates that they understand the job the best and know what they are doing. I can already picture the first guy coming in and running into a whole bunch of problems that he never anticipated from the start.

 

I thought the same thing with Kim that she subconsciously hung up and did it because she is looking to get out of working for the bank. It's not what she wants to do and she knows she is in way over her head doing it by herself. A bigger firm is needed. She may also feel torn about getting out of it because of how she got the deal away fro. HHM and what that did to Chuck. She could have always given it back to HHM or gotten help from them if it wasnt for what Jimmy did and what happened to Chuck.

 

The scene in the bathroom was also good showing how the 2 of them are dealing with Chucks death. Howard is a mess because he believes it was him trying to push Chuck out that caused Chuck to start the fire, and yet Jimmy is feeling great knowing what he has done to Chuck and that he can push the blame off to someone else in his own mind. I also feel that recently we have seen Jimmy subtly going back and forth between wanting to be good (Jimmy) and going back to bad (Saul). I think that the beat down by the teens was pushing him to think that maybe he was getting too old to be a con like he was before and was wanting to try and stay Jimmy. But after seeing Howard and how much of a mess he was even with help from a therapist, it pushed him to think therapy isnt going to help and he decides to keep doing what he has been doing.

 

From the previews (and reading the guide preview for next weeks episode) I'm thinking what may push him over the edge is that he believes when his suspension is over, he is teaming back up with Kim and they will start what will become a great law firm, but Kim will end up squashing those dreams and not want to team up with him. She could decided to go back to being a public defender and try to help others and could also say something like she cant risk her career being tied to someone who has been suspended for unethical behaviour.

 

 

Mike knew there was no way to properly estimate that job going ZIP ZIP ZIP with a laser pointer and a computer and saying "7 months no sweat"

 

that's wisdom, which usually intersects properly with "old school"

 

French vs. German thinking.... just sayin'...... 

 

 

 

 

Howard could be having a lousy quarter with trials and cases on his plate, possibly some of it is Chuck as well

 

good shot from the toilet's view of Jimmy tearing up his shrink's card.

 

 

[Fadingpain]

Ultimately, the bathroom scene exists to further in Jimmy's mind the notion that seeing a shrink is not going to help him, and that in turn is going to push him down the path to becoming Saul.  Along with other stuff.  

 

Jimmy is still in total denial regarding his brother's death.  I think he will confront the issue at some point, and when he does, he will suffer greatly, much more so than Howard's insomnia. 

 

No doubt the very different approaches of the 2 architects were important, but don't underestimate the fact that the first guy is bragging about a previous job, presumably an illegal one, and giving enough info. to connect him with it.

 

Mike and Gus are both way too competent, thorough, and cautious to hire him with the risk that he would tell others about the existence of the meth lab project.

 

I was just thinking: the glove that was left by the burglar on the Hummel shelf is presumably still sitting there, waiting for it to be discovered on a future episode.  I wonder what will be done with that.

 

BTW:  The German architect is a real German actor fairly popular on German TV.  Nice that they got a guy who can actually speak German.  

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 4, 2018 by Fadingpain

[row_33]

12 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

 

 

 

BTW:  The German architect is a real German actor fairly popular on German TV.  Nice that they got a guy who can actually speak German.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

Bathroom suicide guy wasn't a real German?

[apuszczalowski]

32 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

Ultimately, the bathroom scene exists to further in Jimmy's mind the notion that seeing a shrink is not going to help him, and that in turn is going to push him down the path to becoming Saul.  Along with other stuff.  

 

Jimmy is still in total denial regarding his brother's death.  I think he will confront the issue at some point, and when he does, he will suffer greatly, much more so than Howard's insomnia. 

 

No doubt the very different approaches of the 2 architects were important, but don't underestimate the fact that the first guy is bragging about a previous job, presumably an illegal one, and giving enough info. to connect him with it.

 

Mike and Gus are both way too competent, thorough, and cautious to hire him with the risk that he would tell others about the existence of the meth lab project.

 

I was just thinking: the glove that was left by the burglar on the Hummel shelf is presumably still sitting there, waiting for it to be discovered on a future episode.  I wonder what will be done with that.

 

BTW:  The German architect is a real German actor fairly popular on German TV.  Nice that they got a guy who can actually speak German.  

 

 

 

 

 

Good point about the bragging over the tunnel. I think it goes along with the other points that the guy was too overconfident in how he could get it done quicker then expected.

 

I think the Howard issue has more to do with Chucks death then work load. He has always seemed to be together and fine before, and that was with Chick not working so it's not like he is picking up extra workload. Chucks death is weighing on him cause he has been lead to believe he pushed him over the edge.

 

As for Jimmy, I dont think he is in denial, I just think inside he just doesnt care after what he had  seen through with Chuck and how Chick felt of him and I think that helps him be a sleazy lawyer in the future. He was able to push any emotions or belief in his head that he was to blame onto Howard.

 

Is the glove still there or did he grab it when he left the office? I thought the guy who stole the figure saw it sitting there.

[DC Tom]

3 hours ago, apuszczalowski said:

The scene in the bathroom was also good showing how the 2 of them are dealing with Chucks death. Howard is a mess because he believes it was him trying to push Chuck out that caused Chuck to start the fire, and yet Jimmy is feeling great knowing what he has done to Chuck and that he can push the blame off to someone else in his own mind. I also feel that recently we have seen Jimmy subtly going back and forth between wanting to be good (Jimmy) and going back to bad (Saul).

 

When Kim is working and he's walking out to sell phones on the street, and he just tosses over his shoulder a casual "'S'all good..." to her...

 

Little throwaway line with great big implications.  I expect, when the show ends, that'll be the point we'll look back on and say "That's where they started on their respective trajectories."

2 hours ago, row_33 said:

 

 

Mike knew there was no way to properly estimate that job going ZIP ZIP ZIP with a laser pointer and a computer and saying "7 months no sweat"

 

that's wisdom, which usually intersects properly with "old school"

 

French vs. German thinking.... just sayin'...... 

 

 

 

 

Howard could be having a lousy quarter with trials and cases on his plate, possibly some of it is Chuck as well

 

good shot from the toilet's view of Jimmy tearing up his shrink's card.

 

 

 

Wasn't Mike's decision.  Gus was listening in, somewhere out of site in the room, and called Mike to tell him "no go."

 

I don't think Gus cared about the high-tech approach, given that he's contracting to build a high-tech underground meth lab.  And it wasn't Mike's decision.  So it was very likely the architect's cavalier attitude towards the difficulty, or his mention of a previous project, which Gus definitely would dislike.

[row_33]

It’s a 7 hour drive from Denver to ABQ,  better pee now.

 

 

[Soda Popinski]

As someone who never watched BB, I assume there were lots of tidbits in this episode that relate to that show.   Good episode.    This has been a good season so far.   

 

 

At the beginning though?     have no earthly idea what was going on there.  That was IMO probably the last scene of the show before they end it??   He's loaded up with money and skipping town, and has someone who is going to answer a phone at a predetermined time and place for what end?  

 

Edited September 6, 2018 by Soda Popinski

[apuszczalowski]

4 hours ago, row_33 said:

It’s a 7 hour drive from Denver to ABQ,  better pee now.

 

 

Was that where they had the guys fly in to be picked up? I didnt pay attention to the signs at the airport in the begining

[eball]

1 hour ago, Soda Popinski said:

As someone who never watched BB, I assume there were lots of tidbits in this episode that relate to that show.   Good episode.    This has been a good season so far.   

 

 

At the beginning though?     have no earthly idea what was going on there.  That was IMO probably the last scene of the show before they end it??   He's loaded up with money and skipping town, and has someone who is going to answer a phone at a predetermined time and place for what end?  

 

 

The beginning scene is a scene we never saw from BB -- Jimmy/Saul is calling the "cleaner" to be whisked away to a new life/identity.

[shrader]

1 hour ago, Soda Popinski said:

As someone who never watched BB, I assume there were lots of tidbits in this episode that relate to that show.   Good episode.    This has been a good season so far.   

 

 

At the beginning though?     have no earthly idea what was going on there.  That was IMO probably the last scene of the show before they end it??   He's loaded up with money and skipping town, and has someone who is going to answer a phone at a predetermined time and place for what end?  

 

 

The phone call bit was interesting.  Did he mention a timeframe for when that call would be made?