assessing TD by position

[Justice]

Then he inhereted Flutie & Johnson as well. Remove them from your grades.

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Okay, I did, it's still a D- though because DB is a D- QB. All of those guys are the same.

[todd]

And you might want to include STs in your assessment, not just kickers & punters. McGee grades out as an A+, for sure.

 

I may disagree with you, but I'm enjoying this thread and how you're looking at each position.

[Justice]

please give me the names of 20 rosters in their entirety that you would swap straight up for the Bills roster, counting everything. Name 20 teams, that you honestly say, i would rather have all these guys and their history and their contracts and their ages and their talent, instead of the Bills. Very few, dave mcbride being the only one that actually was willing to do it.

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First off, I didn't know having the 12th best roster in the NFL was the standard of excellence and also, I can't name 20 other rosters I would swap for the Bills' roster.

 

PHI, PIT and NE are the only rosters that are definately better than the Bills based on last year. If it wasn't for our 0-4 start who knows what could've happened, And then again, we did lose to Pittsburgh's scrubs at home to stop us from going to the playoffs.

[Justice]

BTW. These scores are adjustable. Time will tell. TD has one more draft coming up and the rest of this offseason. Present players can also boost the grade. Evans can get the score of receiver up to a B if he breaks 1000 yards and scores another 10 TD's this year. We still need the #3 receiver though, to get it up to a A. QB has the most room for improvement and I'm confident JPL will get that grade up. The OL makes me nervous. I see no hope at that position. Let's pray that TD lands a jem in the draft.

[Justice]

And you might want to include STs in your assessment, not just kickers & punters. McGee grades out as an A+, for sure.

 

I may disagree with you, but I'm enjoying this thread and how you're looking at each position.

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You got me curious. How will you grade TD's free agent signees and drafts?

[BillsNYC]

Also, take into account the present players.

 

TD had Moulds, Price, and Reed....he didn't need to use first rounders in the draft on WR's until this past year because we were strong there.

[Justice]

Also, take into account the present players.

 

TD had Moulds, Price, and Reed....he didn't need to use first rounders in the draft on WR's until this past year because we were strong there.

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Good point, but none the less , the guys he did bring in (Aiken, Wright, Shaw, J.Reed and Smith) all suck.

[BillsNYC]

Good point, but none the less , the guys he did bring in (Aiken, Wright, Shaw, J.Reed and Smith) all suck.

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Smith is only going into his second year, and I think Aiken/Reed have one last chance to show their stuff.

 

Don't forget of all those guys, only Reed was a higher pick.

[Justice]

Don't forget of all those guys, only Reed was a higher pick.

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See, that's were you got it wrong. In order to be the top dog GM you have to get some steals in the mid to late rounds of the draft. It shouldn't matter if it was high or low. this is based on the talent overall. I stress overall.

[todd]

You got me curious. How will you grade TD's free agent signees and drafts?

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I don't think you can look at this in a vacum. It's like chanrging someone for speeding even though they were on the way to the hospital with their pregnant wife. Cant' do that. You have to look at choices.

 

I'd say the first two years he did very well. Considering when he inherited the team and the Bills were double-digits over the cap with only 34 players signed, he did a great job getting us out of that mess in two years. Very good. He even managed to sign Moulds, which was a major, major coup. Getting TH in the second round was wonderful. Clements in the first round was great.

 

Given that, I'll use your system.

 

QB - C+

RJ over Flutie. As much as I hate Flutie, he was better than RJ.

Getting Drew gave us instant credibility to a team that was horrible. Recognizing that last year was the time to draft a QB was very smart, given this year's QB crop in the draft and FA.

 

RB - B+

TH and WM, and don't forget Shelton

Henry is the definition of 2nd round value.

McGahee was a gutsy pick that is paying off. Shelton was a phenominal FA pickup, and blocked like a madman last year.

 

WR - B

Moulds, Reed, Aiken, Smith, Shaw, Jett, Wright, Smith and Evans.

Donahoe made a decision to keep Moulds, which paid off. Evans was quite good as a rook. Reed was good as a rook, but I don't feel he's lived up to his potential. The grade is based on Moulds and Evans.

 

OL - B-

MW, CV, TT, JJ, Ross Tucker, Lawrence Smith, Mike Pucillo, M. Price, Ben Sobieski and Dylan McFarland.

JJ was a great value pick. MW played very well last year despite his slow start. I like watching him nail people. I think CV is darn good. Teague is a decent center.

 

TE - C+

Mark Campbell, Euhus, Moore, Nuefeld

I like Campbell. He can long snap, and is versatile. Ehus and Nuefeld are both decent prospects. Moore was a good FA pickup. Campbell was worth a 4th rounder, given his production.

 

DL - A

Aaron Schobel, Sam Adams, Ryan Denney, Chris Kelsay, Justin Bannon Ron Edwards & Tim Anderson

Wonder why this defense has been ranked #2 in the NFL the past few years? Starts here. Good depth, good rotation, and good starters. Schobel is a great find in the 2nd round.

 

LB - A+

Spikes, Fletcher, Posey, Stamer, Crowell & Haggan

These guys flat out play. Truly the elite of the NFL.

 

DB - B

Milloy, Clements, Vincent, McGee, Thomas, Baker, Greer, Wire, PP, Raion Hill

Milloy was a great signing. Vincent's ability to play safety and CB is valuable. Wire is a good athlete, but gets paid way too much $$ and I feel he's reached his potential. Clements is obviously a great pick.

 

K - D

Lindell & Hollis

I really dislike Lindell. D+ is generous, IMHO.

 

P - A+

Moorman

 

ST - A+

McGee, etc.

No way you can't give this amazing group a great grade.

 

Overall

B+

[ajzepp]

I don't think you can look at this in a vacum. It's like chanrging someone for speeding even though they were on the way to the hospital with their pregnant wife. Cant' do that. You have to look at choices.

 

I'd say the first two years he did very well. Considering when he inherited the team and the Bills were double-digits over the cap with only 34 players signed, he did a great job getting us out of that mess in two years. Very good. He even managed to sign Moulds, which was a major, major coup. Getting TH in the second round was wonderful. Clements in the first round was great.

 

Given that, I'll use your system.

 

QB - C+

RJ over Flutie. As much as I hate Flutie, he was better than RJ.

Getting Drew gave us instant credibility to a team that was horrible. Recognizing that last year was the time to draft a QB was very smart, given this year's QB crop in the draft and FA.

 

RB - B+

TH and WM, and don't forget Shelton

Henry is the definition of 2nd round value.

McGahee was a gutsy pick that is paying off. Shelton was a phenominal FA pickup, and blocked like a madman last year.

 

WR - B

Moulds, Reed, Aiken, Smith, Shaw, Jett, Wright, Smith and Evans.

Donahoe made a decision to keep Moulds, which paid off. Evans was quite good as a rook. Reed was good as a rook, but I don't feel he's lived up to his potential. The grade is based on Moulds and Evans.

 

OL - B-

MW, CV, TT, JJ, Ross Tucker, Lawrence Smith, Mike Pucillo, M. Price, Ben Sobieski and Dylan McFarland.

JJ was a great value pick. MW played very well last year despite his slow start. I like watching him nail people. I think CV is darn good. Teague is a decent center.

 

TE - C+

Mark Campbell, Euhus, Moore, Nuefeld

I like Campbell. He can long snap, and is versatile. Ehus and Nuefeld are both decent prospects. Moore was a good FA pickup. Campbell was worth a 4th rounder, given his production.

 

DL - A

Aaron Schobel, Sam Adams, Ryan Denney, Chris Kelsay, Justin Bannon Ron Edwards & Tim Anderson

Wonder why this defense has been ranked #2 in the NFL the past few years? Starts here. Good depth, good rotation, and good starters. Schobel is a great find in the 2nd round.

 

LB - A+

Spikes, Fletcher, Posey, Stamer, Crowell & Haggan

These guys flat out play. Truly the elite of the NFL.

 

DB - B

Milloy, Clements, Vincent, McGee, Thomas, Baker, Greer, Wire, PP, Raion Hill

Milloy was a great signing. Vincent's ability to play safety and CB is valuable. Wire is a good athlete, but gets paid way too much $$ and I feel he's reached his potential. Clements is obviously a great pick.

 

K - D

Lindell & Hollis

I really dislike Lindell. D+ is generous, IMHO.

 

P - A+

Moorman

 

ST - A+

McGee, etc.

No way you can't give this amazing group a great grade.

 

Overall

B+

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I think that's a more reasonable assessment. There is no unit on this team that deserves a 'D', bro. You can hack on the Oline all ya want, but the fact is that they put Travis over 1300 twice, and sprung McGahee over 1100 in only 3/4 of a season.

[jester43]

Okay, I did, it's still a D- though because DB is a D- QB. All of those guys are the same.

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bledsoe was not a d- ....a c maybe, but no worse.

 

and i think you grade the LBs too high. the word is out: you can run on this group. and i think they will be EXPOSED this year without williams plugging the middle for them.

[R. Rich]

OL - B-

MW, CV, TT, JJ, Ross Tucker, Lawrence Smith, Mike Pucillo, M. Price, Ben Sobieski and Dylan McFarland.

JJ was a great value pick. MW played very well last year despite his slow start. I like watching him nail people. I think CV is darn good. Teague is a decent center.

278073[/snapback]

 

 

A little too high, in my opinion. I'd probably rate it a C or C-. Big Mike is developing, but not near where he should be. Teague improved, but still struggles against bull rushers. Villarrial is very sound. McFarland wasn't given a real shot yet, so it's tough to evaluate him. Sobieski? An enigma. Price looks good at times (filling in on the right side) and then looks awful (when asked to take over for an injured Jonas Jennings).

 

Everything considered, I'd give them a C, probably.

[Justice]

I don't think you can look at this in a vacum. It's like chanrging someone for speeding even though they were on the way to the hospital with their pregnant wife. Cant' do that. You have to look at choices.

 

I'd say the first two years he did very well. Considering when he inherited the team and the Bills were double-digits over the cap with only 34 players signed, he did a great job getting us out of that mess in two years. Very good. He even managed to sign Moulds, which was a major, major coup. Getting TH in the second round was wonderful. Clements in the first round was great.

 

Given that, I'll use your system.

 

QB - C+

RJ over Flutie. As much as I hate Flutie, he was better than RJ.

Getting Drew gave us instant credibility to a team that was horrible. Recognizing that last year was the time to draft a QB was very smart, given this year's QB crop in the draft and FA.

 

RB - B+

TH and WM, and don't forget Shelton

Henry is the definition of 2nd round value.

McGahee was a gutsy pick that is paying off. Shelton was a phenominal FA pickup, and blocked like a madman last year.

 

WR - B

Moulds, Reed, Aiken, Smith, Shaw, Jett, Wright, Smith and Evans.

Donahoe made a decision to keep Moulds, which paid off. Evans was quite good as a rook. Reed was good as a rook, but I don't feel he's lived up to his potential. The grade is based on Moulds and Evans.

 

OL - B-

MW, CV, TT, JJ, Ross Tucker, Lawrence Smith, Mike Pucillo, M. Price, Ben Sobieski and Dylan McFarland.

JJ was a great value pick. MW played very well last year despite his slow start. I like watching him nail people. I think CV is darn good. Teague is a decent center.

 

TE - C+

Mark Campbell, Euhus, Moore, Nuefeld

I like Campbell. He can long snap, and is versatile. Ehus and Nuefeld are both decent prospects. Moore was a good FA pickup. Campbell was worth a 4th rounder, given his production.

 

DL - A

Aaron Schobel, Sam Adams, Ryan Denney, Chris Kelsay, Justin Bannon Ron Edwards & Tim Anderson

Wonder why this defense has been ranked #2 in the NFL the past few years? Starts here. Good depth, good rotation, and good starters. Schobel is a great find in the 2nd round.

 

LB - A+

Spikes, Fletcher, Posey, Stamer, Crowell & Haggan

These guys flat out play. Truly the elite of the NFL.

 

DB - B

Milloy, Clements, Vincent, McGee, Thomas, Baker, Greer, Wire, PP, Raion Hill

Milloy was a great signing. Vincent's ability to play safety and CB is valuable. Wire is a good athlete, but gets paid way too much $$ and I feel he's reached his potential. Clements is obviously a great pick.

 

K - D

Lindell & Hollis

I really dislike Lindell. D+ is generous, IMHO.

 

P - A+

Moorman

 

ST - A+

McGee, etc.

No way you can't give this amazing group a great grade.

 

Overall

B+

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One would think a B+ group can make it to the playoffs at least once! The proof is in the pudding, my friend.

[Justice]

Damn, were actually talkin' some Buffalo Bills football here.

[R. Rich]

Damn, were actually talkin' some Buffalo Bills football here.  

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You're not one of those anti-OT purists, are you? Those arguments get tiresome.

[ajzepp]

One would think a B+ group can make it to the playoffs at least once! The proof is in the pudding, my friend.

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Not if they didn't become a B+ group until after going 0-4, bro.........again, some of you guys are not taking into account the whole picture. This team came together last year after the disappointing start. They needed time to learn how to play together and how to win. We were a better team by game 8 than we were for game 1.

[todd]

One would think a B+ group can make it to the playoffs at least once! The proof is in the pudding, my friend.

278087[/snapback]

 

You do realize that I'm grading the present team. There's no way this team could have made the playoffs the first two years TD was here. See the difference?

[R. Rich]

Not if they didn't become a B+ group until after going 0-4, bro.........again, some of you guys are not taking into account the whole picture. This team came together last year after the disappointing start. They needed time to learn how to play together and how to win. We were a better team by game 8 than we were for game 1.

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The "whole picture" also includes a beating we took AT HOME to a team that rested most of its starters. To say that everything was fine after going 0-4 is not realistic. As I said many times before, even if we were to get into the playoffs by winning that game, our weaknesses were exposed. I like the progress we made, but it wasn't enough. We're on the right track, though.

[Justice]

You're not one of those anti-OT purists, are you?  Those arguments get tiresome.

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No I'm not. I rather enjoy OT's when there isn't anything Bills related to talk about.