The Now Moment Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 3 minutes ago, PeterGriffin said: FWIW at the 2005 combine, Sproles 5'6" 187 lbs put up 225 lbs 23 times and ran a 4.48 40. Remember Joe Morris, 5'7" 195 lbs, he benched 420 lbs and squatted 700 lbs. http://www.espn.com/nfl/playoffs2008/columns/story?columnist=garber_greg&id=3819466 Sorry but no woman is ever playing in the NFL I refuse to say something will "never" happen. Sorry if that upsets you but I think if a woman really wanted to play, they could do it.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, bobobonators said: Haha. Lets break this down bc it really shouldnt be THIS complicated. Are there fast women in this world? Yes. Are there big women in this world? Yes. Are there strong women in this world? Yes. Now that those disclaimers are out of the way lets stop the nonsense. Some of the fastest women in the history of the world (Jeter, Jones, Joyner) have weighed between 128lbs and 150. Yes theyre fast. We’re talking about all-time fast. How strong are they? How big are they? A 128lb woman would DIE on a football field. Name me a single NFL player that weighs less than 150 (including kickers). Those sizes could only be used at WR or maybe CB. LB’s or safeties that weigh 220lbs+ would obliterate them. Lets go on opposite side of spectrum. Lets find a woman that is 6’5 and weighs 250. Can that woman run a 4.6 40? Can she put up 225lbs 20+ times? Haha speaking as the parent of a female athletic teen, a lot of guys got it all mixed on what athletic women really weigh. Muscle takes up less space than fat. Most top HS basketball or volleyball teams have a girl who is 5'11-6'1 and able to muscle in under the basket. College, add 3' - a top women's college team most of the women are 6'0 and up, with at least one who is 6'4"-6'5". I don't think you find many male safeties that are 6'5" and weigh 250 lb. Top safety in this draft 6'2" 215 lb. Fitzpatrick, 6'0", 204. Drop down in the lower rounds, got some guys 5'10", 198 lbs and they were probably working hard to stay there. Overall your point that NFL athletes are at the top of the top is right on. There have been successful players (Jim Leonhard comes to mind) who aren't as physically elite, and make up for it with brains and game savvy. Do I think there are probably a few female athletes who are big, strong, fast and could slot in there and compete? Probably. Usually, they channel their love of sports into soccer, volleyball, basketball etc where there are more opportunities for women, so chances are we'll never know.
Big Gun Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 6 minutes ago, Buffalo30 said: I refuse to say something will "never" happen. Sorry if that upsets you but I think if a woman really wanted to play, they could do it. Nope not happening!
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 13 minutes ago, Commonsense said: If Brienne of Tarth can’t do it, no woman can. Brienne would kick butt and take names as a LB 1
The Now Moment Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 3 minutes ago, PeterGriffin said: Nope not happening! Cool man, I like to be more open-minded and not say someone can't do something. Have a good one.
bobobonators Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 (edited) 16 minutes ago, PeterGriffin said: FWIW at the 2005 combine, Sproles 5'6" 187 lbs put up 225 lbs 23 times and ran a 4.48 40. Remember Joe Morris, 5'7" 195 lbs, he benched 420 lbs and squatted 700 lbs. http://www.espn.com/nfl/playoffs2008/columns/story?columnist=garber_greg&id=3819466 Sorry but no woman is ever playing in the NFL Thank you good Sir. People simply seem to forget basic physiological differences between males and females. The ignorance is mind-blowing. “Male athletes have a higher ratio of muscle mass to body weight, which allows for greater speed and acceleration. This explains why female speed records in running and swimming are consistently 10 percent slower than men’s and why, on average, they have two thirds the strength of men. “ The last sentence there is key above all else. Can a woman be fast. Of course. However shes going to be REALLY weak compared to her NFL counterpart of the same size, not even addressing those that are almost twice her size. The NFL isnt like many other sports where a special skill can overcome basic, fundamental physiological differences. The special skills in the NFL (speed, strength, size) are the very things that differentiate males/females physiologically. To argue against that is pretty foolish. There are 3 positions in the NFL that dont focus on those 3 traits: Kicker, Punter, and Quarterback. Like i said, i can see a female kicker/punter. In a world full of unicorns I can also see a female QB if she has a strong enough arm and amazing hand eye coordination/accuracy. But we’re far away from that happening. How many male QB’s have amazing accuracy and decent arm strength and still dont make the NFL: 99% of them dont. Edited May 15, 2018 by bobobonators
bobobonators Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Haha speaking as the parent of a female athletic teen, a lot of guys got it all mixed on what athletic women really weigh. Muscle takes up less space than fat. Most top HS basketball or volleyball teams have a girl who is 5'11-6'1 and able to muscle in under the basket. College, add 3' - a top women's college team most of the women are 6'0 and up, with at least one who is 6'4"-6'5". I don't think you find many male safeties that are 6'5" and weigh 250 lb. Top safety in this draft 6'2" 215 lb. Fitzpatrick, 6'0", 204. Drop down in the lower rounds, got some guys 5'10", 198 lbs and they were probably working hard to stay there. Overall your point that NFL athletes are at the top of the top is right on. There have been successful players (Jim Leonhard comes to mind) who aren't as physically elite, and make up for it with brains and game savvy. Do I think there are probably a few female athletes who are big, strong, fast and could slot in there and compete? Probably. Usually, they channel their love of sports into soccer, volleyball, basketball etc where there are more opportunities for women, so chances are we'll never know. Im not denying females can be large. Its a strength/speed issue. The taller the female the slower she is. Elite Female athletes are already naturally slower than elite male athletes. We’re talking about a league where one to two tenths of a second is the difference between making it and not making it. Also, and above all else, is the stength issue. There are large female athletes for sure. But how strong are they compared to their male counterparts. Thats the key here. Could a 6’5 250lb female take a hit from a 200lb safety? I guess. But she would never be in the league to begin with bc that 6’5 250lb TE female wouldnt be able to run faster than her male counterparts to make that TE spot. Could a 5’9 140lb female be fast enough to play CB/WR/RB. On paper maybe. But in reality she wouldnt be strong enough and weigh enough to absorb the hits she would take. Unfortunately, physiologicaly speaking, women cant be big, strong, and fast all at the same time (strictly at NFL comparison standards of big/strong/fast). Theyre not built that way. If theyre really fast theyre going to be way too small for the NFL to absorb hits. If theyre big (mainly tall enough) theyre going to be way too slow/weak for the NFL.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 8 minutes ago, bobobonators said: “Male athletes have a higher ratio of muscle mass to body weight, which allows for greater speed and acceleration. This explains why female speed records in running and swimming are consistently 10 percent slower than men’s and why, on average, they have two thirds the strength of men. “ The last sentence there is key above all else. Can a woman be fast. Of course. However shes going to be REALLY weak compared to her NFL counterpart of the same size, not even addressing those that are almost twice her size. I really don't want to drop into the quagmire here, but I think you need to pay attention to the words "on average". I mean, just think about it a little bit, someone brought F=ma into it. If women's speed records are 10% slower than men's, how do you think they'd achieve that if those specific women have only 2/3 the strength of men? Feminine wiles or something? 2
Misterbluesky Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 2 hours ago, Boyst62 said: I have and would again. It's even more bizzare wrestling one. It's ridiculous to give less than your best and it's disrespectful to lighten up because she is a woman. Unless she's retarded she knows her risks on the field, it's the same risk anyone takes on the field and it's part of what so many enjoy about the participation in sports; the wide open sheer madness. What weight classes were you in...frosh up until your senior varsity year?
Big Turk Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 1 hour ago, Warcodered said: There shouldn't be a specific rule against it though. If someone is the best person available at a position they should be able to play. If none are able to make it then that's just how it hashes out but anyone should be free to try to make it if they want. They dont need to make a rule against it but it will end badly for this lady. 50 minutes ago, Buffalo30 said: I refuse to say something will "never" happen. Sorry if that upsets you but I think if a woman really wanted to play, they could do it. No they couldn't. Get real.
Warcodered Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 3 minutes ago, matter2003 said: They dont need to make a rule against it but it will end badly for this lady. No they couldn't. Get real. How? Will she not make it or get injured trying? Because those are the same endings for guys when they don't make it.
Big Turk Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 (edited) 50 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Haha speaking as the parent of a female athletic teen, a lot of guys got it all mixed on what athletic women really weigh. Muscle takes up less space than fat. Most top HS basketball or volleyball teams have a girl who is 5'11-6'1 and able to muscle in under the basket. College, add 3' - a top women's college team most of the women are 6'0 and up, with at least one who is 6'4"-6'5". I don't think you find many male safeties that are 6'5" and weigh 250 lb. Top safety in this draft 6'2" 215 lb. Fitzpatrick, 6'0", 204. Drop down in the lower rounds, got some guys 5'10", 198 lbs and they were probably working hard to stay there. Overall your point that NFL athletes are at the top of the top is right on. There have been successful players (Jim Leonhard comes to mind) who aren't as physically elite, and make up for it with brains and game savvy. Do I think there are probably a few female athletes who are big, strong, fast and could slot in there and compete? Probably. Usually, they channel their love of sports into soccer, volleyball, basketball etc where there are more opportunities for women, so chances are we'll never know. And the bottom line is that women CANNOT, I repeat CANNOT put on muscle mass anywhere close to the rate that men cane precisely because they have 10% of the testosterone levels that men do. Its basic science and hormones. If they had a combine for female football players the bench press record for 225lbs would be 1. And that would likely be with a spotter helping them halfway up. 4 minutes ago, Warcodered said: How? Will she not make it or get injured trying? Because those are the same endings for guys when they don't make it. She wouldnt even get a camp invite to the NFL. In college she is going to get hurt pretty quickly. Edited May 15, 2018 by matter2003
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 10 minutes ago, matter2003 said: And the bottom line is that women CANNOT, I repeat CANNOT put on muscle mass anywhere close to the rate that men cane precisely because they have 10% of the testosterone levels that men do. Its basic science and hormones. The issue isn't "rate of muscle mass increase", it's whether one can find elite women athletes who have speed, strength, and size characteristics that overlap those of successful NFL athletes at specific positions. Given what I know about the overlap between the best female athletes and the best male athletes in HS, and what I've seen of professional female athletes, I think it's plausible that one can. Not many, but some. But that doesn't mean we'll see them in the NFL, because, as I said, most of the elite female athletes choose to participate in sports where there are more opportunities for women. As for the young lady in the film clip, I wish her the best, but she would appear to have very long odds. The impact of testosterone on ability to gain muscle strength, when studied, is a little less simplistic than Johnny at the Gym eating his "High T" diet would like to believe.
Lfod Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 (edited) Watched the video. Interesting person for sure. Not going to jump in the debate. If she doesn't make it I do think there is women's football. At least that's what a friend showed me in a video one day. I never knew of it's existence before that day. If you didn't know about this.... You are welcome. Edited May 15, 2018 by Lfod
Big Turk Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 (edited) 57 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: The issue isn't "rate of muscle mass increase", it's whether one can find elite women athletes who have speed, strength, and size characteristics that overlap those of successful NFL athletes at specific positions. Given what I know about the overlap between the best female athletes and the best male athletes in HS, and what I've seen of professional female athletes, I think it's plausible that one can. Not many, but some. But that doesn't mean we'll see them in the NFL, because, as I said, most of the elite female athletes choose to participate in sports where there are more opportunities for women. As for the young lady in the film clip, I wish her the best, but she would appear to have very long odds. The impact of testosterone on ability to gain muscle strength, when studied, is a little less simplistic than Johnny at the Gym eating his "High T" diet would like to believe. Even if this is the case there are two major differences. 1) The amount of muscle mass one can put on is directly porportionate to their frame, ligament/tendon strength, bone density and natural body weight. Men typically have larger frames and higher starting body weights as well as stronger tendons/ligaments and denser bones than women(another effect of Testosterone). Even if women were able to put on the same percentage of muscle mass, the amount of muscle mass would be less simply due to their starting weight being lower. 2) Women naturally have a much higher normal body fat percentage than men. At 15% body fat a woman will look ripped. At the same body fat in a man you will barely see abs. Football players many times are under 10% body fat...a woman would suffer severe physiological consequences if she got this low and could actually die. Edited May 15, 2018 by matter2003
MakeBuffaloGreatAgain Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 have you all seen that transgender(born male) power lifter who dominated womens competition lifting? or how about that transgendered(born male) MMA fighter who is crushing the female competition. Or to reverse, what about that top ranked female swimmer who is transgender and is now a below average male swimmer. NO female athlete could EVER make it in the NFL or even NBA. Maybe Soccer, because they would actually be tougher than their male counter parts.
boyst Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 8 hours ago, Misterbluesky said: What weight classes were you in...frosh up until your senior varsity year? 160, 171, 189, 215 It 2as the lighter weight class, but there was a chick from an inner city school at 275. She was a mauler. Vicious. She would get warnings for hitting and slapping. 9 hours ago, Gugny said: Not sure who taught you how to respect women, but I can tell you this ... they didn't do a good job. Why is that? Sportsmanship is far different than chivalry, bud. I open doors for all my tinder dates, and message them the next day. Respect for women is entirely different. It is disrespectful to treat a woman as anything less than an equal. #metoo
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 Geeze- I’m sure she is the toughest player on any field she steps on.
cba fan Posted May 15, 2018 Posted May 15, 2018 14 hours ago, Misterbluesky said: Would you tackle a woman with all of your might? I would not. Agreed...… then just tackle her like rugby. Don't have to just hit her as hard as you can like many NFL players do, and then watch the ball carrier sometimes bounce off and keep going.
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