Brian Daboll’s Temper

[Kelly the Dog]

7 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Come on...he put upTeddy Bridgewater numbers in his second year

 Colt McCoy is short and has a rag arm.  The double whammy. Granted, his arm isn't Kellen Moore weak but it's close. Probably the Nathan Peterman level, which equates to not nearly good enough. Why anyone with a paying job in the NFL thinks Colt McCoy can ever succeed is beyond me. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

10 hours ago, Ol Dirty B said:

I'm not really surprised. He wasn't molded by, but he worked under Saban.

 

Aside: I haven't had my morning coffee. 

I initially read this as "he worked under Satan", which I immediately assigned a football association as "oh, he means Belichick"

 

Dear Buffalo Bills: Just Win, Please!

 

 

8 hours ago, Drunken Pygmy Goat said:

"I expect perfection. I know that's not possible all the time, but I think we need to all hold ourselves to a high standard of really setting the tone and expecting the highest detail and the highest execution from all of ourselves."

 

Not making any comparisons here, but this reminded me of old quote from Vince Lombardi. Something like "We strive for perfection. Nobody's perfect, but in the pursuit of perfection, you can achieve excellence".

 

Lombardi certainly was a fiery coach. Maybe Daboll was being too hard in the moment, but it was Cold McCoy for Pete's sake, and it was the Browns...not exactly you known for their high structure characteristics. McDermott is all about accountabilty, but is also very structured. I'm sure if Daboll were to get "out of line" a bit, McDermott would be in his ear. And I'm sure Daboll has learned a lot from mistakes over the years. 

 

This is the real question.  He went into the NFL, and while it may not have been all on him, when he served as OC his offenses were terrible. 

That was 6 years ago and he didn't have Jimmy Garappolo or Derek Carr to work with.  In theory, he could have learned a lot in the ensuing time, both in terms of how to treat people, develop a QB, and manage an offense.

 

Or not.   It may not be his intention, but if that sort of thing is part of his DNA as a coach, it is a concern when Allen struggles and does bonehead things, will it come out.

[BigBuff423]

What is equally interesting in this Daboll discussion is where I read on Twitter (and it was from a reputable source, but I cannot recall which one) a couple days ago that Daboll and Saban had it out over starting Tua. From what I could infer from reading the bit, Daboll wanted to get Tua as the starting QB in November when the Offense hit a lull and pointed to his ability to actually pass the ball. Saban resisted and it became a point again in the National Title game obviously. But, that to me means Daboll recognized the need to move on and fought Saban to do so, which also means his assessment probably played a role in getting Tua in the game in the title game. 

[stevewin]

12 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

If it were about Josh Rosen they would report he is uncoachable.

If it were about Josh Allen they would report he was inaccurate

[Sky Diver]

1 hour ago, BigBuff423 said:

What is equally interesting in this Daboll discussion is where I read on Twitter (and it was from a reputable source, but I cannot recall which one) a couple days ago that Daboll and Saban had it out over starting Tua. From what I could infer from reading the bit, Daboll wanted to get Tua as the starting QB in November when the Offense hit a lull and pointed to his ability to actually pass the ball. Saban resisted and it became a point again in the National Title game obviously. But, that to me means Daboll recognized the need to move on and fought Saban to do so, which also means his assessment probably played a role in getting Tua in the game in the title game. 

 

He was right too. Tua should have been starting, based on talent anyway. Maybe Saban thought it would affect team chemistry?

[BigBuff423]

11 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

 

He was right too. Tua should have been starting, based on talent anyway. Maybe Saban thought it would affect team chemistry?

 

I'm not sure what the reasoning was of course, but it's pretty evident that Tua was more prepared than Saban gave him credit for, with the outcome of the NT game now known to us. Regardless, for me what was enlightening was that Daboll recognized this in November and stumped for Tua to be the starter or at least to play much more than he did leading into that game. Which, shows me he can recognize how a player's ability can translate to the field without needing proof of it beforehand. Also, it tells me Daboll is willing to be vocal about his convictions regardless of who the coach is - since Saban's legacy is all but written as one of the greatest college coaches of all time. That takes a set....to do that. Go toe to toe with one of the greatest and essentially tell him, you're missing an opportunity here....bottom line for me: more confidence in Daboll since there's no way to think his lobbying for Tua didn't AT LEAST play a part in Saban's decision to let Tua start the second half of that game. 

 

I found it on Twitter, it was a screen shot by Cover1 regarding a write up, but that write up is missing the article link and / or author. However, Cover1 doesn't essentially quote people without proper linking or credit given:

 

 

 

Edited May 17, 2018 by BigBuff423

[Sky Diver]

10 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

 

I'm not sure what the reasoning was of course, but it's pretty evident that Tua was more prepared than Saban gave him credit for, with the outcome of the NT game now known to us. Regardless, for me what was enlightening was that Daboll recognized this in November and stumped for Tua to be the starter or at least to play much more than he did leading into that game. Which, shows me he can recognize how a player's ability can translate to the field without needing proof of it beforehand. Also, it tells me Daboll is willing to be vocal about his convictions regardless of who the coach is - since Saban's legacy is all but written as one of the greatest college coaches of all time. That takes a set....to do that. Go toe to toe with one of the greatest and essentially tell him, you're missing an opportunity here....bottom line for me: more confidence in Daboll since there's no way to think his lobbying for Tua didn't AT LEAST play a part in Saban's decision to let Tua start the second half of that game. 

 

I found it on Twitter, it was a screen shot by Cover1 regarding a write up, but that write up is missing the article link and / or author. However, Cover1 doesn't essentially quote people without proper linking or credit given. 

 

Mac Jones out played Hurts in the A-Day game. Hurts is a great kid and an excellent runner, but he isn't a pocket passer. He would be better served to change positions since there is no way he will make it to the NFL as a QB. Tua lit it up every time he got into a game. The kid is a phenom.

 

 

Edited May 17, 2018 by Sky Diver

[Drunken Pygmy Goat]

3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

This is the real question.  He went into the NFL, and while it may not have been all on him, when he served as OC his offenses were terrible. 

That was 6 years ago and he didn't have Jimmy Garappolo or Derek Carr to work with.  In theory, he could have learned a lot in the ensuing time, both in terms of how to treat people, develop a QB, and manage an offense.

 

Or not.   It may not be his intention, but if that sort of thing is part of his DNA as a coach, it is a concern when Allen struggles and does bonehead things, will it come out.

 

It's the NFL. Guys need to have thicker skin, and understand that they won't be coddled. 

 

Mike Singletary wasn't a big fan of Buddy Ryan at first. As a young player, he was constantly in Mike's ear and on his back, and it rubbed him the wrong way. It wasn't something that he was accustomed to in college. But Buddy took him aside one day and said "son, you're going to be great". Once he did that, Mike fully understood why Buddy was being so hard on him, and it changed his mentality, and his opinion of Buddy. 

 

All coaches have their own way of "treating" players. It's their way of "pushing" a player to do better. But they all have the same goal. They all want to win, and they have the players' best interests in mind. Sometimes, tough love is best. A person might not see it that way initially, but they'll look back one day and realize it was needed at the time, and that they're better now for it, not just in football, but in life. 

 

Talent alone isn't the difference between being good and being great. It's how an individual responds to someone pushing them. What doesn't kill you, makes you stronger. The way McCoy and the players around him responded to Daboll in that instance didn't make them stronger at all. It showed weakness. Maybe Daboll was being harder than he needed to be in the moment, but it's probably more of a reflection of his competetive nature. If Allen isn't able to see that in the instances where Daboll, or anyone, is hard on him, his fate will be the same of all the players before him that had all the talent in the world that never elevated to higher levels, due to having thin skin and lack the drive to be the best. Given his background, and being told "no" throughout his playing career, I think he'll be fine in that regard, but we'll see.

Edited May 17, 2018 by Drunken Pygmy Goat

[dave mcbride]

15 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

 

Have you tracked his whereabouts during the JFK assasination?

I'm not sure of your point -- although I suspect the source of your attempted joke lies in the fact that you seem to think that any non-laudatory comment about anyone with a connection to Alabama is in reality a slight against the school, the region, and the Christian Lord above himself (a trait that is -- to be frank -- pretty tiresome). Perhaps I'm being unfair. Anyway, I'm simply stating that Daboll  has been involved in the soap opera-level Pats drama for literally years and years, which I find ... interesting.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

49 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

 

Mac Jones out played Hurts in the A-Day game. Hurts is a great kid and an excellent runner, but he isn't a pocket passer. He would be better served to change positions since there is no way he will make it to the NFL as a QB. Tua lit it up every time he got into a game. The kid is a phenom.

 

 

Someone posted a film clip of Daboll working with Tua and Hurts during a 'bama practice and you could see it there.

 

Hurts: ducks

Tua: sweet, tight spirals thrown with "zip" on them

22 minutes ago, Drunken Pygmy Goat said:

It's the NFL. Guys need to have thicker skin, and understand that they won't be coddled.

 

And if they don't have "thicker skin" and the coach's method of "not coddling" them is ripping them apart, they should, what, just GTFO?

 

I'm not saying Colt would have been "all that" with a different coaching style, I'm just saying:

1) if your teammates can hear the coach screaming at you in the huddle when you're trying to call the next play, it's gone too far.

2) there's something to the viewpoint that if a coach isn't "reaching" a player with one approach, perhaps another approach needs to be tried

 

 

[purple haze]

16 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

 

...LMAO...shades of Holler Kollar................

Yeah, I'm not saying they don't go over the top at times, but it truly is a thing that players can't be worrying about.  Coaches will yell, some more than others.  ??‍♂️

[Jauronimo]

Daboll reportedly told McCoy "I hate your face.  Change your face!" and became enraged when McCoy came back to the sideline after going 3 and out with the same face.  I can't blame him. 

 

 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

22 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Does one have to delineate all the ways in which the NFL has different performance requirements and different desired outcomes than Army basic training?

Or can you think of say, 5 or 10 for yourself?

Although I do see your point, I would think that the truth in the Daboll / McCoy matter lies somewhere between each side's perception of the lecture / tirade.  Where I erred was not reading the facts of the event more completely.  No matter what the actual facts, (Coach Daboll is a meanie, or McCoy has an easily bruised ego, or a bit of both) I do understand your concern regarding how he'll relate to players on the Bills.  After all, this is Head Coach McDermott's 'process', not Wrecks' foosball and pool table players lounge.  Then again, when some defensive player has McCoy (or Allen) at the bottom of a gang tackle and is questioning his mother's sexual preferences, I hope McCoy (or Allen) isn't too upset over that.  

Edited May 18, 2018 by Ridgewaycynic2013

[Chicken Boo]

Gut feeling - this guy is gonna suck.

 

It's not good to be head-strong when you have yet to experience any success at the NFL level.  

 

*This is more insight as to why Rosen wasn't their guy.

[Sky Diver]

There have been how many players that have praised Daboll and how may have said something negative about him?

 

Even McCoy thanked him in another interview.

 

I think Daboll is the least of our issues.

Maybe McCoy was so thick that the only way to get through to him was yelling. None of us were there.

[CommonCents]

13 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

Daboll reportedly told McCoy "I hate your face.  Change your face!" and became enraged when McCoy came back to the sideline after going 3 and out with the same face.  I can't blame him. 

 

 

My Precious!!!!!!

[3rdand12]

15 hours ago, Drunken Pygmy Goat said:

"I expect perfection. I know that's not possible all the time, but I think we need to all hold ourselves to a high standard of really setting the tone and expecting the highest detail and the highest execution from all of ourselves."

 

Not making any comparisons here, but this reminded me of old quote from Vince Lombardi. Something like "We strive for perfection. Nobody's perfect, but in the pursuit of perfection, you can achieve excellence".

 

Lombardi certainly was a fiery coach. Maybe Daboll was being too hard in the moment, but it was Cold McCoy for Pete's sake, and it was the Browns...not exactly you known for their high structure characteristics. McDermott is all about accountabilty, but is also very structured. I'm sure if Daboll were to get "out of line" a bit, McDermott would be in his ear. And I'm sure Daboll has learned a lot from mistakes over the years. 

Thats the thing i am focused upon with the hire.

He has learned a ton. Some of his teachers were at the top of the grade. and he has surely seen what does Not work as well..
 

 I became a fan just before he was a Bills OC. and then right after as plenty of information was being shared once he was hired.

we shall is fair,

 I am betting the over .lol

5 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

 

He was right too. Tua should have been starting, based on talent anyway. Maybe Saban thought it would affect team chemistry?

My understanding. limited as it is , was that Saban did not want to switch to a passing game. and why Tua was not really an option.

 How Daboll convinced him is likely a good story. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

5 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

There have been how many players that have praised Daboll and how may have said something negative about him?

 

Even McCoy thanked him in another interview.

 

I think Daboll is the least of our issues.

Maybe McCoy was so thick that the only way to get through to him was yelling. None of us were there.

 

 

...perhaps safe to say McD is pretty demanding?......he knows what he wants and what he expects......contrarians are gone.......maybe that's why he wanted McDaboll, a demanding firebrand in a world of divas.......keep in mind that Management 101 stipulates that a manager who attempts to use power and intimidation (ie. yelling, screaming, etc) to cover up for his knowledge/shortcomings of the position are quickly exposed....have fired some in my day for that EXACT reason (ie. paper tigers who knew  jack)....subordinates quickly know you do not know your craft as professed......so we'll see where Daboll lands.....

[Sky Diver]

Much ado about nothing, imo. It’s a long off season.

[ColoradoBills]

This thread is about something that happened almost 10 years ago when Daboll was 34.

I can not predict what kind of OC he will be for the Bill's but I am willing to wait until at least October to start judging.

 

I know, I'm boring about things like this.  LOL