oldmanfan Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 I have said several times here Sullivan and Gleason were and are good writers. I liked much of Sully's stuff, particularly his stuff on his golf pursuits, some of his Olympics and college material. Gleason when not writing about the Bills or Sabres was frequently very good. I like Wawrow's work. My criticism of Sullivan and Gleason is that they would frequently get overly snarky and resort to personal attacks when writing about the Bills and Sabres. I have no problem with negative takes; God knows both teams have earned that. I just don't think that type of writing was professional; guys like Felser were critical without resorting to that. For some reason these guys and other reporters get very nasty if someone challenges them. Sullivan used to write his question and answer column and would just get over the top if anyone differed with him. Graham is another guy. A very good writer, some of his stuff brings tears to your eyes. But he wrote an article about EJ once where he told EJ to his face he thought he wasn't good, made himself the story in my opinion. When I emailed to offer my view he got really nasty and insulting. Others here have mentioned the Twitter feeds from these guys get insulting (I don't do Twitter). And I think if you look at jw's posts here he has also been pretty nasty (and I have in response and likely should not have). Why is it this attitude appears so prevalent? Why not write tough, critical work without the insults, and carry on reasonable dialog and debate? 1 1
plenzmd1 Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 15 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: The narrative that people anyone in the local media are "out to get" the Bills or Sabres is wrong and that's the fuel for the grave dancing, IMO. 1 I think this misses the point entirely..forget whether someone was out to get the Bills or not, it comes down to whether the customers wanted to read these guys and were willing to PAY to read these guys. I think the BN said our business is better without these folks, plain and simple. You can cry to the heavens they were good journalists and should not have been let go, but seems the BN made a business decision. In all honesty..did you pay the money for a subscription? It is much like Fox News...you can agree or disagree with guys like Hannity and Carlson..but damn, they bring in viewers and advertisers..Buck and Sully doing the opposite.
IDBillzFan Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 9 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said: Ask yourself if it's worth it. LA did not.........he bickered on the same premise you are........"I don't care who you are".......TG and Lori then left and LA and a few others got called out for it.........LA got defensive and has dedicated his TSW life to bringing to light the crimes of Tim Graham. But yes I was joking.......that's what the laughing emoji was for.......everybody knows LA is a total Tim Graham-hate-fueled nut job. Sometimes you're more unhinged than Richie Incognito in a weight room. Please do this: Count all my posts at TSW in the past five years, then count how many of them were hate-fueled Tim Graham posts. Show everybody how I have dedicated my TSW time to everything Tim Graham. Do it. And when you're done, come back here with your evidence and I'll accept your apology for lying.
Delete This Account Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 3 minutes ago, LABillzFan said: Sometimes you're more unhinged than Richie Incognito in a weight room. Please do this: Count all my posts at TSW in the past five years, then count how many of them were hate-fueled Tim Graham posts. Show everybody how I have dedicated my TSW time to everything Tim Graham. Do it. And when you're done, come back here with your evidence and I'll accept your apology for lying. Now this thread is finally getting interesting. ? jw 1
BADOLBILZ Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 17 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: I have said several times here Sullivan and Gleason were and are good writers. I liked much of Sully's stuff, particularly his stuff on his golf pursuits, some of his Olympics and college material. Gleason when not writing about the Bills or Sabres was frequently very good. I like Wawrow's work. My criticism of Sullivan and Gleason is that they would frequently get overly snarky and resort to personal attacks when writing about the Bills and Sabres. I have no problem with negative takes; God knows both teams have earned that. I just don't think that type of writing was professional; guys like Felser were critical without resorting to that. For some reason these guys and other reporters get very nasty if someone challenges them. Sullivan used to write his question and answer column and would just get over the top if anyone differed with him. Graham is another guy. A very good writer, some of his stuff brings tears to your eyes. But he wrote an article about EJ once where he told EJ to his face he thought he wasn't good, made himself the story in my opinion. When I emailed to offer my view he got really nasty and insulting. Others here have mentioned the Twitter feeds from these guys get insulting (I don't do Twitter). And I think if you look at jw's posts here he has also been pretty nasty (and I have in response and likely should not have). Why is it this attitude appears so prevalent? Why not write tough, critical work without the insults, and carry on reasonable dialog and debate? "Life is a comedy for those that think.........and a tragedy for those who feel" - PTR If EJ was in the NYC market he would have laughed it off because you know you aren't going to be coddled there. I heard James Harden the other night getting called out for going 0-11 from three and rather than being mad about it he was self deprecating. That's how you diffuse that type of criticism. Not getting mad about people pointing out that you aren't performing to the level necessary. Criticism for poor play is part of the fat paycheck and fame/privilege provided.
Peter Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) 56 minutes ago, john wawrow said: what are you, nuts. i'm not going to share with you what i know based on personal conversations i've had that will remain personal. you make some baseless claim. are called out for it. and now it's on me to provide proof. how about you provide proof that these nda's actually exist. you're wrong. deal with it. jw Your reading comprehension apparently is not as good as I would have thought. Apparently, you skipped over the part where I wrote: "I know you will not [tell us how much they were paid]." I also have a very hard time believing that, in your "personal conversations" with Sully/Bucky, the subject of an NDA was among the things you discussed or that you went over clauses relating to non disparagement etc. Which part of my claims are baseless: That I respect you? That you and Vic and Tim are worlds better than these two guys? That Sully and Bucky have a deep personal disdain for the Pegulas? That employment separation agreements typically include a waiver of claims and an NDA or some sort of non disparagement? That Bucky and Harrington were inconsistent in the way that they portrayed the buyouts (Bucky tried to make it sound like it was all his idea)? That no one circles the wagons like Buffalo sports media when one of their own is criticized? That I hope Sully and Bucky gain some perspective from all that has happened and use that perspective if and when they ever have an opportunity to write articles and will not be so quick to incessantly and overly criticize with the maximum amount of snark? Edited May 31, 2018 by Peter 1
BADOLBILZ Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 11 minutes ago, LABillzFan said: Sometimes you're more unhinged than Richie Incognito in a weight room. Please do this: Count all my posts at TSW in the past five years, then count how many of them were hate-fueled Tim Graham posts. Show everybody how I have dedicated my TSW time to everything Tim Graham. Do it. And when you're done, come back here with your evidence and I'll accept your apology for lying. Every single one starts with it in your avatar. It's just an entirely weird thing to obsess on. Everyone knows it but you apparently.
IDBillzFan Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 Just now, john wawrow said: Now this thread is finally getting interesting. ? jw It is, but it won't last long. Here's how it will go: He'll explain how he doesn't need to prove anything, and then reference how I argued with TG in a thread years ago that led to TG leaving TBD. I'll post the thread he's referencing...a thread I literally did not post in...and he'll say it doesn't matter, he knows what he knows. Then he'll call me names and take shots at me personally about something that he remembers back when Shout! was still in print. This thread will be closed. He'll come back to a different thread and explain how everyone is ruining TBD. 1
oldmanfan Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 You are missing the point. Deliberately or not I'm not sure. My point is the reporter to me made himself the story. And when I challenged him in it he got really insulting and nasty. Why is it the reporters can't just write without making it personal? It happens too often these days, and didn't when I was younger.
K-9 Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 5 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: Every single one starts with it in your avatar. It's just an entirely weird thing to obsess on. Everyone knows it but you apparently. I knew it, you HATE the letter B!
BADOLBILZ Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 16 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said: I think this misses the point entirely..forget whether someone was out to get the Bills or not, it comes down to whether the customers wanted to read these guys and were willing to PAY to read these guys. I think the BN said our business is better without these folks, plain and simple. You can cry to the heavens they were good journalists and should not have been let go, but seems the BN made a business decision. In all honesty..did you pay the money for a subscription? It is much like Fox News...you can agree or disagree with guys like Hannity and Carlson..but damn, they bring in viewers and advertisers..Buck and Sully doing the opposite. I think it's more about the indifference created by unending failure of the organization to field ANYTHING CLOSE to a championship contender IMO. Fox News deals with contenders. That's why that model works. Expectations are so low in Bills Country that sweating the details has no appeal to anyone. The amount of Sully haters is the same. They won by attrition. If the team gets competitive again it should re-ignite the competitive spark in fans that makes critical "we can do better" pieces appealing. It will just be a different person writing the column. It sells in competitive markets and always will. So if you don't like it.........root for continued losing and mediocrity like 7-9 win seasons and more of the same from the Sabres. Hopefully our new QB and defensemen excel and help keep you guys miserable.
Cripple Creek Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 13 minutes ago, LABillzFan said: It is, but it won't last long. Here's how it will go: He'll explain how he doesn't need to prove anything, and then reference how I argued with TG in a thread years ago that led to TG leaving TBD. I'll post the thread he's referencing...a thread I literally did not post in...and he'll say it doesn't matter, he knows what he knows. Then he'll call me names and take shots at me personally about something that he remembers back when Shout! was still in print. This thread will be closed. He'll come back to a different thread and explain how everyone is ruining TBD. Quoted for truth though you did leave out the bluster and drooling. 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 1 hour ago, Commonsense said: That’s what’s great about TBD, there is balance. Everyone serves a purpose. If you take out all the posters who second guess OBD what do you then have? It’s a safe bet that BN will be looking to hire someone that is less willing to rock the boat. It’s entertainment for us fans on and off the field, I don’t need the Pegula’s being praised for every decision to continue being a fan. I could be mistaken, but I don't think TBN will be hiring right now. I think the option of accepting "buy outs" is being offered to cut "headcount" permanently.
Lurker Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said: I could be mistaken, but I don't think TBN will be hiring right now. I think the option of accepting "buy outs" is being offered to cut "headcount" permanently. I suspect they'll add one columnist to replace two...
May Day 10 Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 54 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: It was a reactionary question. The media........and subsequently the fanbase........was getting the run-around that week. It was ridiculous. Try pulling that off in markets just 300-400 miles east of here. We were getting the run-around for almost 20 years, with the Bills' poor moves and . When the Pegulas purchased the team, Sullivan and Gleason were on point to ask about hiring a team president. Instead they stuck with the people in place, and predictably, the franchise hit a series of embarrassing icebergs. Same thing with the Sabres. Pegula came in and resisted change and bringing in experience. Retained management and only started to make changes when fan and media pressure became too much (and even then they made a botch of it). There has been a series of awful moves there. As a result, we have a few inexperienced management teams for each franchise, with Terry and Kim firmly involved, to the point that Terry is helping assess quarterbacks and Kim is President of both teams. If this structure works out.... great. If not, I don't want another move bypassing experience in upper management. I would like critical voices in the media calling them out on it. Because they obviously want to be deeply involved and hands on with these teams, I just hope that the Pegulas' influence and power isnt becoming too strong and will be above criticism (or at least will have the ability to avoid a lot of it locally). They neutered WGR when they brought the Bills broadcasting rights over. 1270 the Fan hasnt been able to get the listener base to maintain a radio show. I wonder how much they have to do with these moves at TBN. It would probably be pretty easy to tilt their business decisions with financial investment or patronage. 1
CardinalScotts Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 On 5/25/2018 at 11:38 AM, BADOLBILZ said: I never liked Bucky's work but man what a disgusting **** show the last 15 years......and truthfully MOST of Ralph's ownership was. Some things needed to be said. for sure but was doesnt need to be said is Lumping in the new regime with the old ones...but they do. Completely unprofessional and unfair 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 7 minutes ago, Lurker said: I suspect they'll add one columnist to replace two... I think they'll add zero columnists. From what has been published about their union agreement, I would think the reporters who accepted being "downsized" would have a grievance if TBN hired new reporters or columnists.
BADOLBILZ Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 21 minutes ago, LABillzFan said: It is, but it won't last long. Here's how it will go: He'll explain how he doesn't need to prove anything, and then reference how I argued with TG in a thread years ago that led to TG leaving TBD. I'll post the thread he's referencing...a thread I literally did not post in...and he'll say it doesn't matter, he knows what he knows. Then he'll call me names and take shots at me personally about something that he remembers back when Shout! was still in print. This thread will be closed. He'll come back to a different thread and explain how everyone is ruining TBD. I don't bash this forum. Individual posters, absolutely. We can be better but it's a great forum and I am not passive about expressing that. You've just consistently been on the wrong side of right here.........you were one of the original DOOOOOOOMED posters back in the early 2000's when you shouted down anyone who was concerned about the direction of the organization.........which then eroded into a team that missed the playoffs for 17 years. I called you out for your irrational takes then. I do it now. You've earned it.
Bill from NYC Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I could be mistaken, but I don't think TBN will be hiring right now. I think the option of accepting "buy outs" is being offered to cut "headcount" permanently. I wish they would hire Badol to report on the Bills and provide an in depth, knowledgeable, accurate, honest, intricate analysis for all things Buffalo Bills because that is exactly what he has done here for decades. Nobody is ever 100% accurate but my experience on TSW (also 2 decades) tells me that if you disagree with Badol about football matters, chances are you are going to be wrong. Nick Saban however might be able to teach him a thing or 2. 3 1
Lurker Posted May 31, 2018 Posted May 31, 2018 Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said: I think they'll add zero columnists. From what has been published about their union agreement, I would think the reporters who accepted being "downsized" would have a grievance if they hired new reporters or columnists. Not at all. The BN saves money from a 2-for-1 hire, so there's nothing the Guild can grieve...
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