Just Joshin' Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 16 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: I would actually be surprised if he was straight up released with nothing in return. He’s cheap depth if nothing else. But not surprised at all if he was moved out for a draft pick. Seems simple - not sure why some want to cut him outright.
Bring it Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 On 6/20/2018 at 10:48 AM, HappyDays said: When's the last time we had a GM who came right out and said this player isn't performing as well as we expect and he needs to do better? It's so refreshing. It’s nice to see for sure! Lawson better not take any plays off or he is toast.
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 (edited) 19 minutes ago, BillsGuru4 said: I was a fan of the pick, I’m very sad it’s not working out and am willing to give another year to make sure. It’s nice that we don’t need to depend on him Then delegate him shovelling snow at NEF before home games. Have to get something useful / dependable out of him. (Do that, and irony says he reinjures the shoulder shovelling the snow.) Edited July 28, 2018 by Ridgewaycynic2013
Aussie Joe Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 (edited) 47 minutes ago, billsfan89 said: It also goes to show that your pick could be rated as an A by all the prognosticators and be a bust. I am not willing to write Shaq of just because 2-3 days into training camp he isn't dominating, in 10 games last season Shaq had 4 sacks that is roughly 6.5 if he played the entire 16 games, which for a player in his second year coming off of an injury isn't that bad. Toss in the fact that he graded out decently against the run and I think you can have some hope for him. I think this idea of Shaq being toast at the moment is premature, certainly a make or break camp/pre-season but nothing so far to me indicates he is a goner just yet too early to tell in my opinion. I completely agree with your first point. It does reinforce that the Draft is a crap shoot a lot of the time.. I also want them to give him this year to turn it around as I don’t think they will get much for him in a trade ( a conditional 6th maybe ?) and I would rather they just persevere and hope he comes good..Not confident at this stage though of him being here in 2019.. Edited July 28, 2018 by Aussie Joe
billsfan89 Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Aussie Joe said: I completely agree with your first point. It does reinforce that the Draft is a crap shoot a lot of the time.. I also want them to give him this year to turn it around as I don’t think they will get much for him in a trade ( a conditional 6th maybe ?) and I would rather they just persevere and hope he comes good..Not confident at this stage though of him being here in 2019.. I think with Shaq it also depends who else is behind him and how well are they performing? If Shaq isn't fetching anything significant out on the trade market then why not keep him if no one else behind him is lighting it up. However, if you really like a player behind him why not just get what you can or cut Shaq? Still way too early to tell on him. Edited July 28, 2018 by billsfan89
MiltonWaddams Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 24 minutes ago, billsfan89 said: I think with Shaq it also depends who else is behind him and how well are they performing? If Shaq isn't fetching anything significant out on the trade market then why not keep him if no one else behind him is lighting it up. However, if you really like a player behind him why not just get what you can or cut Shaq? Still way too early to tell on him. I think that by season 3, you have a good idea on what a player is or is not capable of. The reports (multiple) out of TC have him getting manhandled by second rate o-linemen. I would not think that a positive thing in a prove-it year. I don't know if Fede or Owa offer much more than he does, but in year 3, it's really a case of if they offer any more it's still more. I wish he was more than he is....I just don't think he is.
YoloinOhio Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 1 hour ago, Bring it said: It’s nice to see for sure! Lawson better not take any plays off or he is toast. McD called him out a bit today, too. Not just previous regime guys - he also called out his own guy, Zay, yesterday.
billsredneck1 Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 I hope he stays one more year rotating with Trent and possibly kicking him inside if need be. I'd hate to see him given away and then the injury bug hits. He is still on a rookie contract. I wouldn't get stupid here.
Uncle Joe Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 (edited) At this juncture I think he is a tweener. Somewhere between a DE and LB. IIRC sly Rex originally thought he could make him an OLB. After Rex he moved back to DE. Apparently he's not big/strong enough for DE or fast enough for LB. I was hoping the weight loss might give him an edge so to speak. Hopefully he can a least be decent depth this year. Edited July 28, 2018 by Uncle Joe
Estelle Getty Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 Wasn't he pretty damn good against the run last year and had a couple of sacks? Why does everyone want to get rid of him so bad?
GunnerBill Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said: McD called him out a bit today, too. Not just previous regime guys - he also called out his own guy, Zay, yesterday. Yep. The way they talked about Zay yesterday (I know this is a Shaq thread) I don't think they are seeing him as any more than one of the guys in a competition for a spot. KB and JK may be pencilled in on the roster but Zay is not. 1
Augie Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: Yep. The way they talked about Zay yesterday (I know this is a Shaq thread) I don't think they are seeing him as any more than one of the guys in a competition for a spot. KB and JK may be pencilled in on the roster but Zay is not. No free rides, best man wins. I like it!
YoloinOhio Posted July 28, 2018 Posted July 28, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: Yep. The way they talked about Zay yesterday (I know this is a Shaq thread) I don't think they are seeing him as any more than one of the guys in a competition for a spot. KB and JK may be pencilled in on the roster but Zay is not. Sadly, I agree. Rooting for the kid to turn a corner, but he has an uphill battle despite when and where he was drafted. Edited July 28, 2018 by YoloinOhio
MAJBobby Posted July 29, 2018 Posted July 29, 2018 (edited) If they can deal him for a Real off the ball SLB I would be all for it. And get Lorax back to ST and spot Pass Rush only. Edited July 29, 2018 by MAJBobby 1
Buffalo Barbarian Posted July 29, 2018 Posted July 29, 2018 (edited) See ya Shaq, hope you can get us a third. maybe some 34 team would like him . Edited July 29, 2018 by Buffalo Barbarian
billsfan89 Posted July 29, 2018 Posted July 29, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, MiltonWaddams said: I think that by season 3, you have a good idea on what a player is or is not capable of. The reports (multiple) out of TC have him getting manhandled by second rate o-linemen. I would not think that a positive thing in a prove-it year. I don't know if Fede or Owa offer much more than he does, but in year 3, it's really a case of if they offer any more it's still more. I wish he was more than he is....I just don't think he is. We have had 2 days of practice in pads, even if a guy isn't looking all that good there is plenty more camp and pre-season left to go. Shaq looked Ok in year 2 in real action against real pros. I think it is possible he plays better as camp progresses. Some players take some time to settle into camp. Then again it is possible Shaq just can't hack it. My overall point was that the sample size is just too small. Edited July 29, 2018 by billsfan89
John from Riverside Posted July 29, 2018 Posted July 29, 2018 54 minutes ago, billsfan89 said: We have had 2 days of practice in pads, even if a guy isn't looking all that good there is plenty more camp and pre-season left to go. Shaq looked Ok in year 2 in real action against real pros. I think it is possible he plays better as camp progresses. Some players take some time to settle into camp. Then again it is possible Shaq just can't hack it. My overall point was that the sample size is just too small. I dont know At what point does a high first round pick DE actually show that he can play better then undrafted free agents? I root for him.....but I just have this bad feeling now that they have a guy in front of him in the line up in Murphy 1
BADOLBILZ Posted July 29, 2018 Posted July 29, 2018 9 hours ago, Joe Miner said: How's Paxton Lynch doing? That was Badols guy Nailed it again ? Jack was bpa by a lot when the Bills took Lawson.........and as it turns out the knee hasn't prevented him from being an impact player on a rising power in the AFC. I never said Lynch was any franchise lock or even a remotely sure bet, it wasn't a deep year for QB prospects.......but I have a simple philosophy: If you simply always take the best QB available at that point in round 1 you will eventually win the draft process. HOF lock QB's like Brees, Rodgers and a SB MVP like Flacco and a dozen mehs and duds.........or who the Bills actually got in those droughty drafts? The answer is pretty simple. QB is so exponentially more valuable than any other position that you take the QB. The Bills even hit on picks like Gilmore, Dareus and Watkins and still all they have to show for those 17 years of regular top half of the draft first round picks are Shaq and Tre White. That's almost unbelievable. Simply atrocious. Meanwhile the aforementioned Drew Brees(drafted after year 1 of the Bills drought) and Aaron Rodgers were carrying otherwise dubiously managed organizations like Nola and GB to SB victories and general performance well above the level of their rosters. The Bills.......they couldn't have done any worse if they put up Kipers top 30 available at that point every year and had Jeff Littman make the pick. Before McD or even Saban were talking about "the process" I was selling the idea on TSW that the draft is "a process" and not just an annual event. If you have a sound philosophy and stick by it you will come out ahead in the long run. If you treat the draft like an annual hole-patching event.....as the Bills have for most of their existence......you will come out behind in the long run. 1
Joe Miner Posted July 29, 2018 Posted July 29, 2018 15 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: ? Jack was bpa by a lot when the Bills took Lawson.........and as it turns out the knee hasn't prevented him from being an impact player on a rising power in the AFC. I never said Lynch was any franchise lock or even a remotely sure bet, it wasn't a deep year for QB prospects.......but I have a simple philosophy: If you simply always take the best QB available at that point in round 1 you will eventually win the draft process. HOF lock QB's like Brees, Rodgers and a SB MVP like Flacco and a dozen mehs and duds.........or who the Bills actually got in those droughty drafts? The answer is pretty simple. QB is so exponentially more valuable than any other position that you take the QB. The Bills even hit on picks like Gilmore, Dareus and Watkins and still all they have to show for those 17 years of regular top half of the draft first round picks are Shaq and Tre White. That's almost unbelievable. Simply atrocious. Meanwhile the aforementioned Drew Brees(drafted after year 1 of the Bills drought) and Aaron Rodgers were carrying otherwise dubiously managed organizations like Nola and GB to SB victories and general performance well above the level of their rosters. The Bills.......they couldn't have done any worse if they put up Kipers top 30 available at that point every year and had Jeff Littman make the pick. Before McD or even Saban were talking about "the process" I was selling the idea on TSW that the draft is "a process" and not just an annual event. If you have a sound philosophy and stick by it you will come out ahead in the long run. If you treat the draft like an annual hole-patching event.....as the Bills have for most of their existence......you will come out behind in the long run. Some people can just admit they were wrong. Narcissist.
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