BADOLBILZ Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 On 6/22/2018 at 8:31 AM, thebandit27 said: In 2017, Ragland had 44 total tackles (31 solo) and 4 TFLs in 10 starts with no sacks, turnovers forced, or passes defensed. I wouldn't call that a solid season, let alone a "very solid" one. Take it a step further and consider that he had 8 solo tackles and 3 TFLs in one game against Buffalo, and another 8 solo tackles and 1 TFL the following week against the Giants, and you're talking about a guy that basically had 2 good back-to-back games in the middle of a season full of nondescript play. EDIT: I should note that I don't say that to knock Rags; a guy his size coming off of an ACL tear has a long way to go. I simply mean to point out that his 2017 campaign didn't exactly make Beane look foolish. Exactly. Regardless of him becoming a serviceable LB in the KC scheme......one of the major issues with the Ragnuts selection even at the time was the poor positional value. It's not like the Bills gave up on a CB or a DE or.........well pretty much ANY other position. Every year that 2 down or 2.5 down MLB position can be filled dirt cheap in FA. This wasn't news when they drafted him but Rex had to have his ol' fashion LB.
John from Riverside Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 5 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: Exactly. Regardless of him becoming a serviceable LB in the KC scheme......one of the major issues with the Ragnuts selection even at the time was the poor positional value. It's not like the Bills gave up on a CB or a DE or.........well pretty much ANY other position. Every year that 2 down or 2.5 down MLB position can be filled dirt cheap in FA. This wasn't news when they drafted him but Rex had to have his ol' fashion LB. He was looking for that ILB the jets had that was very good for years.......I cant fault that..... The problem was.....Rex was not long for this team so picks that fit his defense all had to be retrofitted..... Edmunds looks much more like the player that fits a fast athletic D that can cover people.
thebandit27 Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 8 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: He was looking for that ILB the jets had that was very good for years.......I cant fault that..... The problem was.....Rex was not long for this team so picks that fit his defense all had to be retrofitted..... Edmunds looks much more like the player that fits a fast athletic D that can cover people. The issue is that most teams can find themselves a 2-down 'backer that can adequately thump against the run in the mid to late rounds or late in FA. As for Edmunds, he's a different discussion IMO. With him, you're talking about a guy that has the potential to be a perennial all-pro and a big-time impact defender in every phase of the defense (run stopping, pass rushing, coverage, communication, etc.).
Royale with Cheese Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 52 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: The issue is that most teams can find themselves a 2-down 'backer that can adequately thump against the run in the mid to late rounds or late in FA. As for Edmunds, he's a different discussion IMO. With him, you're talking about a guy that has the potential to be a perennial all-pro and a big-time impact defender in every phase of the defense (run stopping, pass rushing, coverage, communication, etc.). I thought about this the other day. What if Edmunds continues to grow physically? He's only 20 now I believe and long....could fill out and get a little thicker. If he gets up to that 260-265 range, do we keep him at MLB? 1
wppete Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 Yeah I can easily see him t 260lbs in a couple of years from now. I think they will use him at MLB and also come off the edge. It will be fun to see how mcDermott and Frazier use him.
Soda Popinski Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 Just now, Royale with Cheese said: I thought about this the other day. What if Edmunds continues to grow physically? He's only 20 now I believe and long....could fill out and get a little thicker. If he gets up to that 260-265 range, do we keep him at MLB? I hope he stays in the 250-255 range, with that 4.5 speed he'll be devastating against the run and in coverage on those TEs. We finally have a LB who is capable of running with Gronk I hope we don't move him over to pass rusher or something like that. I do think as a situational zone blitzer, he could be an absolute beast, but the hole moving would create wouldn't be worth it IMO.
Royale with Cheese Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 Just now, Soda Popinski said: I hope he stays in the 250-255 range, with that 4.5 speed he'll be devastating against the run and in coverage on those TEs. We finally have a LB who is capable of running with Gronk I hope we don't move him over to pass rusher or something like that. I do think as a situational zone blitzer, he could be an absolute beast, but the hole moving would create wouldn't be worth it IMO. I thought maybe if he gets to that 260+ range, with his athleticism and speed.....pass rushing DE?
Soda Popinski Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 Just now, Royale with Cheese said: I thought maybe if he gets to that 260+ range, with his athleticism and speed.....pass rushing DE? I think he could make that transition pretty easily. Definitely something he could do. I just would rather have him at MLB. I think once he gets his bearings he could be one of the best MLBs in football. At DE, he's just another pass rusher. Might be better for his wallet though.
Royale with Cheese Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, Soda Popinski said: I think he could make that transition pretty easily. Definitely something he could do. I just would rather have him at MLB. I think once he gets his bearings he could be one of the best MLBs in football. At DE, he's just another pass rusher. Might be better for his wallet though. Yeah I'd like to keep him at MLB too....just had that thought of what if he does get a lot thicker. What if he grows to be 6"8 and 270 lbs? Match him up against Lebron on the hardwood?
Soda Popinski Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 Just now, Royale with Cheese said: Yeah I'd like to keep him at MLB too....just had that thought of what if he does get a lot thicker. What if he grows to be 6"8 and 270 lbs? Match him up against Lebron on the hardwood? I don't know how these kids keep growing, didn't Allen grow from 6'2 his freshman year of college to 6'5 his senior year? I hope the boy goes through another spurt, he needs to grow to about 6'5, it'll make getting him into college a lot easier.
Royale with Cheese Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Soda Popinski said: I don't know how these kids keep growing, didn't Allen grow from 6'2 his freshman year of college to 6'5 his senior year? I hope the boy goes through another spurt, he needs to grow to about 6'5, it'll make getting him into college a lot easier. I think David Robinson grew like 6 inches in the NAVY.
thebandit27 Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 18 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said: I thought about this the other day. What if Edmunds continues to grow physically? He's only 20 now I believe and long....could fill out and get a little thicker. If he gets up to that 260-265 range, do we keep him at MLB? It's entirely possible that he'll end up in the 260+ range. I think his versatility is what makes him so special. You can move him around and do whatever you like positionally. The most important thing will be how quickly he can learn the game and how to cut down steps on the field so that he can play in every situation.
Royale with Cheese Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 1 minute ago, thebandit27 said: It's entirely possible that he'll end up in the 260+ range. I think his versatility is what makes him so special. You can move him around and do whatever you like positionally. The most important thing will be how quickly he can learn the game and how to cut down steps on the field so that he can play in every situation. With his speed and athleticism....not to mention his long arms....I think defensive end would be an easy transition for him.
thebandit27 Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 4 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said: With his speed and athleticism....not to mention his long arms....I think defensive end would be an easy transition for him. I think you'll see him deployed as an EDGE guy at least some of the time as a rookie; he was a very effective in generating pressure both as a straight EDGE rusher and as a blitzer at Va Tech. I think the reason that MLB is seen as his most valuable position is that it allows him to contribute in every possible way. Run D, pass rusher, blitzer, zone defender, QB spy, man coverage, etc. The fact that the defensive communication would be funneled through him is a huge factor as well. Like I said though: put him anywhere and everywhere.
Royale with Cheese Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: I think you'll see him deployed as an EDGE guy at least some of the time as a rookie; he was a very effective in generating pressure both as a straight EDGE rusher and as a blitzer at Va Tech. I think the reason that MLB is seen as his most valuable position is that it allows him to contribute in every possible way. Run D, pass rusher, blitzer, zone defender, QB spy, man coverage, etc. The fact that the defensive communication would be funneled through him is a huge factor as well. Like I said though: put him anywhere and everywhere. How did this guy fall to #16?
Mr. WEO Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 17 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said: I think David Robinson grew like 6 inches in the NAVY. No comment on his thickness?
thebandit27 Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said: How did this guy fall to #16? Not sure...if I had to guess, I would say that it was a mixture of positional value taking precedence (vis a vis 4 QBs going in the top 10) and teams not being excited about drafting a 19-year old kid.
Royale with Cheese Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said: No comment on his thickness? He got thicker....much thicker. I was in awe.
Mr. WEO Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said: He got thicker....much thicker. I was in awe. And all the Seamen...
Royale with Cheese Posted June 25, 2018 Posted June 25, 2018 13 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: Not sure...if I had to guess, I would say that it was a mixture of positional value taking precedence (vis a vis 4 QBs going in the top 10) and teams not being excited about drafting a 19-year old kid. Did you have him above Roquan Smith? Lorax was on WGR a few days after the draft and he mentioned that McDermott/Beane had Edmunds above Smith.
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